California High Speed Rail Thread

[Busy Bee]

SNCF recommended the I-5 because they thought it was the most likely profitable "get in and get out" path of least resistance. I don't think they had a true interest in building a state system that served as many of the population centers as possible. They were also fishing for an operator concession which means whatever can be built fastest is in their financial interest.

[jmecklenborg]

Originally Posted by William Van Alen

It's hard to equate the LA Regional Connector and the Madrid HSR connection.

[...]

Doesn't seem like a fair comparison to me.

I was using obstructionist tactics against him, which I don't sense that he has any acquaintance with.

His emotional push (and the reason why his videos get a fair number of views) is to present himself as an armchair expert above and beyond professional experts. He pretty much just sits there and riffs for a few minutes, with little original research, be it academic or visual, and to my knowledge has not participated in a campaign.

As a veteran of several such campaigns, I can attest that at some point it's the last page of 1984, and you sit there all alone and concede that you love Big Brother. In short, he doesn't get his hands dirty, and as such is able to present his subjects as cute and his remarks as cute.

[William Van Alen]

Originally Posted by jmecklenborg

I was using obstructionist tactics against him, which I don't sense that he has any acquaintance with.

His emotional push (and the reason why his videos get a fair number of views) is to present himself as an armchair expert above and beyond professional experts. He pretty much just sits there and riffs for a few minutes, with little original research, be it academic or visual, and to my knowledge has not participated in a campaign.

As a veteran of several such campaigns, I can attest that at some point it's the last page of 1984, and you sit there all alone and concede that you love Big Brother. In short, he doesn't get his hands dirty, and as such is able to present his subjects as cute and his remarks as cute.

I hear your point, and it's fair enough I guess, but I do think there's value to having an outsider's perspective. Sometimes the most effective advocates are the ones who don't actually work in the industry because they're better at communicating their message and they're not afraid to say things that challenge the status quo.

Anecdotally, I worked at a city government agency in my last job, one which seemed like they were interested in new ideas and wanted me to bring new things to the table since I had previously worked in the private sector. However, every time I brought up a new idea, I was met with the same resistance: "we don't do that here", "that's too complicated", "that's x agency's job, not ours". Some of my ideas were rejected simply because the people who ran my agency didn't personally get along with the people who ran other agencies that we would need to collaborate with. Most of the people I worked with there were too jaded to give a shit, so I left because I felt useless.

I get that the bureaucracy is complicated and that change doesn't happen overnight, but if that's the status quo, then something needs to give. The kind of attitude I encountered is poisonous to good government that can effectively and competently deliver the social environment that allows its people to thrive. If it takes a few armchair experts to push people to put pressure on their leaders to do better, then that's fine by me.

[jmecklenborg]

Originally Posted by William Van Alen

I get that the bureaucracy is complicated and that change doesn't happen overnight, but if that's the status quo, then something needs to give. The kind of attitude I encountered is poisonous to good government that can effectively and competently deliver the social environment that allows its people to thrive. If it takes a few armchair experts to push people to put pressure on their leaders to do better, then that's fine by me.

Actually they do happen overnight. An election is too obvious - sometimes someone who has held a seat for decades suddenly changes their tune, i.e. Henry Waxman.

The other thing I didn't like about the video was the guy's suggestion that upgrading the LOSSAN corridor should have been a priority, while ignoring the fact that the central 50 miles of the corridor, from Burbank to Anaheim, WILL be upgraded as part of CAHSR to electric operation and full grade separation. It then ignores the need for the new tunnel near San Diego or the need for a "base" tunnel outside San Louis Obisco to avoid the bottleneck that exists on the existing switchback:
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Sa...4d-120.6596156

That switchback seems to be what keeps the LOSSAN corridor at its current terminus, and prevents more passenger train usage of the line. There is also a circuitous routing between Salinas and Gilroy that adds at least 15 slow miles as opposed to a tunnel between the two places. There is also potential for the line to travel straight into Silicon Valley via a very long tunnel starting at Santa Cruz, but just imagine the environmentalist freak-out over such a proposal.

[numble]

Originally Posted by Crawford

CAHSR was approved 52-48%. In a state where it's quite easy to add referenda. Which will happen if the first phase disappoints, and elected officials don't push the brakes.

If Fresno-Bakersfield flops, the project is finished.

An April 2022 poll of California voters finds voters support the project at a higher rate than the 2008 ballot measure, even when the question explains the higher costs, timeline, and the initial segment only being from Bakersfield to Merced.

https://escholarship.org/content/qt9...qt903863nm.pdf

In 2008 California voters approved bonds to begin designing and building a high-speed rail system. The original plan called for service to run from San Diego through the Central Valley and up to Sacramento as soon as 2030. But cost estimates for the project have risen since 2008 and officials are now working under a longer timeline, with trains operating only from Bakersfield to Merced in the Central Valley by 2030, and then extending service to the San Francisco Bay Area by 2033. Do you favor or oppose the state continuing to build the high-speed rail project? (Statewide Registered Voters)

Favor strongly: 31%
Favor somewhat: 25%
Oppose somewhat: 10%
Oppose strongly: 25%
No opinion: 9%

[Busy Bee]

Oppose somewhat: 10%
Oppose strongly: 25%

This 30-35% figure shows up repeatedly in political opinion polls. They're the same folks that seem to be okay with fascism.

[MAC123]

Any actual updates anyone?

[ardecila]

Originally Posted by MAC123

Any actual updates anyone?

Most of the construction is in very remote areas, and this is a public works project, not a skyscraper. Progress will be slow and very repetitive - the same bridges and pergola structures repeated tens or hundreds of times, surrounded by endless farm fields.

The best source for updates is Youtube, if you feel like watching long drone flyover videos. There are several Youtubers posting content.

https://www.youtube.com/c/CAHighSpeedRail/videos
https://www.youtube.com/c/DRONEZONEFlyovers/videos
https://www.youtube.com/c/TheFourFoot/videos

As for other aspects of the project like funding or environmental reviews, well, you don't see news very often for those things because they are moving very slowly. Every 6 months or so, they 'clear' another section of the project from environmental review, but they won't start final design or put those sections out to bid until a lot more money is awarded from the Feds.

[MAC123]

Originally Posted by ardecila

Most of the construction is in very remote areas, and this is a public works project, not a skyscraper. Progress will be slow and very repetitive - the same bridges and pergola structures repeated tens or hundreds of times, surrounded by endless farm fields.

The best source for updates is Youtube, if you feel like watching long drone flyover videos. There are several Youtubers posting content.

https://www.youtube.com/c/CAHighSpeedRail/videos
https://www.youtube.com/c/DRONEZONEFlyovers/videos
https://www.youtube.com/c/TheFourFoot/videos

As for other aspects of the project like funding or environmental reviews, well, you don't see news very often for those things because they are moving very slowly. Every 6 months or so, they 'clear' another section of the project from environmental review, but they won't start final design or put those sections out to bid until a lot more money is awarded from the Feds.

Thank you. I'll make sure to check some of those out.

[202_Cyclist]

The opponents of this are going to continue to spread misinformation. Meanwhile, progress is being made building this modern, efficient, infrastructure investment.

Bullet-train route OK’d from San Joaquin Valley to Bay Area. How are wildlife, farms affected?


By Tim Sheehan
April 28, 2022
Fresno Bee

"A proposed route between the San Joaquin Valley and the Bay Area for California’s bullet-train system received final approval Thursday from the California High Speed Rail Authority.

The agency’s board of directors, meeting in Sacramento, voted to certify a massive four-volume report of environmental and social impacts that the route would have on communities, farms, parks and wildlife habitats along the 89-mile stretch of the line from San Jose through Gilroy into Merced County.

That vote set the stage for a second action that formally approved the preferred route, filtered out over a years-long process from among four options involving crossing the Diablo Range via Pacheco Pass west of Los Banos."

https://www.fresnobee.com/news/local...#storylink=cpy

[homebucket]

Among key features of the route are plans for a 13.5-mile tunnel through the mountains north and east of the San Luis Reservoir, and about 15 miles of elevated tracks to carry the high-speed trains above highways on the San Francisco Peninsula and over canals and environmentally sensitive wetlands in the San Joaquin Valley.

Between Gilroy and San Jose, the trains will largely operate on tracks shared with the existing Caltrain commuter rail system.

One unique feature proposed for the route in western Merced County is a 3-mile stretch of low-profile viaduct as the tracks cross through the Grasslands Ecological Area north of Los Banos. That segment would also include some form of enclosure to not only reduce the prospect of noise from trains startling birds and other wildlife as they pass, but also to protect birds from electrocution by alighting on the overhead electrical lines that power the trains.

Among four major alternatives identified by planners since 2009, the chosen option involves the fewest displacements of homes, businesses and farm structures, and would permanently take about 1,033 acres of “important farmland” out of production, mostly in the San Joaquin Valley.

https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/...y-17135152.php

[202_Cyclist]

Will a Cal Train extension from Gilroy to Salinas be feasible once the Central Valley - San Jose high-speed rail segment is built? This would help people commute from Monterey County to jobs in Santa Clara, as well as tie Monterey and Salinas into the high-speed rail system.

[TWAK]

Will Cal Train be going the same speed as the HSR trains?

[202_Cyclist]

High speed rail to provide $423 million for LA Union Station project
Plan will create through tracks at currently stub-ended terminal

Apr. 28, 2022


Image courtesy of Trains magazine.

"LOS ANGELES — The California High-Speed Rail Authority will provide more than $400 million for the project to improve Los Angeles Union Station, a project which will see through tracks for commuter and intercity rail operations created at the current stub-ended station in downtown L.A.

The authority’s board on Wednesday approved the agreement with LA Metro to provide $423.3 million for Phase A of the “Link Union Station” project, with the money coming from Proposition 1A funds approved by voters for the high speed rail system. In a press release, Metro CEO Stephanie Wiggins called the agreement “a key funding milestone for the [high speed rail] bookend project here in Southern California.”

The project will include construction of a two-track viaduct over U.S. Highway 101 adjacent to the station, providing a mainline link to allow through north-south operations [see “Metrolink set to begin work on LA Union Station project,” Trains News Wire, May 1, 2020]. The initial work, modernizing the five-track throat into the station, is targeted for completion in 2023..."

https://www.trains.com/trn/news-revi...ation-project/

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by 202_Cyclist

Will a Cal Train extension from Gilroy to Salinas be feasible once the Central Valley - San Jose high-speed rail segment is built? This would help people commute from Monterey County to jobs in Santa Clara, as well as tie Monterey and Salinas into the high-speed rail system.

I think so. It looks like this is already being planned.

Construction is currently underway to prepare for an extension of Caltrain into Monterey County. The route will follow existing freight rail tracks from Gilroy south to Salinas, where the historic train station is being modernized for passenger service. However, a number of hurdles remain in terms of coordinating service with Caltrain and Union Pacific, the freight rail company that owns the tracks. The earliest the four-train-per-day service could begin is 2024, according to Christina Watson, a planner with the Transportation Agency for Monterey County (TAMC).

Amtrak has also identified this corridor, from San Jose to Los Angeles — which is currently served by the three-trip-per-week Coast Starlight — for increased train service in the near future.



In the future, TAMC hopes to build passenger stations on the existing tracks at Pajaro, near Watsonville, and Castroville. The Pajaro station would connect to a state-owned rail right of way that could provide service to Santa Cruz, and the Castroville station would connect to a proposed bus rapid transit line connecting to Seaside and Monterey. These destinations would be linked to the statewide high speed rail system via the Gilroy station.

https://www.sfweekly.com/news/a-norc...nsit-wishlist/

[H-man]

Originally Posted by homebucket

https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/...y-17135152.php

uck, alternative 4 looks to be the worst possible of the four

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by TWAK

Will Cal Train be going the same speed as the HSR trains?

The railroad also has 96 electric trains on order and under construction by Stadler US, based in Salt Lake City. The new rail cars, based on an off-the-shelf, European design, are self-propelled “electric multiple units.” That means each car has its own motive power–just like a BART train. That will make the trains far more reliable, since multiple motors can fail before the train has to be taken out of service. They also will have a much better power-to-weight ratio, which will enable the trains to go from a dead stop to full speed in a fraction of the time it takes Caltrain’s current fleet of diesel-hauled trains. To put that in perspective, a Baby Bullet express train from San Jose to San Francisco that currently takes 60 minutes, will take 45 minutes with the new trains. The extra acceleration will also enable more trains per hour and higher capacity.

...

Acceleration will be better, but the top speed of the new electric trains will be limited to 79 mph, which is the same as the current fleet. In addition to electrifying from Gilroy to Tamien, the California High-speed rail project will do additional trackwork–including widening some of the curves, to allow faster speeds. Caltrain will then be able to increase its top speed to over 100 mph.

https://sf.streetsblog.org/2018/08/2...arges-forward/

[green_man]

California bullet train planners take critical next step to plan Fresno, Valley stations

The Fresno Bee
Tim Sheehan
April 28, 2022



Preliminary planning and designs for four future high-speed train stations in Fresno and the San Joaquin Valley are expected to start later this year under a process approved Wednesday by the California High-Speed Rail Authority.

The agency’s board of directors, meeting in Sacramento, agreed to seek proposals from engineering firms to take on the first layers of work on stations in Merced, Fresno, Hanford and Bakersfield.

Read more at: https://www.fresnobee.com/news/local...#storylink=cpy

[green_man]

The above article might be paywalled, but this Fresno-focused article should work for everyone:


New images of proposed high-speed rail station in Fresno released

ABC 30
April 27, 2022

We're getting a possible look into the future of Fresno tonight.

The California High-Speed Rail Authority released new images Wednesday of what the proposed Central Valley Station could look like by the end of the decade.

https://abc30.com/high-speed-rail-st...esno/11799294/

[homebucket]

Very nice design!