PITTSBURGH | Development Rundown III

[The Best Forumer]

Originally Posted by fonzi

I must admit, I follow this forum from over 1800 miles away, and can't offer the first hand opinions most here can, including yourself. That said, I think you made a compelling case for my earlier post. Those exorbitant amounts being paid by tenants, means they've been had on the cheap. Those fees call for sweeping views from redundant glass towers with balconies. Thankfully, the options for a great, affordable meal, are still plentiful.

Exactly. It's unfortunate so much time has passed before someone noticed.

[Don't Be That Guy]

Originally Posted by pj3000

You see how fast these buildings go up and can be occupied… that’s the name of the game. These are high-profit endeavors, for the most part.

The reason for lack of height isn’t due to the City not wanting it, necessarily. It is due to the current height allowable/cost-effective for wood-framed structures.

Cheap construction, high rent.

That’s the name of the game in MF construction in second/third tier cities like Pittsburgh.

If you think the rent on these buildings is high, you should see what it would be if they were steel frame construction or all brick and glass. Developers would build buildings with different materials but the rents would be so far beyond what the market could bear. The cost of construction labor in Pittsburgh plays a big part in the design of these structures.

Also, you are correct that the wood frame construction type does have much to do with building heights. Five stories of wood frame over one or two stories of concrete/steel podium are the max before very expensive high-rise construction standards kick in. However, the city does hamstring height in some areas. The Riverfront zoning effectively limits new residential buildings to 60 feet.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Don't Be That Guy

If you think the rent on these buildings is high, you should see what it would be if they were steel frame construction or all brick and glass. Developers would build buildings with different materials but the rents would be so far beyond what the market could bear. The cost of construction labor in Pittsburgh plays a big part in the design of these structures.

Also, you are correct that the wood frame construction type does have much to do with building heights. Five stories of wood frame over one or two stories of concrete/steel podium are the max before very expensive high-rise construction standards kick in. However, the city does hamstring height in some areas. The Riverfront zoning effectively limits new residential buildings to 60 feet.

I broadly agree, but Oakland has managed a few taller apartment buildings. One on Centre is certainly steel construction. I believe it's fully leased now, but the apartment prices are about $1,000 to $1,100 per person for 2-3 bedroom apartments (each bedroom comes with its own bath, meaning it's really like you're renting a room with a shared kitchen/living room with 1-2 others. Which makes it...around what you'd pay for a 2-3 upper-end apartment in Pittsburgh).

[MarkMyWords]

Any time you see apartments rented "by the bedroom", as Eschaton above notes, it's a good bet that the building is located near a campus. That kind of rental arrangement is usually geared towards students sharing living arrangements.

[pj3000]

Interesting story regarding an urban Amazon "last-mile" warehouse in Philadelphia... a similar situation to the proposed Amazon warehouse at the former Sears Outlet in Upper Lawrenceville (which is much more densely-built location).


How Amazon treats Bridesburg residents could be a sign of what’s to come in Philly




https://www.inquirer.com/business/am...-20210614.html

Philly's Bridesburg residents aren't happy about their local Amazon warehouse.

While the largest Amazon warehouses exceed one million square feet, the Bridesburg center is much smaller. But what counts as small in the Amazon universe can make a big impact on a dense urban area.

As Amazon expands across the Philadelphia region, it is facing something of a neighborhood revolt against its oldest warehouse in the city.

The last-mile facility at 4219 Richmond St. has proven to be an unpopular addition to the tight-knit rowhouse section of Bridesburg in the city’s lower Northeast section.

The Richmond Street complex has been consistently occupied by trucking and logistics companies since it opened. But residents say that previous tenants have not hosted the number of employees or the volume of traffic that Amazon has created since it opened in 2017.

Councilmember Bobby Henon, who represents the neighborhood, says that the warehouse operates round the clock, with about 150 employees, and that traffic has picked up during the pandemic. (Amazon would not confirm these numbers.)

[Don't Be That Guy]

Originally Posted by MarkMyWords

Any time you see apartments rented "by the bedroom", as Eschaton above notes, it's a good bet that the building is located near a campus. That kind of rental arrangement is usually geared towards students sharing living arrangements.

Yep, it's student housing. One on Centre is a cool building; I love the massing. But that works because they are cramming a lot of people into it and getting a lot of rent per square foot, which you can do when two students share an 800 SF apartment.

[SEFTA]

Originally Posted by pj3000

Crosstown Park -Bjarke Ingels Group

Construction has been well underway for a couple years maybe. The cap is built, and I believe the summer construction season will see the beginning of building of the surface-level stuff atop the cap.

Wow. Been a long time since I've been back.

Would love to see some pics of this construction.

[pj3000]

Originally Posted by SEFTA

Wow. Been a long time since I've been back.

Would love to see some pics of this construction.

We would too!

The design has changed significantly since that initial Bjarke Ingels proposal, but the general mix of office and residential and entertainment remains. Hopefully, shovels will finally hit the dirt this year on the FNB HQ tower in the lower corner of the site.

[pj3000]

More proposed residential for East Liberty. 40 units in a 6-story building on the Penn Ave block which includes the Kelly-Strayhorn Theater.

I imagine we will see more of these soon, as the LG development featuring Whole Foods takes shape.

‘A very vibrant neighborhood’: Downtown developer targets East Liberty for more apartments

https://www.post-gazette.com/busines...s/202106170088

A Downtown developer is proposing to build a residential building in East Liberty on part of a block of properties it purchased on Penn Avenue last year.

An affiliate of McKnight Realty Partners is scheduled to go before the Pittsburgh Zoning Board of Adjustment to seek a variance and special exception related to the development at 5941 Penn.

The project involves the demolition of a one-story retail structure and the construction of a six-story apartment building with about 40 units, said Izzy Rudolph, McKnight president. There also will be retail.

McKnight purchased the block of properties late last year for $8.3 million. The block includes the Kelly Strayhorn Theater and the four-story Penn Highland Building, which once housed a May Stern store.

Mr. Rudolph said neither the theater nor the Penn Highland Building will be affected by the development.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by pj3000

More proposed residential for East Liberty. 40 units in a 6-story building on the Penn Ave block which includes the Kelly-Strayhorn Theater.

I imagine we will see more of these soon, as the LG development featuring Whole Foods takes shape.

‘A very vibrant neighborhood’: Downtown developer targets East Liberty for more apartments

https://www.post-gazette.com/busines...s/202106170088

This is the building slated to be replaced. It has some historic charm to it, but it's pretty underbuilt for that area, being just one story, when most of the rest of the buildings in the area are 2-3 stories.

No major loss, although I wish it were replacing some of the truly fugly structures a block or two down.

Presuming it's an all market-rate development, I could see it having trouble getting through ZBA. We will see.

[pianowizard]

Originally Posted by SEFTA

Wow. Been a long time since I've been back.

Would love to see some pics of this construction.

Thanks for resurrecting that Apr 2 post, as I had been wondering what the construction near Marriott and DoubleTree was for (I visit that area often). Now I know it's called the Crosstown Boulevard 'Cap' Park. Does anyone know when it will be finished? I am asking about just the small park shown below, excluding the later stages of the project.


Source: https://www.wesa.fm/development-tran...ing-commission

[shantyside]

Originally Posted by pj3000

More proposed residential for East Liberty. 40 units in a 6-story building on the Penn Ave block which includes the Kelly-Strayhorn Theater.

I imagine we will see more of these soon, as the LG development featuring Whole Foods takes shape.

‘A very vibrant neighborhood’: Downtown developer targets East Liberty for more apartments

https://www.post-gazette.com/busines...s/202106170088

when the shadow lounge and AVA were around, east liberty was vibrant

when the ace hotel was around, east liberty was vibrant

east liberty right now is lame, but developers gotta develop - hopefully the building won't look like crap

[pj3000]

Originally Posted by shantyside

when the shadow lounge and AVA were around, east liberty was vibrant

when the ace hotel was around, east liberty was vibrant

east liberty right now is lame

I would definitely not call East Liberty "vibrant" when the Shadow Lounge/Ava existed.

The Highland Building and connected apartment building at Highland & Centre were vacant, had trees growing out of them, and were crumbling in places. There was a vacant bank branch building at Penn & Highland. Much of the stretch of Highland between Penn and East Liberty blvd. was vacant. I could easily go on mentioning the large swaths of vacant land where housing projects once stood during the time Shadow/Ava was around.

The fact is, there is WAYYYY more activity in East Liberty now. It is far more vibrant currently than it has been in many decades. I'm by no means in love with all of the developments there, but to claim that it was more vibrant 10+ years ago is just not accurate.

[photoLith]

Yeah, East Liberty ten years ago will still pretty sketchy, its for sure much much more vibrant today than it was in 2010.

[Don't Be That Guy]

Originally Posted by pj3000

The fact is, there is WAYYYY more activity in East Liberty now. It is far more vibrant currently than it has been in many decades. I'm by no means in love with all of the developments there, but to claim that it was more vibrant 10+ years ago is just not accurate.

Well, I only gauge vibrancy by the availability of open prostitution and drug dealing, and the likelihood of being mugged. So, East Liberty is now super lame!

[pj3000]

^ The seedy side of urban vibrancy -- I like it!

[eschaton]

I mean, as a Lawrenceville resident from 2007 to 2014, I got to see the neighborhood change dramatically. On an absolute level, there's more stuff in Lawrenceville than ever. But proportionately, the number of interesting things has fallen, while the number of things catering to normies has exploded.

[shantyside]

Originally Posted by pj3000

The fact is, there is WAYYYY more activity in East Liberty now. It is far more vibrant currently than it has been in many decades. I'm by no means in love with all of the developments there, but to claim that it was more vibrant 10+ years ago is just not accurate.

east liberty is so lame even after a year plus of outdoor dining options, the whole foods doesn't have one table set up outside, not one

i can forgive the complete lack of indoor dining options because since they're now basically a delivery business - all that space has been commandeered by that operation

but no tables and chairs outside, now, after all this time? - lame AF

and the new location is gonna be even lamer unless your idea of fun is eating outside an office building looking at either A) a huge empty lot or B) a construction site

[shantyside]

this is a development blog but without urban planning development is just profit-driven crap, shopping malls being the most obvious example

one concept drilled into my head in architecture school - the corridor, not as in hallway, but as in a thoroughfare



centre avenue where WF is now is a MAIN STREET - the new location at that part of penn avenue is not, nor will it ever be with housing lining the other side penn avenue

[wpipkins2]

Originally Posted by shantyside

when the shadow lounge and AVA were around, east liberty was vibrant

when the ace hotel was around, east liberty was vibrant

east liberty right now is lame, but developers gotta develop - hopefully the building won't look like crap

I really miss AVA and the Shadow Lounge. The closing of the shadow lounge was a huge cultural loss for East Liberty