NEW YORK | Empire Station District | 9 Towers (18-20 msf)| FT | FLOORS

[NYguy]

Originally Posted by Prezrezc

Not to worry if it comes to that.

I've seen plenty of examples wherein reclads that call for retaining the original "feel" of the building (E.g. First Canadian in TO, UN Secretariat) actually work out better than the original.

There's always a few going on in Manhattan. There's one or two going on at Rockefeller Center as we speak. There are quite a few planned, and that's the way it's going to go - you either get knocked down and rebuilt, or renovated and reclad.

[citybooster]

I've always seen 1 Penn as a hulking, ugly, soulless modern tower... a reclad would help immensely. Just happy with the overall Vornado plan, especially doing as good a job as practically can be done to make Penn Station at least welcoming and open to light, not a sad rathole undeserving of being New York City's biggest transportation hub. At least we'll have the Farley Building/ Moynihan Station for that classic old time feel and get potentially lots of great retail and office space as the Vornado dominated corridor connecting to the Midtown West developments start taking shape in the next few years....just hope they really get the ball rolling and start moving in as timely a fashion as possible.

[Amanita]

I wonder how One Penn would look with a pinstripe pattern similar to 277 Park Avenue, where the stripes are further apart and stand out more, instead of blending together from a distance? If a reclad kept the original feel of the building, that would be cool. My One Penn headpiece is getting a bit rough, perhaps I should wait to see how this little renovation plays out before remaking it. But considering it's made of illustrator's board and scrapbook paper, and has survived several trips back and forth to NYC, it's held up pretty damn well for something made in 2011.
If they were planning a reclad wouldn't they have mentioned it?

[chefforbz]

I'm trying to figure out the relationship between what Vornado has just released in the last few days and what Cuomo has proposed for the area. Are these two forces working together against the Mayor to finally create an environment where Vornado can move forward or is Cuomo pushing Vornado to finally deal with the lack of progress in that neighborhood? Or is it just coincidence that Roth made public these thoughts a few days after the Cuomo initiative?

[NYguy]

Originally Posted by citybooster

Just happy with the overall Vornado plan, especially doing as good a job as practically can be done to make Penn Station at least welcoming and open to light, not a sad rathole undeserving of being New York City's biggest transportation hub.

Agreed. Moynihan is well underway, and part 2 of the plan is to get the current Penn in a state to match it in some sense. It would be an insult to leave it as is.

Originally Posted by Amanita

If they were planning a reclad wouldn't they have mentioned it?

I don't know that they didn't. I just posted what was in that particular article, which probably didn't even mention everything.

Originally Posted by chefforbz

I'm trying to figure out the relationship between what Vornado has just released in the last few days and what Cuomo has proposed for the area. Are these two forces working together against the Mayor to finally create an environment where Vornado can move forward or is Cuomo pushing Vornado to finally deal with the lack of progress in that neighborhood? Or is it just coincidence that Roth made public these thoughts a few days after the Cuomo initiative?

I don't think it's coincidence. The proposals that we've seen (or at least heard about) are a response to Cuomo's proposal last year which saw developers respond. We've only seen the JDS proposal, but because Vornado owns most of the land in the area, it was limited in scope how much they could do. There's no doubt that Vornado wants in on that Hudson Yards and now Midtown East action. They may feel an oppurtunity has passed by with 15 Penn (actually the first west side tower to get a tenant) and don't want to be left behind again.

Cuomo, meanwhile, wants yet another development to leave behind as his legacy. Guiliani (to some degree) got Times Square redeveloped, Bloomberg got the West Side, de Blasio got Midtown East passed, and now Cuomo wants to leave his mark on the city. He knows that it was the governor who got the WTC built, and wants some similar, grand proposal. The idea to work around the city was to speed things up a bit, as we know how things get bogged down. The mayor is also pro-development, but he can't override the city's process of approval. Vornado's demolishment of 2 Penn would be the key to finally unlocking those development rights from MSG. As far as the other blocks go, they would need an upzoning to get the type of large scale development we are seeing on the west side and midtown east. Hopefully we will hear more details on these plans soon.

[NYguy]

https://www.amny.com/opinion/editori...ion-1.18137240

Gov. Cuomo should explain his plans for Penn Station





By The Editorial Board
April 18, 2018

Gov. Andrew Cuomo is right to call Penn Station “antiquated, substandard and inadequate to meet current transportation and public safety needs.” He’s right that its decrepit state poses “an unreasonable safety risk.” And he’s right to want to overhaul the transportation hub, which serves 650,000 people each day.

But that language is part of a mystifying open-ended document approved as part of the 2018-19 state budget that speaks vaguely of development plans and funding promises, but leaves Cuomo’s plans on how to fix Penn unclear. The wording worries some transit advocates and NYC officials that it’s a power grab for the state to do what it wants with Penn and the land around it. Cuomo himself has said that the language could pave the way for the government to take the land in condemnation proceedings.

To complete a massive renovation of Penn, significant changes to Madison Square Garden, which sits atop the station, might be necessary. The state must proceed carefully and work with NYC. Overextending the state’s reach will only undermine the goal. The Empire State Development agency and the Metropolitan Transportation Authority are key to any redevelopment effort, and the best part of the budget document is a phrase that calls for their collaboration.

It’ll be up to Cuomo to provide a detailed blueprint for Penn’s future and take the steps to make it a reality. Don’t make Penn Station a symbol of the battle for power between the state and city. Instead, turn it into a glorious gateway to both, one that gives commuters the experience they deserve.

https://therealdeal.com/2018/04/19/d...builder-award/

Dreams do come true: Cuomo to receive Moses-themed “Master Builder” award





By Will Parker
April 19, 2018

“Those who can, build. Those who can’t, criticize.”

Those were the words of Robert Moses, interchangeably New York’s unelected “construction coordinator” or “master builder” who is perhaps more responsible for the organization of New York’s modern built environment than anyone else.

It’s in the spirit of Moses that the Building Trades Employers Association, a trade group for contractors that has increasingly embraced union-free construction work, will present Governor Andrew Cuomo with its first ever “Master Builder” award on June 14 at 583 Park Avenue in Midtown.

Lou Colletti, president of BTEA, said the award was created especially for Cuomo and was inspired by Moses. Colletti cited the billions of dollars in subsidy for capital construction and project labor agreements that Cuomo has appropriated since first taking office in 2011, and counted projects such as the Tappan Zee Bridge, LaGuardia Airport and Moynihan station overhauls and the Javits Center as major accomplishments.

“[Cuomo] confirmed he’s coming this morning,” Colletti said. “People talk about Robert Moses, people talk about Nelson Rockefeller, I believe this governor has done more than those two individuals who did a lot, and has done it in a very different way,” he said, taking note of Moses’ mixed legacy.

[prageethSL]

Originally Posted by NYguy

Dreams do come true: Cuomo to receive Moses-themed “Master Builder” award

He deserves it.

[JMKeynes]

Originally Posted by prageethSL

He deserves it.

Without a doubt.

[NYguy]

The block south of the Garden....in the JDS proposal, the entire block would be have been razed for a third train hall (Gateway) and highrises.



https://www.instagram.com/p/BhsreDbg...ohnnyjohnson63

[NYguy]

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bg42rp6j...by=candyandy43

[NYguy]

Originally Posted by Amanita

If they were planning a reclad wouldn't they have mentioned it?

A little more on that...


https://nypost.com/2018/04/23/youll-...office-towers/

By Lois Weiss
April 23, 2018

Sources say Vornado Realty Trust’s 2.52 million-square-foot monster One Penn Plaza, bounded by West 33rd and 34th streets between Seventh and Eighth avenues, is converting an entire 85,000-square-foot floor to house a cafeteria and other spaces earmarked for amenities. The building is also getting a new lobby in a major facelift and will be rebranded PENN 1.

“I have a major tenant looking hard at the building and this is making them pay attention,” confides one broker, who asked not to be identified. Vornado didn’t respond to requests for information.

[Submariner]

So it will, on the outside, remain firmly in the grips of 1970’s architectural misery. Great.

[NYguy]

https://therealdeal.com/2018/05/01/v...self-up-again/

Vornado mulls splitting itself up, again
Steve Roth said spinoffs of retail, development businesses are possible


By Konrad Putzier
May 01, 2018

Steven Roth, CEO of the firm, said it’s possible Vornado will spin off a development company from its income-producing real estate. The rationale: Vornado has several expensive development projects in planning around Penn Station, and REIT investors tend to dislike the uncertainty associated with development.

“Development is not a business that can be measured quarter to quarter,” Roth said. If the stock price continues to trade below asset values because investors don’t like the development risk, Roth said, it “doesn’t make intellectual sense” to not try to change that.

In his annual letter to investors last month, Roth wrote that Vornado is considering tearing down 2 Penn Plaza and replacing it with a new tower. But during Tuesday’s call, he said that the development probably won’t happen after all because the company is having a hard time landing public subsidies to fund it.

“It does not appear that that plan is going to go forward and is feasible,” Roth said. Instead, the company will renovate the tower, give it a new facade and add 300,000 square feet near the base.
Roth again declined to say how many units the company has sold at its luxury condo project 220 Central Park South, but noted that closings will start at the end of 2018.

He claimed that the tower is “aesthetically and financially the best project that’s ever been done in New York, and therefore the country.”

[NYguy]

This went through anyway, but the morons did try to stop it.



http://www.dickgottfried.org/press-r...ty-government/

Penn Station Double Outrage as Governor Jams Legislature and Usurps City Government

Statement by Assembly Member Richard N. Gottfried

“After the Assembly leadership made clear to Governor Cuomo that we would not agree to his effort to take control of the area around Penn Station, the Governor has jammed his Penn Station bill into the final giant budget bill delivered to the Legislature on a take-it-or-leave-it basis. This extraordinarily hostile gesture puts the Legislature in a position of accepting his plan or shutting down government.

“It is wrong for the Governor to try to take over urban planning, traffic management and real estate development in New York City. That’s what this bill is aimed at. A project in the middle of midtown that is this large, complex, and important must be a collaborative effort and vision, including the Governor as well as the Mayor, along with area residents and businesses, the community board, and the area’s elected officials.

“The area’s elected officials — City Council Speaker Corey Johnson, Manhattan Borough President Gale Brewer, Representative Jerry Nadler, State Senator Brad Hoylman and I – along with Mayor Bill de Blasio all opposed this last-minute power grab against the City’s elected local government. None of this overwhelming local opposition mattered to Governor Cuomo.

And just when was this ship of fools going to get the ball rolling on something?

[chris08876]

A lot of potential. Pic by me. Hotel Penn needs to go. The surrounding structures next to Macys need to go. Taken yesterday.

I do like the LED screens, the area just needs to be more modern. IMO, I'm fine with it being like a 2nd Times Square. Kinda is in a way, a mini one.

On a side note, Penn Station is a disgrace. Was like a million degrees yesterday and was like a zoo.


unnamed by Christopher Estevez, on Flickr

[NYguy]

Originally Posted by chris08876

On a side note, Penn Station is a disgrace. Was like a million degrees yesterday and was like a zoo.

That's everyday, lol.

[NYer34]

Hotel Penn should be refurbished. Tremendous potential if Vornado wasn't actively ruining by neglect.

[Amanita]

^I suspect they've been neglecting it because they planned to tear it down originally. No point in refurbishing it if you're only going to get rid of it in a few years. Now it's kind of in limbo. If a decision is made to save it, then we'll likely see some serious money spent to improve it.

[NYguy]

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/05/22/n...a-mta-nyc.html

The Garden and Penn Station

By Brian M. Rosenthal
May 22, 2018

...To critics, Mr. Lhota’s biggest conflict involves The Madison Square Garden Company and an affiliated entity, MSG Networks.

MSG Networks hired Mr. Lhota as a board member in 2016 and The Madison Square Garden Company hired him to its board last December. He had previously worked as the executive vice president for The Madison Square Garden Company. The two posts are expected to pay about $300,000 combined annually.

The December hire, which was first reported by Politico, stunned transit activists because of the Garden’s reliance on the M.T.A. — Penn Station has six subway lines and houses the Long Island Rail Road, which is also operated by the authority.

Talks have been going on for years about remaking Penn Station into a site that is better for travelers and also takes advantage of the opportunity for development in a thriving real estate market. But negotiations started heating up again late last fall, according to three sources familiar with the process who spoke on the condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to discuss the issue publicly.

One of the options, the sources said, is the removal of the 5,500-seat Hulu Theater to make room for a grand entrance to Penn Station from Eighth Avenue. That would require compensating the Garden, and the size of the compensation is a major point of contention.

The Garden’s top executive, James L. Dolan, is a longtime donor to Mr. Cuomo, but advocates said it could not hurt to hire Mr. Lhota during the talks.

Mr. Lhota said he had recused himself from any discussions about the overhaul of Penn Station. A Madison Square Garden spokeswoman said in a statement, “We believe Joe is a valued, independent member of our board who acts with the highest integrity.”

On Friday, the M.T.A. disclosed it was involved in a “planning process” regarding the terminal.

The terminal is not the only conflict involving The Madison Square Garden Company. The company is also an investor in a project to build an arena for the New York Islanders at Belmont Park on Long Island, and project leaders have said the site needs better transit access to be successful.

Mr. Lhota said he had recused himself from that issue, too. But when asked about the proposed arena at a budget hearing in Albany in January, he answered at length.

Though Mr. Lhota said he had avoided talks about renovating Penn Station, he has not hesitated to participate in decisions about improvements to two subway stations that serve the stadium, which arguably would also benefit Madison Square Garden.

In February, he voted for a package before the board that included funding for renovations to the stations. Mr. Lhota said his participation was approved by the M.T.A.’s general counsel.

[aquablue]

Penn station is like LaGuardia, the "third world" airport that Joe Biden talked about which started the process to replace the terminal. Joe Biden should say something about Penn because it's basically third world too.