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  #601  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2014, 3:45 AM
jamesinclair jamesinclair is offline
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A few night shots and a question...



Is this an abandoned platform?










As for the fence on the right...


Whats the plan for this wall? How do you get up there?
http://goo.gl/maps/amyqb

I like the ample seating, which NYC really lacks









And a drive-thru Mcdonalds in Manhattan always surprises me
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  #602  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2014, 4:01 AM
JSsocal JSsocal is offline
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^^ regarding wall/fence, that whole block of 33rd street will eventually be lifted to grade with the current park. (currently the street is a strange U shape between 10th and 11th ave) An underground connection will then exist between HY and the 7 train. Where the 7 train park level is now will be at grade with the final grounds of HY, which is also nearly at grade with the highline walkway.
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  #603  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2014, 4:17 AM
jamesinclair jamesinclair is offline
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Originally Posted by JSsocal View Post
^^ regarding wall/fence, that whole block of 33rd street will eventually be lifted to grade with the current park. (currently the street is a strange U shape between 10th and 11th ave) An underground connection will then exist between HY and the 7 train. Where the 7 train park level is now will be at grade with the final grounds of HY, which is also nearly at grade with the highline walkway.
What would happen to the folks currently on the bottom level if the road goes up one floor?

http://goo.gl/maps/QA9zr
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  #604  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2014, 9:30 AM
JSsocal JSsocal is offline
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Related owns all the property on both sides of the street, eventually the rest of the block will get another big office tower. (50 hudson yards). You'd like to think they would all connect up underground somehow, not sure on that second case though.
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  #605  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2014, 10:39 PM
jamesinclair jamesinclair is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSsocal View Post
Related owns all the property on both sides of the street, eventually the rest of the block will get another big office tower. (50 hudson yards). You'd like to think they would all connect up underground somehow, not sure on that second case though.
Are any of them being demolished? How about the Mcdonalds?
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  #606  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2014, 11:57 PM
JSsocal JSsocal is offline
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Everything on the block is toast, really the only substantial loss is the coach building (The tall brick prewar). Shame, but it would never fit into the master plan, and having it gone is going to make the elevation fronting the 7 subway much more successful.
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  #607  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2014, 12:39 PM
vkristof vkristof is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesinclair View Post
A few night shots and a question...



Is this an abandoned platform?


And a drive-thru Mcdonalds in Manhattan always surprises me
The train platform is NOT abandoned. The West Side Storage Yards are also used for maintenance of the trains. In the specific case of that platform, it's probably used by the cleaning crews. Some of the maintenance functions have been relocated to other LIRR yards/facilities whilst the overbuild platform is built.

I'm glad to see you appreciate the mid-town drive-thru McDs also.

Last edited by vkristof; Dec 6, 2014 at 12:14 AM.
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  #608  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2014, 1:03 PM
mrnyc mrnyc is offline
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^ wait, did you just whilst us??

i like these night shots a lot -- its interesting to see the evening work.
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  #609  
Old Posted Nov 18, 2014, 7:48 PM
jamesinclair jamesinclair is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSsocal View Post
Everything on the block is toast, really the only substantial loss is the coach building (The tall brick prewar). Shame, but it would never fit into the master plan, and having it gone is going to make the elevation fronting the 7 subway much more successful.
Is there a timeline for demolition? I also liked the bigger building. Seems like a waste to demolish a nice looking 14 store building.

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Originally Posted by vkristof View Post
The train platform is NOT abandoned. The West Side Storage Yards are also used for maintenance of the trains. In the specific case of that platform, it's probably used by the cleaning crews. Some of the maintenance functions have been relocated to ther LIRR yards/facilities whilst the overbuild platform is built.

I'm glad to see you appreciate the mid-town drive-thru McDs also.
Cleaning makes sense.


Sadly, by standard pocket camera broke, so I had to use my cell for the above shots. I ordered a new camera, so in 2-3 weeks Ill go around the area again and take better night shots.

...and by night shots I mean 7pm, lol.
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  #610  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2014, 6:00 PM
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That pre-war beauty will be sorely missed. It will stay longer than most naysayers would guess since tenants aren't attracted to that place.

Hopefully its landmarked soon
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  #611  
Old Posted Nov 23, 2014, 12:35 AM
vkristof vkristof is offline
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Pardon our dust WHILST we dig & build

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Originally Posted by mrnyc View Post
^ wait, did you just whilst us??

i like these night shots a lot -- its interesting to see the evening work.
Yes, I did.

I like the night shots also. Especially with the relatively recent historical background of what this area was like in the '70s & early '80s. Which was before the Javits center was built & the LIRR's West Side Storage Yard was built over the old, unused, NY Central train yard.

Dunno when they built the McD's drive-thru, maybe somebody should seek landmark protection for it...
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  #612  
Old Posted Dec 1, 2014, 3:27 PM
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Just an idea...


Quote:
Originally Posted by NYguy View Post
Now, this is something that seems like it may have a chance...


http://www.capitalnewyork.com/articl...eens-rail-yard

Amtrak weighing development of massive Queens rail yard









By Ryan Hutchins
Oct. 23, 2014




http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/30/op...f=opinion&_r=1

New York’s Next Big Thing




Sunnyside Yards in Queens, which could hold the kind of convention center the city needs.


By DANIEL L. DOCTOROFF
NOV. 28, 2014


Quote:
NEW YORK is the most diverse, dynamic city on Earth.

More than 55 million people are projected to visit this year, bringing with them a total economic impact of more than $60 billion and supporting about 350,000 jobs.

We are an undisputed leader in tourism, yet we lag badly in one important aspect: the huge convention and conference business.
Nationwide, conventions add nearly $400 billion to our gross domestic product, and employment in the industry is set to grow 33 percent through 2022. Sadly, New York ranks 64th globally in this business, leaving tens of thousands of jobs and billions of dollars on the table — resources that could fund better schools, parks and affordable housing.

New York struggles for two main reasons. First, of course, is price. With the average Manhattan hotel room costing nearly $300 per night, we are pricing ourselves out of the market for many major conventions. Then there is the Jacob K. Javits Convention Center. Located on Manhattan’s Far West Side, Javits was unloved practically from the moment it opened. It’s too small for many events and can’t compete with facilities in other cities.

Fortunately, there’s a solution — one that would not only address our lack of competitiveness in the conventions and conferences business, but would also catalyze the transformation of two neighborhoods and make a meaningful dent in our affordable housing crisis. The best part is that we can do this all without costing taxpayers a dime.

The key is to replace the Javits Center. There’s been talk over the years of expanding it, but that won’t solve the affordability problem. Fortunately, the perfect undeveloped location for a new convention center exists at Sunnyside Yards, the more than 160-acre rail yard that carves a nasty scar through the heart of Queens.

Sunnyside Yards is adjacent to Long Island City, a neighborhood that has blossomed in recent years with new residents and businesses, including nearly 20 new hotels since 2007, with almost as many currently under construction or in the planning stages. The average hotel room rate in Queens is less than half that of Manhattan; a convention center on the border of Long Island City would go a long way toward solving the affordability problem that holds the Javits Center back.

Long Island City is also one of the most convenient, transit-friendly areas in the city, served by eight subway lines. The Long Island Rail Road and Amtrak pass through and park their trains there. Even New Jersey Transit stores its trains in Sunnyside. From my office one block south of Bloomingdale’s in the heart of Midtown Manhattan, I can get to Long Island City by subway in just one stop, and eight minutes flat.

Given the neighborhood’s many advantages, redeveloping Sunnyside Yards seems obvious — but the biggest barrier has always been the multibillion-dollar cost of building a platform over the train tracks that can allow the trains to run while accommodating large construction. The cost has always made the idea a nonstarter, but times — and real estate values — have changed. Stronger market conditions bring us closer to feasibility, but the numbers for building the platform still don’t add up unless we get creative.

That’s why we should relocate the Javits Center to Sunnyside, sell the extremely valuable property the Javits Center owns, and use the proceeds to pay for it.

In addition to a state-of-the-art convention center that would be 3.1 million square feet rather than the 1.8 million at Javits, the platform and adjacent rezoned areas would provide the foundation for a dynamic new neighborhood, accommodating nearly 14,000 new units of housing, of which about 50 percent would be affordable; more than two million square feet of office and retail space; several hotels to support convention visitors; vast expanses of public green space; a job-creating technology campus; and a new transit center. Convention visitors would have convenient places to stay at affordable rates.

One objection might be that a convention center must be in Manhattan to attract blockbuster conferences. Let’s put that old way of thinking aside. The ExCeL exhibition center in London, about five miles from the city’s core, has catalyzed nearly $5 billion in economic impact and supported 31,000 jobs. Sunnyside Yards is far closer to Midtown.

The land under the Javits Center would be rezoned for housing. More than 11,000 units could be developed there, of which 20 percent would be affordable. Between the redevelopments of the Sunnyside and Javits sites, more than 25,000 units of desperately needed housing could be created, of which more than 9,000 would be affordable. That could make a major contribution to Mayor Bill de Blasio’s admirable and ambitious housing plan.

Getting anything done in New York is hard. The bigger it is, the harder it gets. And the Javits to Sunnyside move is very big. Total estimated costs for the platform, the convention center and the related open space and infrastructure would be about $8 billion, according to an analysis done for me by SHoP Architects and HR&A Advisors. But the beauty of this plan is that it can all be financed at no new net cost to taxpayers. The Javits property could be sold for about $4 billion. The incremental real estate tax revenues from the new developments on both the Sunnyside and existing Javits sites would roughly pay for the difference.

Almost all of the land required to make this happen is owned by either the State of New York or by Amtrak. The Amtrak chairman, Anthony R. Coscia, indicated recently that Amtrak was considering the development potential of its holdings in the Sunnyside Yards. Still, it is Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo who controls all of the Javits site and much of the portion of Sunnyside Yards not owned by Amtrak.

Too often in New York, we get stuck in the tired paradigm of choosing between development and affordability. If we plan smartly, development can finance affordable housing, and affordability will attract greater diversity, which makes the city even more appealing to new residents and businesses.

Daniel L. Doctoroff is the chief executive officer of Bloomberg L.P. and chairman of Culture Shed, a cultural institution that will open in 2018. He was New York City’s deputy mayor for economic development.
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  #613  
Old Posted Dec 1, 2014, 7:03 PM
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Don't listen to anything this Doctoroff guy that worked for Bloomberg has to say.

Quote:
Total estimated costs for the platform, the convention center and the related open space and infrastructure would be about $8 billion, according to an analysis done for me by SHoP Architects and HR&A Advisors. But the beauty of this plan is that it can all be financed at no new net cost to taxpayers. The Javits property could be sold for about $4 billion. The incremental real estate tax revenues from the new developments on both the Sunnyside and existing Javits sites would roughly pay for the difference.


Right, and how's Hudson Yards payment for the subway coming along?

For those of you that don't know Doctoroff said --

http://observer.com/2013/07/dan-doct...nother-subway/

Quote:
But not everybody’s ideas for transit struck us as so enlightened. Bloomberg (first the mayor, and now the corporation) executive Dan Doctoroff and Brookfield’s John Zuccotti sat on stage and chatted, and we could scarcely believe our ears when they started talking about the Second Avenue subway: they hate it.

“A silly little spur that doesn’t generate anything other than some convenience for people who are perfectly happy to live where they lived before,” Mr. Doctoroff said. Why, he wondered, was the city going through with it, “even though it’s a subway that doesn’t have any value added?” A “pet project” of the MTA and Sheldon Silver, he called it.

Are we talking about the same subway…? The one that will serve one of the densest neighborhoods in the city? The one that’s supposed to relieve a subway line that carries more passengers than the entire Washington Metro system? The one that’s been planned for the better part of a century? The one that Yorkville was upzoned in anticipation of decades ago? The one that, despite having only four stops, is projected to carry more riders than the entire length of the L train?

....

Real estate insiders, on the other hand, think of transit primarily as a way of spurring development, and are not swayed by arguments about easing overcrowding or serving tax-paying citizens. And it wouldn’t be the first time Mr. Doctoroff has argued that transit should serve the needs of developers over existing New Yorkers—when the 7 train stop at 10th Avenue and 41st Street was cut, he downplayed the significance, since buildings were already going up in Hell’s Kitchen without it. (By that logic, what was the point of the entire Independent Subway System, now the A/C/E, B/D/F/M and G trains?)

Mr. Zuccotti did, however, cheer on the 7 train extension to Hudson Yards, lauding the Bloomberg administration’s “outstanding performance.” (Nevermind that it lost a station along the way.) Mr. Doctoroff also made reference to the project paying for itself. (Nevermind that the city has had to chip in a quarter of a billion dollars so far to make up for lackluster tax revenues at Hudson Yards.)
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  #614  
Old Posted Dec 6, 2014, 12:18 AM
vkristof vkristof is offline
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Originally Posted by Perklol View Post
Don't listen to anything this Doctoroff guy that worked for Bloomberg has to say.





Right, and how's Hudson Yards payment for the subway coming along?

For those of you that don't know Doctoroff said --

http://observer.com/2013/07/dan-doct...nother-subway/
Yeah. NYC probably will be entering a slowdown in new building:

"The cargo cult of railyard decks"

http://capntransit.blogspot.com/2014...ard-decks.html
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  #615  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2014, 3:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vkristof View Post
Yeah. NYC probably will be entering a slowdown in new building:
The slowdown, if and when it comes, would be in office construction (it will take time to absorb all of that space). What won't slow down is the need for residential development. And besides, this is planning for the long term, not tomorrow. Bloomberg saw that, and we got the Hudson Yards wheels moving long before any office or residential tower could go up. That's what smart planning does. A city that lacks wide swaths of land to build on had better start thinking about building over wasted air space, like large, open railyards.

The good thing is that, like we are already seeing with Atlantic Yards, Hudson Yards, and Manhattan West, the city is already moving in that direction.



http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/...icle-1.2036405

New proposal suggests moving Javits Center to Queens in a bid to increase convention business, affordable housing




A new development proposal suggests relocating the Javits Center (pictured) from Manhattan to Queens.







BY LARRY MCSHANE
December 6, 2014


Quote:
Goodbye, West Side. Hello, Sunnyside.

A dramatic new development proposal suggests adding 1.3 million square feet to the Javits Center — right after relocating the whole place 21/2 miles east into Queens.

The plan would use state-owned land on Manhattan’s West Side and Sunnyside in Queens to create a new convention center in the outer borough while spawning new housing in both boroughs.

It would be, according to its proponents, the largest development project in city history: 31 million square of space on 192 acres, constructed across three decades.

.....With the Javits Center gone, seven blocks of state-owned property would open for construction of new housing. The money generated there would finance the Sunnyside platform and the $8 billion Exhibition and Convention Center.

The new center would provide an anchor for creating a Queens neighborhood above the rail yards — complete with new homes, office space, parks and up to 5,000 hotel rooms for convention guests.

.....The proposal would signal a sad farewell for the Javits, opened with much ballyhoo in 1986.

In its place would come a mixed-used neighborhood with commercial development along Eleventh Ave., complete with condominiums and residential rentals on an 18-acre parcel of land.

A design sketch shows a dozen or more tall buildings springing up on the West Side.

No one is suggesting the process will be simple. The Atlantic Yards development in Brooklyn, launched in 2003, needed nearly a decade to open Barclays Center.




















Daily News editorial...



http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/e...icle-1.2035624

Think big, gentlemen
The Javits to Sunnyside plan makes sense






December 7, 2014


Quote:
Gov. Cuomo and Mayor de Blasio may very well have the opportunity to create a historically ambitious housing and commercial development for New York City — at an extraordinarily low cost to taxpayers.

Led by the governor, the two officials must assemble a working group to evaluate a newly formulated plan for producing more than 25,000 units of housing in Manhattan and Queens — with 10,000 of them pegged as affordable — along with a convention center designed to lure major events that now bypass the city.


The scheme is the brainchild of Dan Doctoroff, a deputy mayor in the Bloomberg administration, and former city planner Vishaan Chakrabarti of ShoP Architects, the firm that designed the Barclays Center.

On first review, their plan has more than enough credibility to demand intense consideration.

The heart of the proposal calls for unlocking the untapped, multi-billion-dollar value of the state-owned land beneath the Javits Convention Center on Manhattan’s West Side.

Outmoded and too small for the biggest shows, Javits would be torn down to make way for housing and commerce in the area between 11th and 12th Aves. from W. 33rd to W. 40th Sts.

Revenues generated by the development would finance construction of a replacement convention center and housing on a second tract of underutilized state-owned land: Sunnyside Yard in Queens.

At 192 acres , the rail yard is an immense dead zone in Long Island City. Without an enormous infusion of capital, it will remain a wasted asset.

The central premise of Doctoroff's plan is that the Manhattan side of the plan would throw off more than $8 billion, enabling construction of the new convention center and affordable housing on a platform over the rail tracks.


The scheme also reckons that Sunnyside Yard would be an ideal location for conventions, with seven subway lines and the Long Island Rail Road connecting there after brief rides from Manhattan, and Amtrak passing through.

By all rights, Cuomo and de Blasio should jump at studying the West Side-Sunnyside concept.

Cuomo recognized the need to replace Javits when he broached a plan early in his administration to build a convention center at Aqueduct Racetrack, far more distant and with only a fraction of the mass transit. He understands the need for major infrastructure projects — especially if they are self-financing.

De Blasio has focused on affordable housing. The units promised here would represent a major plus for working- and middle-class New Yorkers. Again, with limited drain on the public treasury.

Cuomo, as owner of the properties at play, and de Blasio, as the mayor who would guide zoning and planning, must jointly test the economic fundamentals of creating two boomtowns that would stand as proud monuments in their legacies.
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Last edited by NYguy; Dec 9, 2014 at 3:41 PM.
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  #616  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2014, 4:37 PM
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A simply extraordinary and unprecedented expansion of true urbanity. May our grid enlarge, and our towers rise.
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  #617  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2014, 7:36 PM
antinimby antinimby is offline
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I like this plan but I'm afraid there will be a NIMBY war and after the dust settles, all the big figures they're throwing around will be lowered.
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  #618  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2014, 8:04 PM
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Now we are talking. We need housing, and something like this is a step in the right direction. Once the NIMBYS read about this project, the war drums will be heard.



The NIMBYS will assemble and fight this to the end (most of them look this anyways). I think its a pretty accurate pic depicting what female and male NIMBYs tend to look like as I've never seen a hot looking NIMBY. But in the end, something will be built here. This is a great step for DeBlasio's affordable housing plan.

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A simply extraordinary and unprecedented expansion of true urbanity. May our grid enlarge, and our towers rise.
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  #619  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2014, 10:05 PM
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Originally Posted by chris08876 View Post
The NIMBYS will assemble and fight this to the end (most of them look this anyways). I think its a pretty accurate pic depicting what female and male NIMBYs tend to look like as I've never seen a hot looking NIMBY. But in the end, something will be built here. This is a great step for DeBlasio's affordable housing plan.



There's A LOT of those monstrosities over at the Metlife building thread. Don't believe me? Just look at this obese fat cat lady.

http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...29#post6817529 http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...&postcount=100

Anyone who says that they'll "do" that is either insane or a desperate fat dude.

Last edited by Perklol; Dec 9, 2014 at 10:18 PM.
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  #620  
Old Posted Dec 9, 2014, 10:30 PM
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Yawn. You guys need to grow up.
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