PHILADELPHIA | Lowrise/General Developments Thread

[Philly Fan]

Originally Posted by cardeza

Does anyone know what is being built adjacent to 76 near Penn's athletic fields? I saw heavy equipment on site when driving past the other day.

Depending on how far south you mean, it could be this:

https://www.facilities.upenn.edu/map...rack-and-field

[El Duderino]

Originally Posted by PHLtoNYC

I noticed netting covering the Painted Bride building on Vine Street. Has that been there? Any updates on if the building will stay or go?

That black netting has been on for a while at this point. I believe it's still making its way through court - IIRC the development team is appealing the court's ruling that was in favor of overturning the ZBA approval.

It would be awful if a very small group of neighbors caused this building to get demolished. The proposed overbuild is one of the best designs I can remember. It's especially egregious given that the entire block over there is now lined with mid-rises since this was proposed. The lack of foresight and selfishness truly sucks. There's a quick update on Naked Philly's instagram here:

https://www.instagram.com/reel/Clygdv8gvKS/

[Knight Hospitaller]

Originally Posted by cardeza

It is also almost inconceivable to think about this link not being there now that its been open for 30 years. Having all that traffic dumping onto a super wide regular "street" would not be good for center city. if you look at old pictures of what was there before the highway it wasn't actually all that urban or attractive and it certainly didnt look too pedestrian or bike friendly. 676 is basically a river of vehicles going through the city, it's not the greatest thing ever but the idea that the surrounding area was some beautiful urbane neighborhood prior to construction is a bit of a stretch. I mean if we built a cap over the schulkyll river south of the fairmount dam we could have more developable land and we could close a chasm- I don't think anyone is proposing we do that however. Cities all over the country and world have gaps created by rivers, railyards, highways, etc. that are spanned by bridges- life goes on.

I was thinking about this very issue before coming across your comment. Long before the Vine Street Expressway, the damage had already been done. When I was a child, up through college, Vine street was an approximately 10 lane surface street until somewhere between 15th and 17th Street, where it went below grade. It wasn't until the late 80s that the below grade portion was extended eastward. The current expressway is actually an improvement, since the fabric of the city in that area was long since destroyed. A little more vision and capping it at the time would've been nice, but we'll get there.

[PhilliesPhan]

Originally Posted by Knight Hospitaller

I was thinking about this very issue before coming across your comment. Long before the Vine Street Expressway, the damage had already been done. When I was a child, up through college, Vine street was an approximately 10 lane surface street until somewhere between 15th and 17th Street, where it went below grade. It wasn't until the late 80s that the below grade portion was extended eastward. The current expressway is actually an improvement, since the fabric of the city in that area was long since destroyed. A little more vision and capping it at the time would've been nice, but we'll get there.

This is exactly why I don't consider the Vine Street Expressway to be the worst highway in the city, at least between 9th Street and the 76 interchange. I say this as someone who used to walk to my office in Center City via 16th Street back when I lived in Fairmount. Although it certainly creates a chasm between Center City and North Philly, it is the easiest chasm to repair once the political will cap it materializes. The political will to reroute 95 over the entirety of the Jersey Turnpike and eliminate the section of highway between the Oregon Avenue and (at least) Girard Avenue interchanges will likely never materialize.

95 and 76 are much worse than 676. In fact, I'd argue that US 1 (Roosevelt Boulevard and the Roosevelt Expressway) are far more disruptive than 676. The current configuration of the Boulevard reminds me of the pictures I've seen of Vine Street from the 1950s-1970s.

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by PhilliesPhan

This is exactly why I don't consider the Vine Street Expressway to be the worst highway in the city, at least between 9th Street and the 76 interchange. I say this as someone who used to walk to my office in Center City via 16th Street back when I lived in Fairmount. Although it certainly creates a chasm between Center City and North Philly, it is the easiest chasm to repair once the political will cap it materializes. The political will to reroute 95 over the entirety of the Jersey Turnpike and eliminate the section of highway between the Oregon Avenue and (at least) Girard Avenue interchanges will likely never materialize.

95 and 76 are much worse than 676. In fact, I'd argue that US 1 (Roosevelt Boulevard and the Roosevelt Expressway) are far more disruptive than 676. The current configuration of the Boulevard reminds me of the pictures I've seen of Vine Street from the 1950s-1970s.

Of all the things we could spend money on in the city in terms of infrastructure this would be like #20 or 25 for me. I'm not even that hyped about the 95 cap. We've sorta managed around it and with that cap, what happens to Delaware Avenue, which has become quite nice IMO with the latest rounds of improvement. Will it just be submerged in a tunnel?

[AnEmperorPenguin]

Originally Posted by TempleGuy1000

Callowhill was the Kensington Ave. of it's day.

well, would the city be better off if we urban renewal-ed Kensington with a highway tomorrow? I would say no.

Also fwiw I wouldn't say 676 is the worst, I just commented because someone said it was "good" urbanism, which I thought was insane

Originally Posted by cardeza

It is also almost inconceivable to think about this link not being there now that its been open for 30 years. Having all that traffic dumping onto a super wide regular "street" would not be good for center city..

Typically the traffic disappears as people realize their trip would take longer then they want and they don't go, they car pool, they go around, etc, but it would probably be a headache as everyone is figuring it out

[allovertown]

Originally Posted by AnEmperorPenguin

well, would the city be better off if we urban renewal-ed Kensington with a highway tomorrow? I would say no.

Also fwiw I wouldn't say 676 is the worst, I just commented because someone said it was "good" urbanism, which I thought was insane



Typically the traffic disappears as people realize their trip would take longer then they want and they don't go, they car pool, they go around, etc, but it would probably be a headache as everyone is figuring it out

I agree that 676 is definitely not "good urbanism." It's submerged though. So present day, it's just a lot less intrusive than 76 or 95 and feels much less like a barrier.

They were all incredibly destructive and this city would be a lot better off if they'd never been built. But if you're looking forward at what the city should do to change their highways in the future, 676 is the only one where it likely makes sense to basically keep it in its entirety. The best futures for 95 and 76 are for those highways to be dismantled through much of their footprint in the city. 676 makes sense to just cap.

[Nanyika]

Originally Posted by TempleGuy1000

Callowhill was the Kensington Ave. of it's day. People called Franklin Square, and the blocks down Race St., Skid Row because it was lined with bums and drunks. Further down towards Broad and Vine was such a hellish industrial wasteland, it inspired David Lynch's famous dystopian film 'Eraserhead'. The re-telling of "vibrant" communities feels real similar to the way people are trying to gaslight about the Fashion District and Market East.

Well, not exactly. I am old enough to remember those areas before the city demolished virtually the entire neighborhood from Race to Spring Garden and erected the highway interchange that isolated Franklin Square. Eighth Street was the center of what used to be Philadelphia’s popular theater district, but the theaters closed and and the area deteriorated after the War. I remember the cheap boarding houses, restaurants, bars, and missions — and the unemployed World War II and Korean War vets. These men were older workers who could no longer find jobs; many of them had turned to drink, or suffered from PSTD.

Also, the area had a significant permanent residential population, including Chinese Americans. So, the streets were not exclusively "lined with bums."

And the bars served people who lived or worked in the district, including seamen and dockworkers, back when the nearby area was a working port. Up until the end of the 1960s, the streets east of Franklin Square still contained a number of businesses that sold materials for the maritime trade. To the west were larger industrial plants. The neighborhood was a bit shabby in places, but it was still humming, and was often quite beautiful architecturally.

[Jayfar]

Originally Posted by Nanyika

Also, the area had a significant permanent residential population, including Chinese Americans. So, the streets were not exclusively "lined with bums."

Recall that Jane Jacobs coined the term “leisured indigent” to describe the denizens of Franklin Square.

https://whyy.org/articles/jane-jacob...ginal-squares/

[TempleGuy1000]

K&A was probably an extreme example. It's just always been my impression that Callowhill was viewed as a very undesirable area and had visible signs of societal decay.

[TempleGuy1000]

Housing permitting cratered in 2022 after a surge last year. Here’s what happened.

Philadelphia is on track to see the lowest number of housing units permitted for construction in nearly 10 years by the end of 2022.

That slump notably comes after a banner year, with the equivalent of several decades worth of new construction projects green-lit just in 2021.

So what, exactly, is going on?

The answer is a mix of local policymaking, especially the curtailing of the city’s 10-year property tax abatement at the close of 2021 — triggering a mad dash of developers to rushing to make use of it before last year’s end — and a faltering national economic climate.

[chimpskibot]

Originally Posted by TempleGuy1000

Housing permitting cratered in 2022 after a surge last year. Here’s what happened.

I think 2021 was just business in hyperdrive for a myriad of reasons; low rates, influx of residents from hcol cities and the 10-year abatement being phased out. That being said I think we are returning to a baseline of development which is good! I also think that there so many multi-family buildings under construction right now that many smaller players want to see where the cards fall in terms of lease-up time, comps, % of units leased, etc. just think of how different Delaware Ave and spring garden will look next year.

[PHLtoNYC]

Originally Posted by TempleGuy1000

Housing permitting cratered in 2022 after a surge last year. Here’s what happened.

I'm not a data wizard, but it would be interesting to see a comparison of housing data in the largest US cities from 2019-2022. And reassuring if this trend is similar across the board. If not, do policy changes drive the slowdown moreso than the general economic climate? I'm not sure, just thinking out loud...

But to chimpskibot point, there may be a waiting game for some developers to see the absorption rates of all these massive new projects.

OT, I roll my eyes when I see quotes from Helen Gym...

[summersm343]

Nobody should be surprised by a lower permit count in 2022 than 2021. Everybody knows developers were rushing through the process to get approvals before the 10 year tax abatement ended.

Also, aside from a nationwide slow down in housing starts and higher interest rates, coupled with a sense of unease about the economy.... there's also been an assault on development in Philadelphia. Aside from a reduction in the tax abatement, there's also been quite a few areas of the city that have been downzoned or have had completely ridiculous and restrictive zoning overlays for affordable housing requirements, etc.

On top of all of that, it's probably the most expensive time EVER to build anything with product delays and shortages, worker shortages, inflation/cost of materials, etc.

Of course, Philadelphia is also seeing high crime rates and lawlessness, and that could be playing into things as well.

[summersm343]

New Murals Jazz Up 320 Units Under Construction Near Temple

Current progress:


Project renderings:






Read/view more here:
https://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-phil...on-near-temple

[summersm343]

A Seven-story, 81-room Mystery Hotel for Parking Lot in Chinatown

Current site:




Site plans:

One of those instances is at the Patriot Parking lot at 225-39 N. 13th St. in the northwest corner of the neighborhood. This typical surface parking lot takes up the north half of the block south of Summer St. between 13th St. and Winters Ct., separating it from rowhouse neighbors to the east.

Thanks to a recent zoning document, we knew there were plans to combine the lots here, ostensibly to prepare for a future development. Early this week, however, while browsing the daily zoning reports over our morning coffee, we saw a permit for 81 rooms of visitor accommodations over ground floor commercial space – seemingly setting the stage for a seven-story hotel. Details are limited, but thanks to another zoning document, we have at least a rough idea of what’s planned.

Read/view more here:
https://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-phil...t-in-chinatown

[summersm343]

Callowhill Apartments Getting Close to Completion on a Lonely Block

Current progress:

he property at 1823 Callowhill St. is rising on one of those former lots, where The Baldwin is adding 57 one- and two-bedroom apartments to the fold.

We checked in back in March, when signs of verticality were just starting to show for this project. Things have clearly been moving since then for this project from Orens Brothers, as the building is topped out and most of the upper facade is installed. Work is still very much on-going, and you can see it start to resemble the design from Wulff Architects, which has utilized a modular construction approach. A fresh food grocer and two other retail spaces will take up the ground floor, continuing the recent retail trend for this property, which was home to a beer garden a couple summers back.

Read/view more here:
https://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-phil...a-lonely-block

[summersm343]

15-Unit Project Gets Design Update in Powelton Village Historic District

Read/view more here:
http://www.rising.realestate/15-unit...oric-district/

[gjrip]

Originally Posted by summersm343

15-Unit Project Gets Design Update in Powelton Village Historic District

Read/view more here:
http://www.rising.realestate/15-unit...oric-district/

RIP Kimey's I still miss their breakfast sandwiches...

But WOW that looks really great. Love the updated design.

[BroadandMarket]

Originally Posted by summersm343

Callowhill Apartments Getting Close to Completion on a Lonely Block

Read/view more here:
https://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-phil...a-lonely-block

That is remarkably ugly but at least there are big vacant lots on both sides that could potentially have a great buildings to distract attention away from this.