HOUSTON | Development Thread II - Page 607

llamaorama · #**12121** Posted **Jul 15, 2021, 12:02 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by JManc

DFW passed Houston sometime in the late 80's.

I don't think so, Dallas and Tarrant Counties combined were a tiny bit larger even back in 1950, and that's being very very generous and combining Harris and Galveston counties which I am only doing to make a point.

Harris County: 806,701
https://txcip.org/tac/census/hist.php?FIPS=48201

Galveston County: 113,066
https://txcip.org/tac/census/hist.php?FIPS=48167

Total: 919,767

Dallas County in 1950: 614,799
https://txcip.org/tac/census/hist.php?FIPS=48113

Tarrant County in 1950: 361,253
https://txcip.org/tac/census/hist.php?FIPS=48439

Total: 976,052

I think this explains a lot about why Dallas paradoxically feels a little smaller than Houston. How big a city was in 1950 is a nice proxy for how "urban" it is now, because it was right before freeways and the deaths of downtowns and main streets, etc.

In DFW, older neighborhoods are split between Dallas and Fort Worth and among some of the suburbs. In contrast, Houston in 1950 was the only real city in all of Harris County, everything else was really tiny.

DCReid · #**12122** Posted **Jul 15, 2021, 12:22 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by llamaorama

I don't think so, Dallas and Tarrant Counties combined were a tiny bit larger even back in 1950, and that's being very very generous and combining Harris and Galveston counties which I am only doing to make a point.

Harris County: 806,701
https://txcip.org/tac/census/hist.php?FIPS=48201

Galveston County: 113,066
https://txcip.org/tac/census/hist.php?FIPS=48167

Total: 919,767

Dallas County in 1950: 614,799
https://txcip.org/tac/census/hist.php?FIPS=48113

Tarrant County in 1950: 361,253
https://txcip.org/tac/census/hist.php?FIPS=48439

Total: 976,052

I think this explains a lot about why Dallas paradoxically feels a little smaller than Houston. How big a city was in 1950 is a nice proxy for how "urban" it is now, because it was right before freeways and the deaths of downtowns and main streets, etc.

In DFW, older neighborhoods are split between Dallas and Fort Worth and among some of the suburbs. In contrast, Houston in 1950 was the only real city in all of Harris County, everything else was really tiny.

Actually, Houston metro nearly caught up to DFW - in 1983 at the height of the oil bubble - and we know what happened after that.

bilbao58 · #**12123** Posted **Jul 15, 2021, 3:25 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by llamaorama

I think this explains a lot about why Dallas paradoxically feels a little smaller than Houston.

I don't understand what's paradoxical about it. Dallas is smaller than Houston. Quite a bit smaller. As everyone knows, Dallas city proper has a million less people in it, but, more important, although the metro areas are of similar size (yes, I know DFW is larger), there are 2.5 million people in DFW focused on a completely different city than Dallas. All of Houston's metro population is focused on Houston.

ILUVSAT · #**12124** Posted **Jul 15, 2021, 4:26 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by bilbao58

I don't understand what's paradoxical about it. Dallas is smaller than Houston. Quite a bit smaller. As everyone knows, Dallas city proper has a million less people in it, but, more important, although the metro areas are of similar size (yes, I know DFW is larger), there are 2.5 million people in DFW focused on a completely different city than Dallas. All of Houston's metro population is focused on Houston.

Dallas (2019-City): 1,343,573 (~340 SqMi - 3,955 people/SqMi)
Houston (2019-City): 2,320,268 (~640 SqMi - 3,619 people/SqMi)

DFW (2020-MSA): 7,694,138 (~8,674 SqMi - 873 people/SqMi)
Houston (2020-MSA): 7,154,478 (~8,268 SqMi - 855 people/SqMi)

DFW (2020-CSA): 8,186,093 (~15,533 SqMi - 519 people/SqMi)
Houston (2020-CSA): 7,340,823 (~11,835 SqMi - 613 people/SqMi)

NOTE: Area size vs. population. Notice how close they are in people/square mile.

*Based on numbers provided by the U.S. Census Bureau

bilbao58 · #**12125** Posted **Jul 15, 2021, 4:42 AM**

And?

The population density of Boston is higher than that of Chicago but Boston is quite a bit smaller than Chicago and it definitely feels that way.

DFW is still made up of two separate cities.

ETA: This is the reason Houston feels larger. From Emporis. Houston left, Dallas right.
The numbers do not represent the actual number of existing buildings. Emporis includes
proposed but never built.

It's not a value judgement. It doesn't make either city better than the other. It's simply the way things are.

JManc · #**12126** Posted **Jul 15, 2021, 5:39 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by llamaorama

I don't think so, Dallas and Tarrant Counties combined were a tiny bit larger even back in 1950, and that's being very very generous and combining Harris and Galveston counties which I am only doing to make a point.

Harris County: 806,701
https://txcip.org/tac/census/hist.php?FIPS=48201

Galveston County: 113,066
https://txcip.org/tac/census/hist.php?FIPS=48167

Total: 919,767

Dallas County in 1950: 614,799
https://txcip.org/tac/census/hist.php?FIPS=48113

Tarrant County in 1950: 361,253
https://txcip.org/tac/census/hist.php?FIPS=48439

Total: 976,052

I think this explains a lot about why Dallas paradoxically feels a little smaller than Houston. How big a city was in 1950 is a nice proxy for how "urban" it is now, because it was right before freeways and the deaths of downtowns and main streets, etc.

In DFW, older neighborhoods are split between Dallas and Fort Worth and among some of the suburbs. In contrast, Houston in 1950 was the only real city in all of Harris County, everything else was really tiny.

I remember when it was announced on the local news...around 1987/ 1988.

bilbao58 · #**12127** Posted **Jul 15, 2021, 6:02 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by JManc

I remember when it was announced on the local news...around 1987/ 1988.

I'm picturing Dave Ward crying.

JManc · #**12128** Posted **Jul 15, 2021, 10:32 PM**

Taken on Sunday (on rare occasion it wasn't raining). Texas Tower & Brava (far right) adding more width to the skyline.

Houston Skyline by ConfusedWithACamera, on Flickr

mousquet · #**12129** Posted **Jul 15, 2021, 10:49 PM**

^ Lol, damn, that's a million-dollar shot, huh. The sky and light are absolutely a rare sight (to me).
There may frequently be strange lights out there, though.
It must be a local atmosphere, I guess.

clubtokyo · #**12130** Posted **Jul 16, 2021, 2:06 AM**

Have traveled frequently to both Dallas and Houston and I have to agree Houston feels way bigger than Dallas. It just feels more developed and interesting. I think Houston is messy, but for some reason it works lol.

llamaorama · #**12131** Posted **Jul 16, 2021, 2:15 AM**

I think central Houston beats central Dallas, while DFW has nicer suburbs with more things to do.

AviationGuy · #**12132** Posted **Jul 16, 2021, 3:39 AM**

What caused the strange color in the JManc photo. I've never seen that before. Was it related to the dust that came in from Africa?

The Best Forumer · #**12133** Posted **Jul 16, 2021, 3:04 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by AviationGuy

What caused the strange color in the JManc photo. I've never seen that before. Was it related to the dust that came in from Africa?

Likely. That and a filter. Nice shot by the way. Keep up the good work.

Montrose1100 · #**12134** Posted **Jul 16, 2021, 3:30 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by AviationGuy

What caused the strange color in the JManc photo. I've never seen that before. Was it related to the dust that came in from Africa?

Editing.

bilbao58 · #**12135** Posted **Jul 16, 2021, 4:32 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by mousquet

^ Lol, damn, that's a million-dollar shot, huh. The sky and light are absolutely a rare sight (to me).
There may frequently be strange lights out there, though.
It must be a local atmosphere, I guess.

Looks like a mixture of low-level fog (or smoke or smog or even dust) and digital post-processing. I can assure the sky in Houston is blue, just like in France (though maybe not quite as blue as it seems in Paris).

Bottle Neck by bill barfield, on Flickr

bilbao58 · #**12136** Posted **Jul 16, 2021, 4:36 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by AviationGuy

What caused the strange color in the JManc photo. I've never seen that before. Was it related to the dust that came in from Africa?

The photo is dated July 10, 2021. There wasn't any African dust last week, was there? ETA: NEVER MIND! Looks like there was. That's what I get for eschewing local media!

JManc · #**12137** Posted **Jul 16, 2021, 5:10 PM**

Sky was naturally yellowish from the sunset but yeah, it was exaggerated in post for effect to make the skyline 'pop' more. It took this shortly before:

Houston Skyline by ConfusedWithACamera, on Flickr

bilbao58 · #**12138** Posted **Jul 16, 2021, 5:34 PM**

^Texas Tower almost looks crenellated in silhouette and from a distance.

The Best Forumer · #**12139** Posted **Jul 16, 2021, 5:55 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by JManc

Sky was naturally yellowish from the sunset but yeah, it was exaggerated in post for effect to make the skyline 'pop' more. It took this shortly before:

Houston Skyline by ConfusedWithACamera, on Flickr

What are you doing on the east side lulz.

The Best Forumer · #**12140** Posted **Jul 16, 2021, 5:56 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by bilbao58

^Texas Tower almost looks crenellated in silhouette and from a distance.

I know... kinda like the one up in pittsburgh.