Sports in Canadian culture

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by esquire

I've been hearing reports of organized hooligan violence at the Euro 2016 tournament in France... I have to say, I find this to be one element of European sports culture that I do not envy one bit.

Obviously there have been incidents of fan violence in Canada through the years as well as riots (Vancouver, Montreal), but the former tends to be mostly isolated incidents and the latter is rarely about the sport itself. Certainly there is no parallel to the weird culture in Europe of soccer hooliganism where subsets of fans go to events mainly to engage in brawling and violence.... thank goodness for that.

It wasn't soccer fans getting into fights, though, at least in the towns and outside the stadium. It was mostly Russian guys looking for fights, which is why the Russian federation has been reprimanded. For an event the size of EURO there has been little to no hooliganism to the extent that you're elaborating on. It's not as if every French host city has riot police walking the streets day and night to patrols against gangs of hooligans.

The Brits always have a hard time going anywhere because they have this attitude about history and wars and creating football that it typically doesn't go over well with other folks.

The fan violence outside of the stadium at this EURO is the exact same as fan violence in Vancouver after losing cup final - not sports fans, just people looking for an excuse.

[rousseau]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ How did that ever become part of European soccer culture? I know from having attended "heated rivalry" games like the NHL/CFL battle of Alberta and various Sask/Winnipeg games you do hear some salty language and see the odd idiots go too far, but for the most part there is a spirit of friendly rivalry in keeping with sporting ideals.

Small distances affording easy travel to away matches. For Euro matches, supporters can do a two or three-day excursion to France pretty easily.

Add in long traditions of passionate supporters that we don't know much about here, save for facsimiles with franchises like the Yankees, Canadiens, Leafs etc. Sports in North America feels like more of a flighty commodity, with franchises coming and going and players getting traded willy-nilly. It feels like a jig-saw puzzle, whereas in Europe football is sacred, and the local clubs are hewn into the fabric of the communities (regardless of the fact that some of them are owned by Arab business magnates). Players don't get moved around one year to the next quite like they do here, allowing for a greater bond with the team.

The idea that Chelsea or Manchester United could be bought and moved to Edinburgh is fantastically preposterous. It's utterly unthinkable. But longstanding sports franchises in North America get moved around all the time: Brooklyn-Los Angeles Dodgers, Seattle Sonics-OKC Thunder, Cleveland-Los Angeles-St. Louis-Los Angeles Rams, New York-San Francisco Giants, a dozen NHL teams, a dozen other NBA teams, etc.

The allegiances in North American sports aren't as strong. Save maybe for US college football and basketball, which comes close to approximating the die-hard connection Europeans have to their football clubs. Think about it: it's one thing to go to all the home games and parade in the street when you win a championship, but it's quite another to travel by train to an away match with ten of your best mates to join thousands in the "away section" of the opposing side's ground. That's how it gets tribal with European football.

Only US college football and basketball approximates this, where some alumni actually will travel to attend so-called "homecoming" games.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by rousseau

The idea that Chelsea or Manchester United could be bought and moved to Edinburgh is fantastically preposterous. It's utterly unthinkable. But longstanding sports franchises in North America get moved around all the time: Brooklyn-Los Angeles Dodgers, Seattle Sonics-OKC Thunder, Cleveland-Los Angeles-St. Louis-Los Angeles Rams, New York-San Francisco Giants, a dozen NHL teams, a dozen other NBA teams, etc.

As a comparison, a team relocating has only happened once in nearly 150 years of English football, about a decade ago when Wimbledon moved to MK Dons. Since then, MK Dons have been a middling third or fourth tier team whilst Wimbledon was reborn by fans as AFC Wimbledon and have seen steady promotion up the ladder. Next season will be the first time the original club that was moved will be playing the new local successor club. It's going to be great and is the sort of story that is impossible in North America.

http://twohundredpercent.net/league-...imbledon-rise/

Originally Posted by TwoHundredPercent

Then, of course, there’s that club. You know. That club. Since the events of May 2002, they’ve only met in the Football League Trophy, the League Cup and the FA Cup, with their opponents having won two of their previous three meetings. Perhaps these cup matches will temper the atmosphere of these two clubs, perhaps it won’t. What we can say with a degree of certainty is that meeting them in league matches, as equals, will feel very different to those three prior engagements with them. It says something for the failure of the Milton Keynes project and a lot for the success of the AFC Wimbledon project that the two clubs should be meeting in the league next seasons, and it’s difficult to believe that this is anything that those who uprooted Wimbledon FC from South London to sixty miles away in Buckinghamshire ever expected to see. But before anybody starts getting ahead of themselves, this is not a “local derby”. This is something bigger than that, and in many ways darker than that. This is something… other.

[Acajack]

In a perfect world we'd have all of the good of North American and European pro sports and none of the bad.

I find many non-North American sports more compelling and fun to follow, but the behaviourial issues at many matches would make me think twice about attending with my kids.

I mean, just look at the current Euro tournament. From a sporting perspective it's a fantastic spectacle, but in some French cities I'd be concerned walking down the street with my kids right now, let alone inside a stadium for an actual game trapped with a bunch of these wackos.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I find many non-North American sports more compelling and fun to follow, but the behaviourial issues at many matches would make me think twice about attending with my kids.

I mean, just look at the current Euro tournament. From a sporting perspective it's a fantastic spectacle, but in some French cities I'd be concerned walking down the street with my kids right now, let alone inside a stadium for an actual game trapped with a bunch of these wackos.

This is mostly because only in North America are sports viewed as this family-friendly consumerist environment and it's only built that way to maximize potential profit.

I attended a NYCFC/New York Red Bulls match in The Bronx a few weeks back and that certainly wasn't a child-friendly place to be, either. Neither are a lot of junior hockey games in Canada. I think you're letting the media's perception of hooligans in EU scare you when in reality a lot of sporting events aren't really great for children if the match is heated and fans are into it.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Acajack

In a perfect world we'd have all of the good of North American and European pro sports and none of the bad.

I find many non-North American sports more compelling and fun to follow, but the behaviourial issues at many matches would make me think twice about attending with my kids.

I mean, just look at the current Euro tournament. From a sporting perspective it's a fantastic spectacle, but in some French cities I'd be concerned walking down the street with my kids right now, let alone inside a stadium for an actual game trapped with a bunch of these wackos.

Even if the media is sensationalizing events in France, there's no question that there are still violent incidents taking place... both inside the stadium (which rarely happens here on a mass scale) and outside.

Some of this stuff appears to go beyond team loyalties... with the Russian hooligans who appear to be receiving tacit state endorsement for their actions, it almost looks like they're trying to make a political point.

I get the diehard team supporters, but with the Russians who show up with weapons and are obviously trained fighters, what is the point of that? That's not a superfan who is insulted because you called his favourite player a bad word, that's a guy whose main reason is to be there just to fight.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by JHikka

I attended a NYCFC/New York Red Bulls match in The Bronx a few weeks back and that certainly wasn't a child-friendly place to be, either. Neither are a lot of junior hockey games in Canada. I think you're letting the media's perception of hooligans in EU scare you when in reality a lot of sporting events aren't really great for children if the match is heated and fans are into it.

The soccer example doesn't count because as we all know, soccer fans in North America pretty well take all their cues from Europe.

[JHikka]

All of the hooliganism in EURO so far has been perpetrated by Russians who were confirmed to have been sent to France either by organized crime or by the Russian government itself. End of story. This isn't some mass endemic plaguing all nations and all host cities. This is clearly a Russia problem and not a hooligan problem. The sensationalization of violence around football and that it's just constant is insane.

Here's police praising Welsh fans:
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-36510601

Here's Northern Ireland and Poland fans singing together:
• Video Link

Irish fans in Paris singing to a random guy on a balcony:
• Video Link

Croat and Turkish fans getting together:
http://www.24sata.hr/sport/24sata-uz...rinceva-478412

The largest football tournament in the United States in 20 years has been ongoing and there's been no reports of any supporter or fan violence in any of the host cities for that tournament, which includes all nations from South America and select Central American and Caribbean sides.

[esquire]

^ So whether it's organized crime or the Russian government that's organizing it, what is the goal of whoever is behind Russian violence at Euro? I find the whole thing mystifying... I fail to see how some 23 year old Russian MMA enthusiast without a future pummeling on some middle aged Brit in the streets of Marseille advances any criminal or political agenda.

[mistercorporate]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ So whether it's organized crime or the Russian government that's organizing it, what is the goal of whoever is behind Russian violence at Euro? I find the whole thing mystifying... I fail to see how some 23 year old Russian MMA enthusiast without a future pummeling on some middle aged Brit in the streets of Marseille advances any criminal or political agenda.

Putin and his ilk are notoriously insecure. They're compensating, like all weak men.

[rousseau]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ So whether it's organized crime or the Russian government that's organizing it, what is the goal of whoever is behind Russian violence at Euro? I find the whole thing mystifying... I fail to see how some 23 year old Russian MMA enthusiast without a future pummeling on some middle aged Brit in the streets of Marseille advances any criminal or political agenda.

It's just testosterone-fuelled bragging rights. Going to another country to show everyone how bad-ass Russians are. Swelling with pride at the Youtube videos documenting the mayhem they unleash in the streets. Giving a beat-down to all and sundry. Especially the English hooligans, who were once the scourge of Europe back in the day.

[Riise]

Hooliganism is basically those disenchanted with their place in society using sport to blow off steam and rebel. With a higher standard of living and commercialization of sport in North America, we lack the basic ingredients for mass hooliganism.

[eemy]

I get the impression that the Russian government is trying to foster an us-versus-them mentality within Russia, probably in an attempt to stoke nationalistic furor, which tends to be a more friendly political environment for authoritarianism. If their intent is to get kicked out of the Euro tournament, the rhetoric at home will certainly be that Russia is being marginalized by the west etc. and play right into the narrative that they are trying to create.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by JHikka

This is mostly because only in North America are sports viewed as this family-friendly consumerist environment and it's only built that way to maximize potential profit.

I attended a NYCFC/New York Red Bulls match in The Bronx a few weeks back and that certainly wasn't a child-friendly place to be, either. Neither are a lot of junior hockey games in Canada. I think you're letting the media's perception of hooligans in EU scare you when in reality a lot of sporting events aren't really great for children if the match is heated and fans are into it.

Well, I've been to sporting events of all kinds all around the world.

I've been at soccer matches where the riot police stormed the stands with tear gas to disperse ultras that were getting out of hand. (Thankfully it was a big stadium and the ruckus was not in my section.)

I've also been in stadiums where we were locked in by police blocking all of the exits after the game until the visiting team was safely outside the city.

As far as sports in Canada and the U.S., based on my observations I'd say the least family-friendly would probably be NFL games. Especially in cities where the pre-game tailgating is pretty intense.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ So whether it's organized crime or the Russian government that's organizing it, what is the goal of whoever is behind Russian violence at Euro? I find the whole thing mystifying... I fail to see how some 23 year old Russian MMA enthusiast without a future pummeling on some middle aged Brit in the streets of Marseille advances any criminal or political agenda.

The CBC has an interesting piece on it today - self-organized hooligan "clubs" that train for their mayhem, apparently. Some sort of Russian "machismo" or whatever second-world label one would put on it.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/soccer-...ence-1.3636984

[esquire]

^ One theory floated on CBC, which seems a bit plausible all things considered, is that Moscow wouldn't mind if their national team got booted from Euro. Their team won't win anyway, and getting ejected feeds the persecution complex that the Kremlin is doing its best to feed. So naturally that puts UEFA in a bind... either tolerate the violence or get used as a political pawn for nefarious purposes.

[snowmobile]

In Canada we don't see much hooliganism because our main league is NHL and there isn't a supporter section in a hockey rink. Just a bunch of old guys sitting on their hands. In the CFL, you see a lot more rowdiness with beer snakes and drumming, etc.

Some junior A teams have to go through what some soccer teams do after the games by being escorted to the hotel when they play on reserves. Back when OCN Blizzard were a powerhouse, the arena up in the The Pas would scare any 16 year old rookie from Winnipeg.

[elly63]

The Strumbellas and Kardinal Offishall kick of Argos home opener
Argonauts Staff argonauts.ca June 17, 2016

The Argos home opener kicks off June 23, and to kick it off right the we’ve got the Strumbellas and Kardinal Offishall performing a free concert at the SiriusXM Kickoff Show for anyone with a ticket to the game!

The SiriusXM Kickoff Show will be held in “The Shipyard,” the Argos’ new pre-game fan festival space located at the foot of Hotel X and in front of the Stanley Barracks at Exhibition Place. The outdoor festival area will serve BBQ food and drinks, including $4 beers, prior to every game at BMO Field this season. Spread across acres of licensed patio, The Shipyard will be a place for Argos fans to meet up before the game to eat, drink and socialize before heading into the stadium.



“We launched tailgating last week, and today, we are excited to introduce “The Shipyard,” an outdoor festival space for fans who commute or arrive by foot or bike and are looking for a pregame party,” – Sara Moore, Argos Senior Vice President, Business Operations.

Kardinal Offishall will be on stage at 4:30pm ET, while the Strumbellas take to the stage at 5:30pm ET.

The six-piece Canadian band won a Juno in 2014 for their album, We Still Move On Dance Floors. The band’s new album, Hope, earned a spot on the coveted 2016 Polaris Music Prize Long List that was announced this week.

Kardinal Offishall is a four-time Juno Award winner, taking home the honour for Single of the Year for “Dangerous” in 2009 and winning three times for R&B/Soul Recording of the Year (1999, 2000 and 2014).

[Horus]

Full credit to the new Argos ownership. They're making a good effort to make the team relevant in Toronto again.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Well, I've been to sporting events of all kinds all around the world.

I've been at soccer matches where the riot police stormed the stands with tear gas to disperse ultras that were getting out of hand. (Thankfully it was a big stadium and the ruckus was not in my section.)

I've also been in stadiums where we were locked in by police blocking all of the exits after the game until the visiting team was safely outside the city.

And I and my bantam-aged hockey team had to be escorted by RCMP out of a hockey rink in Summerside one wintry February night because we beat their team out of their tournament and people started throwing items on the ice and fighting in the stands. People get riled up for bizarre reasons.

Sports teams in North America don't have the local, cultural, or religious affiliations that European clubs do on a grand scale. It's a bit of a stretch to want to fight people of another billionaire's team to protect your own billionaire's team, you know? At least in Europe there's decades and centuries of teams representing local crafts and traditions and customs even if some may be owned by rich Qataris.