The Canadian Electric Vehicle thread

[Wigs]

A lot of gas stations are going to have to offer charging stations or be put out of business as gasoline for passenger vehicles declines

[Tvisforme]

Originally Posted by urbandreamer

....An EV is great if you're a typical boring commuter who takes the same route everyday, prefers watching movies and eating chain food vs actually seeing this country and hiking etc.

Seriously, posting nonsense like the above is what you consider to be a good use of your time?

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by Wigs

A lot of gas stations are going to have to offer charging stations or be put out of business as gasoline for passenger vehicles declines

A lot of gas stations will be going out of business next decade. It's not just EVs. It's also all those Hybrids making vehicles more fuel efficient. Gas sales aren't that profitable for them. They make all their profits from the convenience store business. And if people visit the gas station less and less that business declines.

Major cities are already seeing gas stations get redeveloped in their urban cores. This trend is going to slowly spread out to the suburbs as suburbanites buy EVs they can charge in their garages.

It's actually a good thing. Gas stations often sit on decent locations. Good locations to be redeveloped in to plazas or apartments or corner stores.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by Rollerstud98

That’s why it works for you. If I’m going somewhere we drive to get there. Taking a couple extra days on a 6 day drive is not my idea of time well spent.

Most people wouldn't spend 6 days on the road to spend 2.5 days at a destination either. That's not really a vacation for most. I'm starting to think some of y'all don't understand how much of an edge case you really are.

In an event, assuming the route you describe couldn't have been done by an EV is flat out wrong. Petro-Canada built their Trans-Canada EV network to facilitate exactly this kind roadtrip. And it wouldn't have cost you the $1100+ in fuel that you spent on your 11L/100 km F-350 getting there and back.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

I'm starting to think some of y'all don't understand how much of an edge case you really are.

Speaking only for myself, I'm well aware I'm an edge case.

Edgier than you think, even: I like to work on vehicles, do all my maintenance myself, making a cheap old ICEV (dirt cheap to insure, too) the greatest bang for the buck by far, plus I can fill up in NH with my U.S. card (no exchange rate penalty) which reduces the gap between ICEV cost per km and EV cost per km.

I love EVs and tech, but financially, even my most pro-EV friends (all of whom drive EVs now) had to admit that my total yearly transportation costs would increase if I stopped burning gasoline.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by lio45

My sis and I did Vancouver to Sherbrooke without any stops other than fuel/food/bathrooms, taking turns at the wheel. I did many such trips with either my dad or my gf, again taking turns at the wheel. It’s worth it to make sure you have a comfortable sleeping arrangement in the car; you have a good night’s worth of sleep and when you wake up you’re magically much closer to your destination. (Usually the driver likes to make the sleeper guess in which state we are now, at wake up time )

On my own road trips, I find it’s not worth it at all to pay for a hotel/motel; I’ll just stop in a rest area whenever I feel it’s time to stop for the day, and I’ll have a great uninterrupted 8 hours of sleep, as good as if I were in my bed. In winter it’s no problem when you’re dressed enough, the only times it can be less comfy is on very hot summer nights. Even then, the flexibility of stopping right there in a rest area, and resuming driving the next morning, is worth it, IMO.

I see I’m not alone in liking the driver change / sleeping co-pilot vs spending the night not moving …

Yes, people like you do exist, and in my younger days I have a few times done just this to save money. (I also even more frequently took night trains and slept in coach class when I had a rail pass to save on hostels and hotels when I was younger.)

You and your sister may have been a special combo (my dad and I could pull this off together too) but generally when you're not travelling solo it starts to get less possible to make it work. It would never have worked with my mom back in the day, or with my wife and kids today.

[lio45]

It worked well for my family when my sis and I were kids (my parents had a GM station wagon, a fairly large vehicle in which everyone was comfy enough to sleep), on Quebec-Florida trips.

I'm pretty sure there are plenty of modern vehicles large enough for a family of 4 to be comfy on cross-country road trips, but of course you have to be okay with that. My parents were always the "camping" type, so it was a breeze. My last gf on the other hand, was more like the princess type, she'd be the one insisting on a "proper" stop at a hotel for the night.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

Unless you're towing something heavy, I'm not really sure why you believe an EV can't do a roadtrip where you're driving 1000 km/day. That's possible with fast charging and would probably only take you 1-2 hrs per day more than driving an ICEV would with charging breaks and charging overnight at a hotel.

Here's an entire playlist of Norwegian YouTuber Bjorn Nyland doing 1000 km in various EVs. And here's his list of results:



If you're one of those people who thinks it's perfectly normal to drive 1500+ km per day and risk killing others on the road because of fatigue, then sure EVs can't do that. And personally I'm not sure that's a bad limitation to have.

In 2023 I did an 1100 km trip from Gatineau to northeastern New Brunswick in my Mustang Mach-E. My vehicle is not the top-performing Mach-E for range but when it's performing best I can get over 400 km out of it.

Both ways I did the trip with 3 charging stops. Two of the stops we made coincide with our meal stops. The third one we admittedly were looking for something to do so we ended up going to a nearby bar to chill and have a quick drink! (EVs have on-screen video games as well - my wife sometimes plays those when she is waiting for a charge.)

The entire round trip cost around 70 dollars in electricity. With my previous ICE vehicle it would have cost 400-450 dollars.

Temperatures were around 10-15C for most of the trip, though there was one stretch where it was 3-4C with light flurries.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by lio45

It worked well for my family when my sis and I were kids (my parents had a GM station wagon, a fairly large vehicle in which everyone was comfy enough to sleep), on Quebec-Florida trips.

I'm pretty sure there are plenty of modern vehicles large enough for a family of 4 to be comfy on cross-country road trips, but of course you have to be okay with that. My parents were always the "camping" type, so it was a breeze. My last gf on the other hand, was more like the princess type, she'd be the one insisting on a "proper" stop at a hotel for the night.

We did many ICE vehicle road trips to Florida when my kids were younger, and we'd get there in two days leaving from Gatineau.

The first day was typically longer and we'd leave very early (around 6 am), and we'd typically try and make it down to southern Virginia or northern North Carolina. Sit-down table service lunches and dinners en route plus short gas and pipi stops. (My wife doesn't like fast food.)

We'd check into a Hampton Inn or Holiday Inn Express around 9 or 10 pm in Nowheresville VA or NC.

The first day we'd do 1200-1400 km by splitting the driving (three quarters me, one quarter my wife).

The second would be shorter and get us to wherever we were going in Florida. Around 1000 km or a bit more.

I sometimes think of how we would make that trip with an EV now.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by Acajack

We did many ICE vehicle road trips to Florida when my kids were younger, and we'd get there in two days leaving from Gatineau.

The first day was typically longer and we'd leave very early (around 6 am), and we'd typically try and make it down to southern Virginia or northern North Carolina. Sit-down table service lunches and dinners en route plus short gas and pipi stops. (My wife doesn't like fast food.)

We'd check into a Hampton Inn or Holiday Inn Express around 9 or 10 pm in Nowheresville VA or NC.

The first day we'd do 1200-1400 km by splitting the driving (three quarters me, one quarter my wife).

The second would be shorter and get us to wherever we were going in Florida. Around 1000 km or a bit more.

I sometimes think of how we would make that trip with an EV now.

My round-trip routine is well honed by now: leave "reasonably" early on a given day, and arrive "reasonably" early the following evening, with a ~8 hours night in a rest area in the middle (usually somewhere in MD-WV-Northern Virginia).

My favored route nowadays (87-88-91) has zero tolls and completely dodges the BosWash Corridor (traffic and tolls).

Bonus, the approximate midpoint of the drive has three new state borders in short succession (MD-WV-VA on the way there, WV-MD-PA on the way back) so that's a perfect bunch of reliable State Welcome Centers to spend a restful ~8 hours night of sleep. If I feel okay sleep-wise when nearing the first one, I can decide to continue to the second one, or even the third one.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by lio45

My round-trip routine is well honed by now: leave "reasonably" early on a given day, and arrive "reasonably" early the following evening, with a ~8 hours night in a rest area in the middle (usually somewhere in MD-WV-Northern Virginia).

My favored route nowadays (87-88-91) has zero tolls and completely dodges the BosWash Corridor (traffic and tolls).

Bonus, the approximate midpoint of the drive has three new state borders in short succession (MD-WV-VA on the way there, WV-MD-PA on the way back) so that's a perfect bunch of reliable State Welcome Centers to spend a restful ~8 hours night of sleep. If I feel okay sleep-wise when nearing the first one, I can decide to continue to the second one, or even the third one.

You're braver than me as well. I am not too crazy about sleeping in a rest stop overnight with all of the shady characters you can encounter on the highways at night in the US. I might do it by myself, or with a buddy and maybe with my dad (when he was younger) but I definitely wouldn't with my wife and kids.

Though I have slept all alone (as in being the only person in the railcar) in an open regular class train coach on many occasions. With my bag padlocked to the rack above and my most important stuff (passport, cash, credit cards) strategically placed next to my crotch.

[urbandreamer]

Rest stops and truck stops are best. I've found campgrounds too noisy with kids and especially teenagers plus the wildlife etc means I had trouble sleeping. Since I'm cheap I was initially drawn to budget motels but bedbugs scare me. Sleeping in the back of my hatchback, rear seat removed, has proven the most comfortable and affordable solution. I put up my window cutouts (Reflectix with one side in black fabric), mosquito netting for ventilation and with a fan powered by a power station, I'm set for a good night's sleep. In Ontario and Quebec, I use my parks pass to use the showers etc.

Re: EVs. I asked Jim Farley to get a 4-door Ford Mustang sedan in production, or perhaps branded as a Thunderbird.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Rollerstud98

That’s why it works for you. If I’m going somewhere we drive to get there. Taking a couple extra days on a 6 day drive is not my idea of time well spent.

But we aren't talking about 6 days vs 8 days. Your post referenced non stop driving and sleeping in the car for 3000 kms over 24+ hours.

Actually not your post, you replied to my reply to somebody else.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

It is going to be a lot more than an hour extra Unless you are already making long meal stops you can combine with charging which of course is possible.

I've had to wait to charge a grand total of once on several road trips and maybe a few hundred fast charge sessions.

Most of the time you need to eat fast as the charging is about 20 mins, maybe 30 max. When you think about walking to the restaurant, ordering, hitting the bathroom, etc. you run out of time quickly.

Close fast food is a more reasonable example and you are back on the road right away.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

Most people wouldn't spend 6 days on the road to spend 2.5 days at a destination either. That's not really a vacation for most. I'm starting to think some of y'all don't understand how much of an edge case you really are.

It's hardly worth flying for that short of a stay.

[harls]

Originally Posted by Wigs

A lot of gas stations are going to have to offer charging stations or be put out of business as gasoline for passenger vehicles declines

Go into any gas station today and it is designed for you to pick up your overpriced crap and gtfo as soon as possible. Charging station convenience stores would have to offer someplace to sit down and wait with present technology.

They don't want to invest in a sit-down sort of infrastructure because they know EV range is going to continue to get better.

[travis3000]

I've done a road trip with my Tesla , Barrie to Montreal. A 620KM drive. I stopped ONCE going there and ONCE going back (I charged up for free at my hotel underground in Montreal so upon departing I was full of juice). I used that time to grab some food and stretch my legs. Total time to get there was 6.5 hours. With my ICE cars in the past it was the same time because who the hell wants to drive that long without stopping? Even with the ICE cars, i'd pull over on an OnRoute , get out, grab some snacks, go to the bathroom, fill up gas, etc.

With my Tesla the drive was maybe 15 minutes longer? Ive also done several road trips from Barrie to Rochester NY (360KM drive) to visit a friend. I can get there without needing to stop, even in the winter. I charge up while Im there, and then driving home I also don't need to stop.

Hardly a big deal. Some people in here are drama queens.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

I've had to wait to charge a grand total of once on several road trips and maybe a few hundred fast charge sessions.

Most of the time you need to eat fast as the charging is about 20 mins, maybe 30 max. When you think about walking to the restaurant, ordering, hitting the bathroom, etc. you run out of time quickly.

Close fast food is a more reasonable example and you are back on the road right away.

You also need to take your car off the charger when it's done, as a courtesy to others who may be waiting for it and to avoid getting dinged at a much higher rate by the charging company if you overstay your welcome.

I've been charging while eating at a sit-down restaurant and had to go outside to move my car because the charging was already done. (You can keep track of that on your phone via an app, so it's not that big a deal. In some places there are multiple chargers with different power levels, so you can also pick the one based on how much time you expect to be there.)

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by harls

Go into any gas station today and it is designed for you to pick up your overpriced crap and gtfo as soon as possible. Charging station convenience stores would have to offer someplace to sit down and wait with present technology.

They don't want to invest in a sit-down sort of infrastructure because they know EV range is going to continue to get better.

Norway offers a lot of lessons in how gas stations have to evolve to cater to EV drivers. They've basically had gas stations transform into fast food joints with charging. As Warren points out, 20-30 mins for charging isn't actually that much for a meal break.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Acajack

You also need to take your car off the charger when it's done, as a courtesy to others who may be waiting for it and to avoid getting dinged at a much higher rate by the charging company if you overstay your welcome.

That's true but I would rather just get back on the road most of the time. My wife does tolerate fast food.