LOS ANGELES | Transportation News & Discussion

[manrush]

Originally Posted by Westsidelife

Probably light rail with heavy rail capacity (5 cars). I just don't see how heavy rail would be financially feasible.

When I first saw it, the thing that excited me the most was the South Bay portion. There's an old ROW called the Greenbelt that runs along the coast, just blocks from the beach.

How about something akin to a light-regional stoptrein?


http://www.nicospilt.com/anderen/NL20080124_2402.JPG

Or this metro-like LRT/sneltram

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2622/...65bb4b9eb9.jpg

[DJasmin]

I've imagined a metrorail station at pier ave for years.

[Quixote]

Originally Posted by manrush

...

Or this metro-like LRT/sneltram

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2622/...65bb4b9eb9.jpg

Where is this?

Whatever the vehicles look like, they have to be compatible with the current LRT technology. There will be some shared track.

[Quixote]

• Video Link

[LtBk]

Originally Posted by Westsidelife

Where is this?

Whatever the vehicles look like, they have to be compatible with the current LRT technology. There will be some shared track.

Looks like it's somewhere in the Netherlands.

[pesto]

That is a classic Dutch train station: grade separated tracks; minimal station; very large parking lots surrounding the station; office clusters extending for a few hundred yards in most directions; highways connecting to quieter residential areas some distance away.

[202_Cyclist]

L.A. County transit authority buys Union Station for $75 million

The deal for the national landmark built in 1939 includes 38 acres and development rights to 5.9 million square feet of property around the station. It clears the way for the expansion of transit operations.


Built in 1939, Union Station is a national landmark and one of the last great railway facilities in the United States. It serves Amtrak, Metrolink, Metro subway lines, Gold Line light-rail trains, transit buses and FlyAway coaches that serve Los Angeles International Airport. (Robert Gauthier / Los Angeles Times / February 24, 2011)

By Dan Weikel
Los Angeles Times
February 25, 2011

"Los Angeles County transportation officials approved an agreement Thursday to buy historic Union Station in downtown L.A. for $75 million — a purchase that will clear the way for the expansion of transit operations and new development on the property.

The Los Angeles County Metropolitan Transportation Authority board decided to buy the rail hub from Catellus Operating Limited Partnership, which is owned by ProLogis based in Colorado. The deal, which is expected to close in 30 days, includes 38 acres and development rights to 5.9 million square feet of property around the station.

"Union Station is absolutely critical to the current and future mobility of our region," said county Supervisor Don Knabe, chairman of the MTA board. "We now have the ability to retain the historic nature of Union Station and prepare it to serve as a world-class, 21st century transportation hub."

MTA officials wanted control of the station to help accommodate an expected surge in passengers from the proposed Westside subway extension, a planned downtown connector for the region's light-rail lines, increased bus service and the state's high-speed rail system if it is built..."

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la...,4987467.story

[JDRCRASH]

Interesting. There's a planned development at the Green/Blue Line transfer station.



http://thesource.metro.net/2011/02/2...brook-station/

[edluva]

Originally Posted by 202_Cyclist

"Union Station is absolutely critical to the current and future mobility of our region," said county Supervisor Don Knabe, chairman of the MTA board. "We now have the ability to retain the historic nature of Union Station and prepare it to serve as a world-class, 21st century transportation hub."

MTA officials wanted control of the station to help accommodate an expected surge in passengers from the proposed Westside subway extension, a planned downtown connector for the region's light-rail lines, increased bus service and the state's high-speed rail system if it is built..."

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la...,4987467.story

union station is very modest. very far from being "world-class". it feels like my uncle's living room. don knabe should take a look at sf's transbay. that's a station.

la US may be due for expansion in 25 years, once westside subway and cahsr are in service.

[LAofAnaheim]

Originally Posted by edluva

union station is very modest. very far from being "world-class". it feels like my uncle's living room. don knabe should take a look at sf's transbay. that's a station.

la US may be due for expansion in 25 years, once westside subway and cahsr are in service.

Ed.....SF has a main train station? Which one? SF's Transbay Terminal is not even under construction. HSR has a big problem with SF...they have NO CENTRAL STATION. Los Angeles does. Union Station is one of the grandest stations in the US. It was called "the last great rail station" because it was the last one the federal government was involved with design and construction. It's one of the most filmed stations in the world due to its charm and beauty. I agree with the notion about a lack of retail, however, Famima!!, See's candies, Subway and Wetzels Pretzels opened in the last few months. Starbucks is opening soon. Again, you cannot even compare SF to LA with train stations. San Francisco has NO CENTRAL STATION. Face it..LA beat SF in this one.

[LAofAnaheim]

What do y'all think of the proposed service changes by Big Blue Bus?

http://www.bigbluebus.com/home/index.asp?noticeid=2

Some highlights:

More Rapid 7; less local Route 7: Study results indicate more than half of Pico Blvd. riders are choosing to board Rapid 7 buses over local Route 7 buses. As a result, BBB plans to increase Rapid 7 frequency and extend service to the Metro Red Line (Wilshire at Western), which requires a decrease in local Route 7 service frequency.

Convert Express 10 to Rapid 10: Increased street congestion has been slowing this primarily freeway-bound route. To speed this primarily commuter service back up, BBB plans to convert it from a local to a Rapid style service by reducing the number of stops along the route.

Goodbye, Route 13?: Ridership has dropped since both Rapid 7 and local Route 7 duplicate most of this service. Due to low demand and high peak hour cost of operation, BBB plans to discontinue this service to support improvements on more popular services.

Hello, Expo Light Rail!: When, where and how BBB will interface with this new service will be previewed.

If you want to attend a meeting, here is the schedule (note: I'll be at the Saturday, March 5th meeting):

Wednesday March 2 from 6–8 p.m.
Ken Edwards Center, Room 100
Take Routes 1, 2, 3, 5, 7, 8 or 9


Thursday March 3 from 6–8 p.m.
Palms/Rancho Park Library, 2nd Floor
2920 Overland Ave., L.A.
Take Route 8 or 12 to Westwood Blvd. @ National
(library is 2 blocks east on Overland)

Saturday March 5 from 2:30–5:30 p.m.
S.M. Main Library, 2nd Floor
Take Routes 1*, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7*, 8, 9, or 10* (closest services)


Tuesday March 8 from 6–8p.m.
Virginia Ave. Park, Thelma Terry Center
Take Route 7

**Wednesday March 9 from 12–2pm
UCLA’s Ackerman Union, Room 3517
Take Route 1, 2, 3, 8, 11, 12 or Super 12
(If driving from the south, use Parking Structure 6; from the north, use Parking Structure 4)

Thursday March 10 from 11am–1 pm
SMC Main Campus, Curriculum Development, Room 193
Take Route 6, 7, Rapid 7, 8, 11, Sunset Ride or Crosstown Ride

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by LAofAnaheim

Ed.....SF has a main train station? Which one? SF's Transbay Terminal is not even under construction. HSR has a big problem with SF...they have NO CENTRAL STATION. Los Angeles does. Union Station is one of the grandest stations in the US. It was called "the last great rail station" because it was the last one the federal government was involved with design and construction. It's one of the most filmed stations in the world due to its charm and beauty. I agree with the notion about a lack of retail, however, Famima!!, See's candies, Subway and Wetzels Pretzels opened in the last few months. Starbucks is opening soon. Again, you cannot even compare SF to LA with train stations. San Francisco has NO CENTRAL STATION. Face it..LA beat SF in this one.

I was gonna say; have you seen San Francisco's CalTrain station?

If edluva's uncle's living room feels like Union Station, then he must have a very large living room with Streamline Moderne and Mission Revival details.

[ardecila]

Sure, it's not a soaring lofty Roman basilica, but it's pretty great nonetheless. Certainly far better than New Orleans' train station. The little architectural charm it once had has been destroyed by neglect and ass-ugly renovations.

I do feel that LA deserves a bigger, more impressive central train station, though. This could easily be accomplished by building a giant trainshed at Union Station like Madrid Atocha.

[edluva]

Originally Posted by LAofAnaheim

It was called "the last great rail station" because it was the last one the federal government was involved with design and construction.

what does that even mean? what constitutes a "great rail station"? is it an elite inductee-only club or something? the fact that people reference hollow statements as some kind of fact leads me to believe they don't question anything so long as it agrees with their biases.

to be considered "one of the grandest stations" in the us is not a big deal. it's the u.s. there are plenty of relatively small cities in the u.s. with comparably "grand" main stations built in a different era. rehashing a quote you read in some socal railfan's weblog won't change that.

union station has nice architectural detail, but it's small. cute, maybe. grand it is not. great? hah. you need to get out more. like, maybe go back east, travel the world, and gain some perspective on exactly how "world class" we are.

and the transbay terminal site is under construction as we speak. the old terminal building is being demolished, and a temporary replacement terminal is being prepped nearby. meanwhile, l.a., a supposed big city, compares well with new orleans and is getting a starbucks. wow, greatness indeed . such parochialism.

[202_Cyclist]

LAofAnaheim
February 24th, 2011 at 2:05 pm

Comment from Metro's website:

LAofAnaheim
February 24th, 2011 at 2:05 pm
Wow..look at how much road space and cars occupy that area! Imagine, the amount of people on all those cars and roads probably do not equal the number of people on board that train. Unbelievable amount of open space dedicated to the car…unbelievable…

I agree--- try again on this one. The cloverleaf off the freeway and the six lane road next to the proposed transit-oriented development stand out. The vehicle turnaround should also be reworked or eliminated as it uses a lot of scarce land that could otherwise have housing and retail. The proposed Target development also looks horrible with that courtyard that faces inward instead of engaging the street.

[DJM19]

Originally Posted by ardecila

Sure, it's not a soaring lofty Roman basilica, but it's pretty great nonetheless. Certainly far better than New Orleans' train station. The little architectural charm it once had has been destroyed by neglect and ass-ugly renovations.

I do feel that LA deserves a bigger, more impressive central train station, though. This could easily be accomplished by building a giant trainshed at Union Station like Madrid Atocha.

Union Station will most likely be building a large trainshed relatively soon, for the HSR coming through.

This is what the high speed rail authority envisions:

via ushsr.com

Not an official design for the station, but something like that seems to be the base principle of what it would be like.

[LAofAnaheim]

Originally Posted by edluva

what does that even mean? what constitutes a "great rail station"? is it an elite inductee-only club or something? the fact that people reference hollow statements as some kind of fact leads me to believe they don't question anything so long as it agrees with their biases.

to be considered "one of the grandest stations" in the us is not a big deal. it's the u.s. there are plenty of relatively small cities in the u.s. with comparably "grand" main stations built in a different era. rehashing a quote you read in some socal railfan's weblog won't change that.

union station has nice architectural detail, but it's small. cute, maybe. grand it is not. great? hah. you need to get out more. like, maybe go back east, travel the world, and gain some perspective on exactly how "world class" we are.

and the transbay terminal site is under construction as we speak. the old terminal building is being demolished, and a temporary replacement terminal is being prepped nearby. meanwhile, l.a., a supposed big city, compares well with new orleans and is getting a starbucks. wow, greatness indeed . such parochialism.

There is a difference in modern stations opening today (Transbay and ARCTIC) compared to the historic old real Union Stations. I've traveled a lot in the United States, so I've seen my share of central stations. I wouldn't put any central stations in the United States within the same league as Hong Kong, London, Paris or Madrid. So that's a mute issue.

In the U.S. the most reknowned central rail stations are Penn Station, Washington Union Station and Grand Central Terminal in NY. And here's a site that even acknowledges putting LA Union Station in the same league: http://www.trainstations.com/info/be...ions-in-the-us

There's weekly architectural tours (I'm really sure no other station than the 3 mentioned have architecture tours), it was the gateway to the Pacific Ocean before passenger airline travel was introduced, during World War II thousands and thousands of servicemen would arrive via Union Station to be shipped out to Hawaii, and today if you see how crowded it is in rush hour, there's no single station west of Chicago that even comes close (again, SF has NO CENTRAL STATION and cannot be compared).

By the way, if you do a google search on "the last great train station", look at what the predominant results are. Fact is this is the last central station the United States government took apart in before the focus went to airports. Opened in 1939 it still has the historic charm.

These blanket statements you make about how great a SF station is has no basis when it's not even open. Plus, it will still never never be caled "the last great train station", LA has won that moniker.

[northbay]

Originally Posted by edluva

and the transbay terminal site is under construction as we speak. the old terminal building is being demolished, and a temporary replacement terminal is being prepped nearby. meanwhile, l.a., a supposed big city, compares well with new orleans and is getting a starbucks. wow, greatness indeed . such parochialism.

a) the temporary terminal is not 'being prepped', it's already operational (and has been so for months)

b) la is not a 'supposed' big city, IT IS a big city. having or not having a grand rail station doesn't have anything to do with a city being bigger or smaller.

c) calling someone parochial seems borderline name calling, it's certainly not a compliment.

[pesto]

Originally Posted by JDRCRASH

Interesting. There's a planned development at the Green/Blue Line transfer station.



http://thesource.metro.net/2011/02/2...brook-station/

Well, at least they have Fallas Paredes and Health Food.

The proposal clearly needs work to rationalize transit and density priorities, but more to the point: is there really enough density and demand in that area to support this kind of development? Or, more to the point: is this a pipe dream with no chance of finding investors or lessees?

I'm not arguing either way, just asking. I don't know this specific area.

[JDRCRASH]

Originally Posted by pesto

Well, at least they have Fallas Paredes and Health Food.

The proposal clearly needs work to rationalize transit and density priorities, but more to the point: is there really enough density and demand in that area to support this kind of development? Or, more to the point: is this a pipe dream with no chance of finding investors or lessees?

They don't talk about funding or whether it's available, but my guess is it's probably not breaking ground any time soon, at least in this economy.

I'm not arguing either way, just asking. I don't know this specific area.

The location is just north of Compton, on Wilmington Ave, between 119th street and the 105 Freeway. Currently the lot has a Food 4 Less, Radioshack, and Factory 2 U store, along with the usual fast food restaurants like McD's, KFC, Subway, etc. In other words, it's just another every day LA strip mall.

In the vincinity of the project lies the infamous MLK Jr. Hospital, along with small university buildings. There are also several empty parking lots in the area as well, opening up the possibility for further development near the Blue/Green transfer station. The only downside of this location is, obviously, the freeway. But other than that, there's a lot of potential for growth.

I'm hoping this area, as well as South LA in general, is looked at by developers in the next real estate boom.