[Saint John] Fundy Quay (South Market Wharf) | 19-6s | 70m-26m | U/C

[Pugsley]

Folks, maybe we don't need to get all worked up over something that isn't finished yet? Like the logical reasoning they probably need to have two entrances going forward - one for crew/equipment and another for residents? Hence why they likely have two entrances in place at the moment (and depending on uses likely have different standards in design to comply with code) and the finished product will likely be very different. This is going to be a build site for many more years. Maybe hold of the name calling and accusations of city staff being "morons" until it is done?

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

Leave it to UptownAdam to focus on something as bland and uninteresting as the entrance and exits to this development site.

The only thing I think we have to actually worry about with this development is our "band of Rothesayites" actually raising enough capital to see this project built to completion as shown in the renderings.

The Fundy Harbour Group have already had to beg for low interest government financing to help get a lone 6 storey building up over multiple years (and it's still not completed).

I think they'll be forced to beg for a lot more government financing in order to get the three, substantially larger high rises up in any sort of timely fashion... (or be more willing to let other outside investors get in on this lucrative and ambitious development project)






Personally, I don't really care if the government lends the FHG more money to get this project passed the finish line, but I don't think I want to see the government hand out forgivable loans or give out substantial funding for what can basically only be described as a luxury housing development. Though, I expect the GNB and feds will end up partially funding the development of the larger high rises in exchange for a certain % of units with affordable rents, as was the case with 99 King.

I'd much rather see the GNB and feds invest serious funds into publicly owned affordable housing developments, or at the very least, housing developments that are entirely composed of affordable/ deeply affordable rental, than partially subsidize projects like this or 99 King.

Though, again, I fully expect the Fundy Harbour Group apply for further low interest government financing in order to see this project built to completion and without any major compromise on the scope of the project, and I'm okay with that. These are the type of projects we need to see followed through to completion to help move Saint John forward and keep up the development momentum.

[cdnguys]

Originally Posted by EnvisionSaintJohn

Leave it to UptownAdam to focus on something as bland and uninteresting as the entrance and exits to this development site.

The only thing I think we have to actually worry about with this development is our "band of Rothesayites" actually raising enough capital to see this project built to completion as shown in the renderings.

The Fundy Harbour Group have already had to beg for low interest government financing to help get a lone 6 storey building up over multiple years (and it's still not completed).

I think they'll be forced to beg for a lot more government financing in order to get the three, substantially larger high rises up in any sort of timely fashion... (or be more willing to let other outside investors get in on this lucrative and ambitious development project)






Personally, I don't really care if the government lends the FHG more money to get this project passed the finish line, but I don't think I want to see the government hand out forgivable loans or give out substantial funding for what can basically only be described as a luxury housing development. Though, I expect the GNB and feds will end up partially funding the development of the larger high rises in exchange for a certain % of units with affordable rents, as was the case with 99 King.

I'd much rather see the GNB and feds invest serious funds into publicly owned affordable housing developments, or at the very least, housing developments that are entirely composed of affordable/ deeply affordable rental, than partially subsidize projects like this or 99 King.

Though, again, I fully expect the Fundy Harbour Group apply for further low interest government financing in order to see this project built to completion and without any major compromise on the scope of the project, and I'm okay with that. These are the type of projects we need to see followed through to completion to help move Saint John forward and keep up the development momentum.

Where are you coming up with “begging”? This was not the case and it’s an unfortunate theory to put out in the public realm.

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

lol, I guess it depends on your definition of “begging”… but sure, I could have just said apply.

Again though, the only thing I think we have to worry about with this project, is it getting built to competition as shown in the renders… not the entrances and exits to the construction site.

If it takes more low interest government financing to get this project passed the finish line… that won’t bother me at all, and I’ll be very glad to see it completed as outlined in these impressive renders.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by cdnguys

Where are you coming up with “begging”? This was not the case and it’s an unfortunate theory to put out in the public realm.

Yeah, that seems like a misread of the situation. The terms for the Apartment Construction Loan Program are quite favorable and it's no surprise that a developer would pursue that as an avenue of financing, particularly for a project like this. This program is perhaps a bit of a loophole for Atlantic Canadian developers as it's meant to incentivize the construction of purpose-build rental housing as opposed to the condos that are (or at least were) more dominant in Canada's larger cities. Since there is an oversupply of condo units in New Brunswick the program isn't as necessary here but it's still helpful if it makes projects like this one more feasible.

I'm also not aware of any forgivable loan programs for market rate housing. That would be truly bizarre.

[bingun]

I don't think we need to blow our speculation about the new road and entrances out of proportion. I can only speak for myself, but I am just making small talk while we wait for bigger progress.

It is not unusual to see Saint John or any other city perform infrastructure work and then rip it up again a few years later. It is our tax money, and I don't think it's unfair to point out instances of poor planning. Fingers crossed, this setup is intended to support further construction, and it will come together in a few years.

[darkharbour]

The white ceramic cladding is starting to be installed on the southwest side of the building:



Photo by me.

[cdnguys]

[bingun]

Finally! They seemed to be dragging out the insulation forever. We should hopefully get the finished look within the next month or so.

[cdnguys]

Originally Posted by bingun

Finally! They seemed to be dragging out the insulation forever. We should hopefully get the finished look within the next month or so.

It’s two guys hand cutting tiles - so could be longer if they don’t get help

[bingun]

Originally Posted by cdnguys

It’s two guys hand cutting tiles - so could be longer if they don’t get help

Haha, I will temper my expectations. I am just impatient to see this finish. I walked the Harbour Passage section around it yesterday in the warm weather, and it was great to see how many people were down there. A big shift from several years ago, when the Coast Guard buildings were still up.

Sadly, it seems a lot of the trees did not make it through last summer's drought; hopefully, they get those replaced this year. I think it will look great in future decades if they can get some of them to mature.

[jonny golden]

Question: Do we know how far advanced they are with the interior? Thanks.

[cdnguys]

Originally Posted by jonny golden

Question: Do we know how far advanced they are with the interior? Thanks.

At least metal studs are up. Even a few deliveries of wallboard but sure there is a lot more

[darkharbour]

Originally Posted by bingun

Sadly, it seems a lot of the trees did not make it through last summer's drought; hopefully, they get those replaced this year. I think it will look great in future decades if they can get some of them to mature.

It is a shame that a number of them suffered their first summer during a severe drought - a dangerously dry summer I'm sure was not expected right next to the harbour in Saint John. Many are doing fine and already adding some beautiful greenery to the area, but the ones closer to the tidal steps on the south side are basically all dead and could really stand to be replaced.

[darkharbour]

Originally Posted by cdnguys

At least metal studs are up. Even a few deliveries of wallboard but sure there is a lot more

You can see finished walls inside the bottom couple of floors now, I think the interior work is in full swing at this point as there are usually 3-4 dozen cars parked on site for workers on a daily basis.

[bingun]

Originally Posted by darkharbour

It is a shame that a number of them suffered their first summer during a severe drought - a dangerously dry summer I'm sure was not expected right next to the harbour in Saint John. Many are doing fine and already adding some beautiful greenery to the area, but the ones closer to the tidal steps on the south side are basically all dead and could really stand to be replaced.

One of the forgotten impacts of the drought. If you go to Queen Square, for example, there are several trees that did not make it through, especially on Queen Square North. They often have poor soil or drainage, or are competing with the grass for moisture.

I think when they plant these new trees for street reconstruction or projects, they often come with a one-year warranty, so hopefully they can be replaced fairly easily.

I know many don't care for street trees, but I think they're important and make a big difference to the livability of a residential area.