[pj3000]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

I always thought that Metro Philly was tilted to the PA side more than the NJ side. I also think that eastern PA towns, out to about Harrisburg, feel like little Philadelphias. Western PA is definitely its own thing, though.

Stating that Philadelphia is "tilted toward the PA side", how?

Maybe tilted to itself... meaning that the city is tilted more to its own in-state suburban "collar" counties (Delaware, Montgomery, Bucks, part of Chester) than it is to its NJ counterparts, sure, I'll agree there. But certainly not more tilted to eastern PA towns like you mention out to Harrisburg, etc. than it is to NJ/NY. As I mentioned above, there is no way that Philly somehow experiences more of a pull to York or Chambersburg or Harrisburg or Hershey than it experiences from NJ/NY. Philadelphia by and large looks to the east, not to the west.

Towns in the southeastern quad of PA looking like "little Philadelphias" really has nothing to do with the topic. It's not as if those towns influenced Philadelphia to become the way it is -- the opposite is true.

Originally Posted by UrbanRevival

I mean, I understand the point that geographically being located on the eastern edge of PA creates "spillover" effect, but that's just the dynamic of being a large metro area centered on state border. There's obviously an economic connection to NJ in the Philly area, but I think that's very distinctive from NJ being a "pull." In fact, it's quite the opposite; South Jersey is really pulled into the PA sphere, just as North Jersey is pulled into the NY sphere.

But again, the metro pull cuts both ways. Philly is the indisputable anchor of Southeastern PA, and yes, that pull most definitely goes as far north as the Lehigh Valley, and as far west as Southcentral PA, based on historic links, commuter patterns, culture, etc. Metro areas are always centrifugal in nature.

I'm an eastern PA native not from the city; I'm well aware of the "Philly belongs in NJ" trope, which is decades old, and really is a politically tinged lament that originated amongst the rural PA crowd. But it has no actual basis other than plain old resentment.

I'm not talking about a stupid trope though.

I fully agree that south Jersey is pulled into the Philly sphere... a natural effect of being within its "metro orbit".

And yes, of course Philly is the SE PA anchor and exerts pull on areas throughout the region (south Jersey and up to Mercer, Monmouth, and Middlesex counties included).

But none of this has anything to do with the fact that as a unit, Philadelphia is pulled more to the east by the NJ/NY area than it is by the rest of PA, by far. Just because places like the Lehigh Valley and south central PA are influenced historically and currently by Philadelphia doesn't make them more of an influence on Philly than the largest urban agglomeration in the nation is.

Claiming that Harrisburg or other cities and towns in south central PA (separated by up to roughly 100 miles of farmland from Philadelphia) exert greater attractive forces on Philadelphia than the attractive forces that New York City and the contiguous mass of urbanization through New Jersey connecting the two cities exert... is absurd.