Make no little plans; they have no magic to stir men's blood

Hahaha this is precisely the kind of fantastic reasoning I’m going through right now trying desperately to hold out hope for something taller.

Some other possibilities I’m entertaining:
1) Related is engaged in a misinformation campaign to beat expectations
2) Someone misheard “over 1000 ft” for “under”
3) Units were never mentioned. Related is actually building something under 1000 *meters*
4) Related is planning to eventually beat Trump, doesn’t want to provoke his ire too soon
5) Related is going to build the towers in stages, smaller first. So right now they’re getting approval for the bare minimum they’d like, then they’ll come back later when it’s time for the taller tower
6) They were planning a height that would beat the new Tribune. To avoid a height war, they’re lying about their plans for now

I'm hoping for height and good design so call me greedy.
Here's a massing at 1500 and 800 feet. It makes a nice cluster with Vista Tribune 2 and Bennett from the east and west.



https://images2.imgbox.com/e1/4d/GELcG0VZ_o.jpg

https://images2.imgbox.com/60/75/CJ0FQD0U_o.jpg

How can those be 1500 and 1800 feet when one is nearly twice as tall as the other?

Nothing greedy about that. Its such a prominent spot, we as a city should demand no less.

^ Chicago has long aspired to follow Daniel Burnham’s statement to “Make no little plans.” I would hope a structure in one of the city’s most prominent locations also aspires to this motto (or at least its developers/architects).

He probably meant 1500 and 800

Bummed. I am flying into Chicago for work Tuesday the 15th, and staying at the Sheraton, but I don't think I'll get there in time for the meeting. Here's hoping for news of something exciting when the plane lands.

sorry 800 feet*

Hoping for a decent design and mixed-use: Hotel, restaurants, observation deck, etc.
Spire was pretty but bored me as a pure condo play.

Please at least not be a let down design wise.

If Related Midwest will have courage, the best solution for the site could be a 975 ft tower near a 1,755 ft tower like Lakhta Business Centre. ;)

http://www.e-architect.co.uk/images/..._b240611_5.jpg

Image from www.e-architect.co.uk

I usually agree with Design>Height. But this site needs for both.

Well this is ironic (albeit a little OT). Calatrava is getting a riverfront spiral after all... :haha:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/c...508-story.html

Think he ripped off your avatar :haha:

scanners_head_explosion.gif

Calatrava is in town only a week before the big Spire site announcement. Wouldn't it be something if he has assisted with this new design. I hope he came for more than just a sculpture:)

best head explosion ever

Cool. I'm always happy to see more public art in Chicago.

Sexy

Never forget! :notacrook:

I hear whispers that this will be 3000 ft tall and will have a statue of Chance the Rapper on top

Rumor has it that Related has paired up with Magellan to develop twin towers at the mouth of the Chicago river.

Here's a preliminary design. I suspect a few folks will be disappointed as they are using precast

http://www.nzedge.com/wp-content/upl...r_NZEDGe01.jpg

can we get spires on the helmets please

Leaked by AJ Latrace

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DcpfS7TW0AUC7LH.jpg

^ That's some bold architecture. Boldness that is only eclipsed by the crisp, full bodied flavor of an Old Style at an afternoon game at Wrigley.

chicago doesn't have a fully krausened skyscraper yet, so this new leak is very promising.

:haha::haha::haha:

I love the casual title change a mod made "or not" hahaha

Lol, its funny, and then immediately very sad

Seriously, Chicago strikes out way too often on these big projects. Stop showing off these giant building renderings at me and then delivering something significantly shorter. =/

how is that at all relevant in this case when we have seen no renderings of anything from the developer?

^Maybe he's referring to that Hadid dude's extraordinary concept. I still cannot even with that one... so amazing.

perhaps. or maybe he's referring to that gateway tower thing gensler released.

either way, neither had anything to do with related midwest, the actual owner of the site. they were just fantasies from other parties.

related midwest has not released any public info on what they intend to build on the site, so hormQT's claim of "bait and switch" is entirely without merit as things currently stand.

Strictly speaking, sure, but poetically I think the bait n switch is an apt metaphor and has a good amount of merit here. We've seen all these amazing concepts and unless Related has undergone some sort of awakening in the mountains of Tibet... I would name this poem "Can't we do better?"

this is a bit of a referendum for related on chicago

I know what I'm expecting

I think this description perfectly nails it. We've seen that Related can get projects off the ground and they certainly have a big footprint in the city. But as far as how committed they are to the fabric of design and architecture in Chicago, this will be it. If they can pull it off, it will be their legacy. If we get another 111 E Wacker, then I think everyone (at least on this forum) will give up hope forever.

Totally dude, if there will ever be a window for redemption, this is it.

Mine won't be a popular sentiment here but.....

If latest rumors are true and the taller of the two towers fail to reach over 1,000ft there will be some disappointment for sure. Should there be?

After thinking about the developments in recent weeks I view this as an almost unintentional fair trade with the Tribune Tower plans. Did anyone think it was likely we would get well over 1,000ft for the new TT tower? I sure didn't. Would most have been happy with a 700-999ft. at the Tribune site that we may get at the Spire site? I think most would have said yes. The switch in expectations is perhaps just what we'll get if receive if rumours are true and both developments play out.

And in hindsight, we shouldn't be surprised if it does play that way. If I were ready to plop down +1million on a condo at either I would choose the Tribune site all day and night. Unless you REALLY REALLY love unobstructed lake views (of which the top 1/3 of TT will give you essentially as well) than what advantage does the Spire site offer over the TT site? The TT sits right on Michigan Ave and RN eateries. It sits closer to the Loop and transit options if you aren't retired and still working. The Spire site is on a bit of a relative island unless you are a running/biking enthusiast. And that will maybe be a big advantage when the lakefront pedestrian bridge opens in the year 2060.

All in all, I think an unexpected but fair trade for us skyscraper geeks with the two sites. I just hope to see both projects get off the ground provided Related comes through with a good design for the Spire site.

^ Agreed that the Spire really skewed our expectations for what this site could handle, and made it easier to overlook more valuable sites like the Tribune lots. It really shows that the true “center” of the city where values are highest is still at the mouth of the river—the *original* mouth, that is, at the Michigan Avenue bridge where DuSable first settled.

I think for a lot of us this isn't about height really, it's about expecting better design from a notoriously cheap developer. If Related proposes a really good 1000 footer, I'll be thrilled.

I was referring to the Spire, then Gensler's Gateway tower, both at 2,000ft, just to now hear we are most likely getting something way shorter than 2,000 feet. It's a theme in many of our larger projects that were shortened/ve'd/cancelled across the city.

the spire died nearly a decade ago and gensler's thing was never a real thing.

if you were seriously expecting something 2,000' on this site, then that's on you. i think most of us who follow this stuff fairly closely knew that related was never gonna throw up a mega-tall on this land.

whatever related midwest ends up proposing here (and i would hazard an educated guess that it will be far shorter than 2,000') won't represent a shortening or a VE or anything like that because related midwest has absolutely nothing to do with kelleher's wild fantasy tower.

Could not possibly agree more. The Spire site has always been vastly overrated. This only looks like a premier site if you're in a boat or on Lake Shore Drive. The spire plan made sense because it was targeting foreign buyers that wouldn't even spend enough time in the city to know the difference anyway - and it would look good when you point it out to your friends on a post card.

You can walk to almost nothing in less than 5 minutes from this site and even the vehicular access is terrible, you have to get on LSD to go anywhere, assuming Water Street won't be opened up like it wasn't in the Spire plan.

Lake views are boring anyway, I'd rather have city views any day.

I hope that something good looking ends up here, because it is a prominent site in terms of tourist eyes. However, I think there are plenty of other sites much more deserving of intense mega-super tall development than this one.

I don't know why you're always in such a foul mood. You attack me for having the opinion that it sucks we get shown these massive tall projects and then they disappear. Ok Steely, I'll make sure to call you out the next time you complain about a project that didn't come to fruition or meet your expectations.

My expectation for Related's proposal for the Spire site... Their press release will read as follows...

"We will fill in with concrete the existing hole that was left from the unfinished Spire building. Building amenities include concrete and sweeping ground-floor views."

i'm not in a foul mood at all.

far from it in fact, as i have a 3 day weekend coming up, woo-hoo! :cheers:




i'm not "attacking" you, just pointing out that "these massive tall projects" you've been shown weren't real.

it's fine if you're disappointed that there won't be a mega-tall going on the 400 N LSD site, but there's no bait and switch going on here. related owns the site and has shown us nothing.

if related had released renderings for a well-deisgned 1,800' monster tower with high quality finishes and then ended up building an 800' beige-painted concrete box, then we could talk about bait and switch.

I really hope Related doesn't drop the ball here. This site, along with the twinned LSE site immediately to the south, will allow Chicago to create a framed entryway to the river from the lake, and will define the view of the city from the lake (and therefor, almost every single postcard, movie or tv shot of the city) and really be one of the core mental images of Chicago that non Chicagoans will have of our city. While I have plenty of faith that Magellan will pull it off (they've learned to keep "Low-End-berg" from doing anything design-wise and turning it into a crap Grand Plaza clone), I am hesitant to say the same about Related. I can only hope that, like others said, they realize that their reputation is really at stake here, and will try to deliver a fantastic design that will be the signature work for their portfolio.

Here's to hoping. *fingers crossed*

Hard to believe you're not in a foul mood, you seem to be just looking to pick a fight.


It's an attack. You're trying to dictate that it's not appropriate that I'm disappointed a 2,000 ft building isn't going on this site by using some tangent logic that another developer now controls the site. The Spire was on it's way, a lot of foundation work was done. And "real" or not, based on the renderings, I'm disappointed that these larger projects didn't happen, regardless of who the developer is. I find it silly you're even trying to argue against me being disappointed that we have been shown multiple giant proposals for this site and now a 2,000 footer is all but out of the running now.

Enjoy the long weekend.

I hear you, but even a 1000 foot Gensler tower would be incredible. I mean, the tribune tower is massive but not so great. We don't need two of those, we need better design.