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-   -   CHICAGO | 301 & 321 S Wacker Drive | 2 x 775 FT | 2 x 49 FLOORS (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=225692)

Zapatan Sep 13, 2021 5:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ned.B (Post 9394703)
Chase has also been looking at the 321 S Wacker site too. I don't understand why though. Why would they want their new signature tower to be overshadowed by it's immediate neighbor and visually competing against another future tower on the other parcel?

What if it ends up taller than the Sears? We've heard up to 98 stories which with today's floor heights could be massive.

Quote:

Is there enough vacant space at Sears Tower to consolidate Chase operations? Maybe a name change as well?
Better than Willis for sure but there are already a lot of Chase Towers in the US/world.

Ned.B Sep 13, 2021 7:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zapatan (Post 9394862)
What if it ends up taller than the Sears? We've heard up to 98 stories which with today's floor heights could be massive.

Better than Willis for sure but there are already a lot of Chase Towers in the US/world.

401 S could potentially be that tall. 301 and 321 being any taller or even as tall as 311 is highly unlikely given the lot size and other factors.

My understanding is that Chase's potential move is aimed at giving them a new modern signature tower of the stature of other bank moves. I mean in Manhattan they just demolished their midcentury headquarters and are building a new tower, seemingly just for the sake of it being new. I'm not sure that Sears/Willis fits the bill for them.

Steely Dan Sep 13, 2021 7:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ned.B (Post 9394998)

My understanding is that Chase's potential move is aimed at giving them a new modern signature tower of the stature of other bank moves. I mean in Manhattan they just demolished their midcentury headquarters and are building a new tower, seemingly just for the sake of it being new. I'm not sure that Sears/Willis fits the bill for them.

yeah, if chase was simply looking for a big 50 year old office tower to occupy, they could simply stay put where they already are:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...in_Chicago.jpg
source: wikipedia


a move to the sears tower seems awfully lateral.

Tom In Chicago Sep 13, 2021 9:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steely Dan (Post 9395005)
a move to the sears tower seems awfully lateral.

Yeah. . . I suppose so. . . not sure how you modernize an old building like that, but it's working for United, so who knows. . .

. . .

left of center Sep 13, 2021 11:49 PM

If Chase was to build a brand new trophy tower, where would they put it? They would need at minimum a half block site, if not full block site, and they would definitely want it in the central area. That doesn't give them a whole lot of options.

There is the old Mercantile Exchange site on Franklin and Washington, and a few sites in the West Loop between 90/94 and the river.

401 S Wacker would be a great option too, especially if they get the air rights over the Enwave.

Other than that though, short of tearing something down, or locating in River North or south of Congress, not sure what else would catch their eye. Maybe Fulton Market?

chicubs111 Sep 14, 2021 1:24 AM

Im really hoping we can get some more information on the 401 site...We heard this rumor about 3 months ago but hoping can get some more concreate information on the direction its going or how far along it is in the planning stages... I mean a tower of 98 stories possibly would think its hard to keep under wraps for a long time...

the urban politician Sep 14, 2021 2:16 AM

^ Jamie Dimon has history and ties to Chicago so I have a feeling that Chase will do something appropriate and NOT lame

BruceP Sep 14, 2021 3:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the urban politician (Post 9395299)
^ Jamie Dimon has history and ties to Chicago so I have a feeling that Chase will do something appropriate and NOT lame

What history and ties? After being canned from Citigroup, Dimon was offered the CEO position at Bank One in 2000. From Day 1, he started negotiations to sell out to Chase in return for the No. 2 position with the promise that he'd later be made CEO. The sale took place in 2004 and Dimon became CEO of Chase a year later. The hollowing out of (now) Chase Plaza was underway, at a lost of thousands of high-paying jobs (corporate & investment banking, forex trading, etc. was shipped to NY). I worked in an office overlooking Chase Plaza and saw floor after floor emptied out. The giveaway was when he refused to move his family to Chicago and basically commuted to the Chicago gig at Bank One. Today, Chase is just a big retail branch network.

left of center Sep 14, 2021 3:43 AM

^ I forgot about the TC site... that would be a very logical choice for Chase. And considering the site would have pretty much the maximum zoning possible, we could potentially see a real skyline heavy weight!

BrinChi Sep 14, 2021 3:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardecila (Post 9394103)
The LaSalle tunnel was severed by the Blue Line subway under Lake St, and the Van Buren Tunnel now has underground parking garages sitting at both of the old portal locations. Washington is really the only tunnel that could still be used, but it's not clear for what.

Is the Washington tunnel what the Block 37 superstation was supposed to use?

ardecila Sep 14, 2021 6:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown (Post 9394335)
The problem with using the old streetcar tunnel as a pedway is how unrelievedly boring it is. It's one thing to walk 1000 feet on a sidewalk, past shop windows and intervening streets, but an entirely different thing to walk that far in a lonely underground tunnel. For anyone to ever use it—except when it's below 0º—you'd have to put in a little shuttle, like the Senate Subway or Denver airport. Maybe we could put some electric scooters at both ends.

I've seen some high-speed travelators in the Toronto airport that could probably make it a quick trip. Might need to be adapted for the slope of the tunnel though. Do a nice mosaic on the walls and call it a day.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BuildThemTaller (Post 9394377)
I can think of a way to make it interesting.

Well, imagine a tunnel that's 1/3 that width.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrinChi (Post 9395372)
Is the Washington tunnel what the Block 37 superstation was supposed to use?

No. The Washington tunnel ran east-west under the river from Franklin to Clinton (if you go down Washington under Ogilvie, the center section of the viaduct is where the streetcars would surface).

The Block 37 connection is a new tunnel built diagonally under the mall from Washington/State to Randolph/Dearborn. The tunnel exists in the parking garage levels, sealed off, but they never broke through into the existing Red/Blue Line tunnels to finalize the connection. They still could finish the project and use it for something, but there would need to be a good reason to spend all that money besides a half-baked Airport not-Express train.

JK47 Sep 14, 2021 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom In Chicago (Post 9395108)
Yeah. . . I suppose so. . . not sure how you modernize an old building like that, but it's working for United, so who knows. . .

. . .


It's been a while since I've been there but last time we looked there weren't a lot of blocks of open floors for lease. The lower floors, besides 18-20 which Willis uses, are solidly leased out to United which has about a quarter of the leasable space in the building.

TallBob Sep 15, 2021 3:11 AM

Willis is so massive that it would be difficult to build an 80-90 story (which I'd love to see) office building next to it.... Unless of course office leasing is stronger than I thought in that area.

The Lurker Sep 15, 2021 4:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TallBob (Post 9396491)
Willis is so massive that it would be difficult to build an 80-90 story (which I'd love to see) office building next to it.... Unless of course office leasing is stronger than I thought in that area.

I almost don't like the idea of a tower that size being built in the shadow of Sears. I would rather the next building that height anchor a cluster of towers. I don't mind 311 being there because it's less visually jarring with most of its attention taken away by Sears.

Mikelacey45 Sep 15, 2021 8:39 PM

https://www.chicagobusiness.com/comm...buildings-sale

TallBob Sep 16, 2021 9:48 AM

The Lurker: I don't think say 80 floors, which today would be in the 1200 foot range.... would over shadow Willis. The 1200' figure is what it would be if it's all office!

SamInTheLoop Sep 17, 2021 6:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by left of center (Post 9395185)
If Chase was to build a brand new trophy tower, where would they put it? They would need at minimum a half block site, if not full block site, and they would definitely want it in the central area. That doesn't give them a whole lot of options.

There is the old Mercantile Exchange site on Franklin and Washington, and a few sites in the West Loop between 90/94 and the river.

401 S Wacker would be a great option too, especially if they get the air rights over the Enwave.

Other than that though, short of tearing something down, or locating in River North or south of Congress, not sure what else would catch their eye. Maybe Fulton Market?


As in the Trib article, there are 3 main contenders: 401 S Wacker, 130 N Franklin, 655 W Madison. Any one of these could work. I would still probably give 130 N Franklin a slight edge over 401 S Wacker, but it's really close in my view as to which is better from a purely location standpoint. The more I've thought about 401, the stronger it is in approaching 130 - especially when you weigh visibility heavily.....and visibility is something that anchor and other major tenants have increasingly valued in downtown Chicago over the last decade. Particularly if we do have an anchor tenant here that wants to make a highly visible statement....401 presents a fantastic opportunity to do that.

RockfordSoxFan Sep 17, 2021 10:23 PM

If they chose W Madison over the Wacker sites, they might have enough clout and the employment base to get the ball rolling again on Clinton St subway. The more I think about it, the more I like that site. Good for them, great for the city.

r18tdi Jul 21, 2022 2:27 PM

Sounds like this one is still alive:

https://www.chicagobusiness.com/comm...ic-development

Quote:

Chicago developer John Murphy could provide the next local test case for office skyscrapers. He’s planning a pair of 50-plus-story towers at 301 and 321 S. Wacker Drive, just south of Willis Tower.

Murphy admits it has never been more difficult to build office towers so large, saying the "complexion of downtown is going to change dramatically" in the wake of the pandemic. Still, he's not planning to overhaul his design

pianowizard Jul 21, 2022 3:26 PM

"a pair of 50-plus-story towers"? This could indicate a height increase!


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