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CityBoyDoug Mar 21, 2016 10:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin Pal (Post 7378706)
I think you and CBD are being somewhat, if somewhat is the right word, dismissive of this place, The Last Bookstore, to which I'd like to counter and say that you shouldn't be, IMO.
Well, it shows that books have become greatly devalued. They can be used any way you want....even as a mirthful element of architecture. Books have become throwaway objects....mostly thanks to the rise of the Internet.

The bookstore itself is a nice place. My comments only address the bizarre use of some books. No offence intended, Martin.

John Maddox Roberts Mar 21, 2016 10:48 PM
In the "Dr. Caligari" arrangement, it looks like all the books are Reader's Digest condensed-book anthologies, always to be found in the "free"bin at any thrift shop.

Earl Boebert Mar 21, 2016 11:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin Pal (Post 7378706)
I think you and CBD are being somewhat, if somewhat is the right word, dismissive of this place, The Last Bookstore, to which I'd like to counter and say that you shouldn't be, IMO.
No, I'd never be dismissive of a bookstore these days, and apologies if that's the way I came across. It just looked so ... I don't know. Unsettling. Maybe that's what they intended.

Cheers,

Earl

ethereal_reality Mar 22, 2016 12:40 AM
color me confused: (as usual ;))

Quote:
Originally Posted by HossC (Post 7378510)
Van de Kamps was in the Hill Street Terminal Market.
Original Posted by HossC
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...923/0Kd7P7.jpg

I remember this photograph now.

I thought the space between the two buildings was just a parking lot; :previous:there aren't any rr tracks merging onto Hill Street
even though this photograph appears to have been taken in the 1940s.






Obviously I was wrong.
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...924/OWQOjM.jpgreddit



and another for good measure.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...922/eTGxXl.jpg
http://www.pacificelectric.org/pacif...t-hill-street/
__________________



*Back to Hoss's photograph (at the top of the post)
I just noticed the two tanks at the top. Are they for water? -they seem a bit undersized.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640...921/Blysio.jpg
detail

broadwy_central_bldg Mar 22, 2016 12:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Workman (Post 7378308)
Timing is everything
I received the latest "Gazette" from the Orange Empire Musem [at Perris, CA I may be in error about its official title]
It contains the latest history of the remains of 1435.
Over many decades the car had been stripped of parts useable to restore/maintain others. After sitting at the Subway Terminal it was given to OERM, suffering graffitte damage in the last few weeks of sitting in LA.

Briefly, the car had been owned privately at OERM until insurance etc rules required ownership transfer to OERM or removal. The owner elected to remove it to San Francisco. Near Santa Barbara the roof was damaged by collison with the bottom of a highway overpass. It donated some parts to SF Muni, and somehow got back to So Ca. OERM has removed the last salvable parts for use on similar cars in service at Perris and stored the body in case it can serve somewhere as a shell. One bulkhead was removed sometime previously, such that the body is considered by OERM to be structurally at risk unless repaired
not what I was hoping to hear, but thanks so much for the info, Ed!

broadwy_central_bldg Mar 22, 2016 1:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality (Post 7378957)
color me confused: (as usual ;))



Original Posted by HossC
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...923/0Kd7P7.jpg

I remember this photograph now.

I thought the space between the two buildings was just a parking lot; :previous:there aren't any rr tracks emerging onto Hill Street
even though this photograph appears to have been taken in the 1940s.






Obviously I was wrong.
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...924/OWQOjM.jpgreddit



and another for good measure.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...922/eTGxXl.jpg
http://www.pacificelectric.org/pacif...t-hill-street/
wow, I just can't stop poring over these photos. Had no idea that building with the VanDeKamp's was there... I can see the remnants of this garage from my apartment window, so I'm just fascinated by the RR history here... but color me confused too-- what's with the disappearing/reappearing RR tracks?? I really hope someone answers this; it's driving me crazy.

Those Who Squirm! Mar 22, 2016 2:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality (Post 7368751)
I don't remember if we've seen this particular early view of the Plaza Church on NLA.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/128...924/UWhqJt.jpg


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/128...921/pTGR74.jpg
http://digitalcollections.nypl.org/i...0-e00a18064a99

It's simply labeled "Los Angeles Mission, Los Angeles" at NYPL. (no mention of Plaza Church)

I wonder what that triangular area on the hillside could possibly be? Could it be a fence-
_
I don't know about the sectioned-off area in the distance, unless it could be the cemetery where Cathedral HS stands today.

FWIW the evidence before me strongly indicates the above picture must be from before 1894. I see that the building across the street from the church, and partly visible just to the right of it in the frame, has only one story and is probably made of adobe. By 1894 it was replaced by a two story commercial building, as shown below in a photo from that year.

http://waterandpower.org/Historical_...hurch_1894.jpg
(waterandpower.org)

ETA: The two-story building was built in 1889 according to an LAT article on the project to open Sunset Boulevard to the Plaza, published on 1912-09-17. Within a month of that date, the Cobenoff bulding, as it was known, was slated to be razed in order to put Sunset through to the Plaza. So Cobenoff's building lasted but twenty-three years, apparently.

GatoVerde Mar 22, 2016 11:04 AM
I believe that the marked area on the hill is the site of Home of Peace Jewish cemetery. Originally a Kizh village, then the cemetery, and then the naval reserve center, which remains today. Home of Peace is now in East Los Angeles, on Whittier Blvd. across from New Calvary Cemetery.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality (Post 7368751)
I don't remember if we've seen this particular early view of the Plaza Church on NLA.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/128...924/UWhqJt.jpg


http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/128...921/pTGR74.jpg
http://digitalcollections.nypl.org/i...0-e00a18064a99

It's simply labeled "Los Angeles Mission, Los Angeles" at NYPL. (no mention of Plaza Church)

I wonder what that triangular area on the hillside could possibly be? Could it be a fence-
_

Noircitydame Mar 22, 2016 2:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality (Post 7378957)
color me confused: (as usual ;))



Original Posted by HossC
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...923/0Kd7P7.jpg

I remember this photograph now.

I thought the space between the two buildings was just a parking lot; :previous:there aren't any rr tracks merging onto Hill Street
even though this photograph appears to have been taken in the 1940s.






Obviously I was wrong.
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...924/OWQOjM.jpgreddit



and another for good measure.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...922/eTGxXl.jpg
http://www.pacificelectric.org/pacif...t-hill-street/
__________________

I think the original photo showing Van de Kamps and the Terminal Market is later than the '40s, taken after the tracks were removed. USC dates it to 1955. With the zoom, looking at the skirt length and silhouette of the women, that could be right.

original photo with zoom from usc: http://digitallibrary.usc.edu/cdm/re...ll170/id/20525

LAPL has this photo dated to 1939; looks like before the space a became parking lot the hand is pointing folks to the Clark Garage.

http://i281.photobucket.com/albums/k...e/00064804.jpg lapl

If its of any help, Sept 29, 1950 PE put busses into service on Hill.
http://i281.photobucket.com/albums/k...elle/92950.jpg lat 9-29-50

HossC Mar 22, 2016 2:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality (Post 7378957)

color me confused: (as usual ;))

Original Posted by HossC
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...923/0Kd7P7.jpg

I remember this photograph now.

I thought the space between the two buildings was just a parking lot; :previous:there aren't any rr tracks merging onto Hill Street
even though this photograph appears to have been taken in the 1940s.
As NCD says, the original Dick Whittington image at USC is dated 1955. Here's a detail view of the Hill Street Terminal Market. Maybe the cars will support the later date.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...1.jpg~original
Detail of picture at USC Digital Library

I also found this earlier view from 1928.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...2.jpg~original
Detail of picture at USC Digital Library

The Hill Street Terminal Market even had its own match books.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...3.jpg~original
eBay

Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality (Post 7378957)

*Back to Hoss's photograph (at the top of the post)
I just noticed the two tanks at the top. Are they for water? -they seem a bit undersized.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640...921/Blysio.jpg
detail
The "tanks" seem to be decorative urns. They also appear on the 1928 image and another I found which is dated 1926.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...4.jpg~original
Detail of picture at USC Digital Library

GaylordWilshire Mar 22, 2016 3:19 PM
:previous:


https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-4...3%2BAM.bmp.jpg


We have here a 47/48 Ford and a 46/47/48 Dodge, followed by a 49/50 Chevrolet (with aftermarket Buick-like "ventiports")-- then what appears to be something closer to 1955, possibly a GM 2-door sedan. The car below is another 49/50 Chevrolet. Or, with a differently placed side mirror, the same one--maybe it belonged to the prop of the market....

ethereal_reality Mar 22, 2016 5:42 PM
:previous: Thanks for dating the vehicles GW.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HossC (Post 7379410)
The "tanks" seem to be decorative urns. They also appear on the 1928 image and another I found which is dated 1926.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...4.jpg~original
Detail of picture at USC Digital Library
:previous: Is it just me, or are these the ugliest decorative urns ever.




Apparently there were three urns on that end of the building.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...923/0ck6Jq.jpg
http://designeastoflabrea.blogspot.c...1_archive.html




location of the third, as seen from 4th street.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...922/zSrDA8.jpg
gsv






-just for fun, here's an aerial.
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800...921/HxBi6k.jpg
google_earth




Today there's an outdoor patio (is that a hot tub?) on that wing of the bldg.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640...923/wXAG44.jpg
detail

maybe bing has a better view.
___





nope.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800...921/1ErK5L.jpg
http://www.bing.com/mapspreview

GaylordWilshire Mar 22, 2016 7:32 PM
:previous:


Very curious about when the urns came and went... they don't appear in the architect's rendering:


https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-t...ubway1.bmp.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Q...ubway2.bmp.jpg


Hard to believe any would remain after the earthquakes of '33, '71 etc, but at least two are still there in 1986 (the LAPL's date for this view):

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-l...42/subway3.jpg

ethereal_reality Mar 22, 2016 7:51 PM
:previous:completely surprised the urns were still there in 1986!

for some reason, I thought that photograph was of a model of the building. (did anyone else think that....or am I going nuts?)
__

HossC Mar 22, 2016 8:13 PM
You may recognize today's Julius Shulman location - the Western Airlines Training Center was visible through the window of the McCulloch Motor Co in post #33208, and I included a recent view of the extended building. This is "Job 2550: Burke, Kober & Nicolais, Western Airlines Training Center (Los Angeles, Calif.), 1958". I'll start with the only color image in the set. I've omitted the black & white version.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...1.jpg~original

Now an angled view.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...2.jpg~original

The last photo looks across W Century Boulevard. I'm guessing that this was taken from the McCulloch Motor Co.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...3.jpg~original

All from Getty Research Institute

As previously mentioned, the training center building is still standing. Sadly, the entrance on Avion Drive now looks a little neglected when compared to the first shot above.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...4.jpg~original
GSV

ethereal_reality Mar 22, 2016 8:18 PM
:previous:

Oh my, that last image is sad.:(

-makes me want to go over there and spruce things up.

CityBoyDoug Mar 22, 2016 9:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality (Post 7379964)
:previous:

Oh my, that last image is sad.:(

-makes me want to go over there and spruce things up.
Its been painted. Once you paint....you have to paint it forever. Should have left it as raw brick.

ethereal_reality Mar 22, 2016 9:47 PM
Thanks for your help Those Who Squirm and GatoVerde.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800...921/TetTOF.jpg
eBay
Quote:
Originally Posted by GatoVerde (Post 7379305)
:previous: I believe that the marked area on the hill is the site of Home of Peace Jewish cemetery. Originally a Kizh village, then the cemetery,
and then the naval reserve center, which remains today. Home of Peace is now in East Los Angeles, on Whittier Blvd. across from New Calvary Cemetery.
GV, are you talking about the area on the left or right in the above photo?



Believe it or not, I might have a photograph of the Kizh village that you mentioned GV.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/128...921/jW22Be.jpg
eBay

But the seller cut off the caption at lower left; all we see is....

grounds where
s now location

What do you guys think? Could this be the Kizh village?

__

ethereal_reality Mar 22, 2016 10:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noircitydame (Post 7379398)
looks like before the space a became parking lot the hand is pointing folks to the Clark Garage.
Good eye NoirCityDame! I hadn't noticed it was a pointing hand.

here's a enlarged detail
http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/102...924/VNjKQj.png
1939 / lapl

It looks like it says 'Hotel Clark'.

__

HossC Mar 22, 2016 10:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ethereal_reality (Post 7379733)

Today there's an outdoor patio (is that a hot tub?) on that wing of the bldg.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640...923/wXAG44.jpg
detail

maybe bing has a better view.
___

nope.

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/800...921/1ErK5L.jpg
http://www.bing.com/mapspreview
I managed to get a better view with Bing. I think this angle is clearest. Strangely, I've also found that Bing's view changes if you turn the labels off.

http://i809.photobucket.com/albums/z...rminalRoof.jpg
Bing Maps

Looking at Historic Aerials and Google Earth, the patio only appeared around 2005. The online building records has a 2004 permit to "Revise roof deck framing and layout", and gives the capacity as 49 occupants.


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