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-   -   CHICAGO: Transit Developments (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=101657)

ardecila Jun 25, 2016 2:58 PM

^ yeah, I don't see any reason a four-car Highliner train couldn't clear the 16th St junction from a full stop any slower than an 6-car Green Line train, which encounters not one but four flat junctions on its route and still maintains reasonable frequency.

The bigger problem is trains on the Rock, which are extremely sluggish like the rest of Metra's fleet.

CTA Gray Line Jun 26, 2016 6:16 AM

You all know that this can't all be done as one big Project, but will probably have to be implemented in stages.

CTA Gray Line Jul 2, 2016 2:03 AM

Emanuel gets broad powers for transit TIF districts......
 
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...630-story.html

CTA Gray Line Jul 2, 2016 2:05 AM

State budget deal could help Purple Line
 
http://evanstonnow.com/story/governm...lp-purple-line

chicagopcclcar1 Jul 2, 2016 2:45 PM

SkyscraperPage Forum >CHICAGO: Transit developments is not the only place that discussion about Metra Electric occurs. Chicago Transit Forum has had a topic since 2005... https://chitransit.org/topic/66-circ...y-line/?page=1

A recent posting read as follows: 06/23/2016, Emanuel, searching for political support on the south side, suddenly is interested in the Gray Line (Tribune). Article has a better description of the infrastructure and costs issues. Apparently the ME is no BNSF.

06/23/2016, I can't believe that this idea won' t die. Where does this magic money come from? As I have noted before the current nonexistent ridership in the inner city justifies cutting, not expanding, ME service in the city. Added frequency doesn't improve ridership, otherwise the SSM would still be going to Howard.

The only way this thing could ever possibly come to be is if Metra cedes the entire ME to CTA. Then CTA has to work the NICTD into its operations. It's a mess not worth considering.


I asked the question a few weeks back.....Why would anyone expect the CTA to take over a failed transit service that results in a $64 million/year loss? "deficit of $64 million in 2015, when the line generate $46 million in revenue but cost $110 million to operate."

DH

ardecila Jul 2, 2016 5:53 PM

^ Virtually all rail services lose money. The Red Line probably loses far more than $49 million/year. It's a public service that increases the value of property, possibly by more than the amount of the operating loss.

chicagopcclcar1 Jul 2, 2016 8:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardecila (Post 7492299)
^ Virtually all rail services lose money. The Red Line probably loses far more than $49 million/year. It's a public service that increases the value of property, possibly by more than the amount of the operating loss.

Would you supply some specifics.....compare Metra Electric's deficit $64 million vs other Metra lines; or CTA Red line (or others), rather then just the statement "all rail services lose". Thanks, I'm a rail fan, not a bookkeeper, LOL.

DH

Ryanrule Jul 3, 2016 12:01 AM

Its about more than just property value. The general economic benefit is huge.

CTA Gray Line Jul 3, 2016 4:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicagopcclcar1 (Post 7492409)
Would you supply some specifics.....compare Metra Electric's deficit $64 million vs other Metra lines; or CTA Red line (or others), rather then just the statement "all rail services lose". Thanks, I'm a rail fan, not a bookkeeper, LOL.

DH

She's not a bookkeeper either, where would she get "specifics"?

chicagopcclcar1 Jul 3, 2016 5:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTA Gray Line (Post 7492616)
She's not a bookkeeper either, where would she get "specifics"?

From the Tribune article quoted last week......"Metra spokesman Michael Gillis said .

"Metra has $11.7 billion in capital needs over the next 10 years. The Metra Electric line requires the largest operating subsidy of all Metra lines — it collects about $46 million from the Metra Electric line but it costs $110 million to operate, Gillis said."


So the information is out there somewhere, right.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/c...623-story.html

DH

CTA Gray Line Jul 3, 2016 1:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicagopcclcar1 (Post 7492626)
From the Tribune article quoted last week......"Metra spokesman Michael Gillis said .

"Metra has $11.7 billion in capital needs over the next 10 years. The Metra Electric line requires the largest operating subsidy of all Metra lines — it collects about $46 million from the Metra Electric line but it costs $110 million to operate, Gillis said."


So the information is out there somewhere, right.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/c...623-story.html

DH

It IS probably out there, that's why we want an Honest Study!

You will probably say this is irrelevant, but do you remember our recent adventures with
one Ms. Barbara Byrd-Bennett? I wouldn't trust anyone in City Government about anything
as far as I could throw the last Green Hornet #4391.

CTA Gray Line Jul 3, 2016 1:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTA Gray Line (Post 7492719)
It IS probably out there, that's why we want an Honest Study!

You will probably say this is irrelevant, but do you remember our recent adventures with
one Ms. Barbara Byrd-Bennett? I wouldn't trust anyone in City Government about anything
as far as I could throw the last Green Hornet #4391.


For those who say the MED couldn't be used as rapid-transit, check this Video;
same 1/2 mile station spacings as the 'L', high-acceleration AC powered equipment,
close CTA bus connections: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wc9pplGpFNk
(Video Thanks to Amtrak fan 90368)

chicagopcclcar1 Jul 3, 2016 5:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTA Gray Line (Post 7492724)
For those who say the MED couldn't be used as rapid-transit, check this Video;
same 1/2 mile station spacings as the 'L', high-acceleration AC powered equipment,
close CTA bus connections: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wc9pplGpFNk
(Video Thanks to Amtrak fan 90368)

Thanks for the video. Stops at seven stations on the branch, picks up all of four passengers. Pick eleven at three stops at Hyde Park. Three more at McCormick Place. Question...how many stops would it take the CTA Red line to have twenty passengers aboard. Well, see for your self....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQ7oTzKTJpY

DH

CTA Gray Line Jul 3, 2016 8:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicagopcclcar1 (Post 7492816)
Thanks for the video. Stops at seven stations on the branch, picks up all of four passengers. Pick eleven at three stops at Hyde Park. Three more at McCormick Place. Question...how many stops would it take the CTA Red line to have twenty passengers aboard. Well, see for your self....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQ7oTzKTJpY

DH

Glad you noticed that David, that was my purpose for posting the Video -- and what I noticed about the MED operations many, many years ago! Nobody on the stations or trains except during rush-hours; so what to do?

1. Find a way to use the facility in a more profitable way for the benefit of the operating Agencies, AND the Communities along the Line.

2. Abandon the Line because of the low-ridership, and leave the entire SE Quadrant of the City solely dependant on bus transit (very effective during extreme weather, like the winter snow blizzards that can bring EVERYTHING to a standstill, sometimes for days)

I also notice the big difference in how the North Side's rail transit facilities MUST be improved (most especially the Flyover), or the entire North Side will dramatically Wither and Die!!

Meanwhile the South Side should have it's existing rapid-transit system torn-up; and be made completely dependant on road-based transit on high-traffic roads; great transit planning -- is it the demographics?

chicagopcclcar1 Jul 3, 2016 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTA Gray Line (Post 7492912)
and what I noticed about the MED operations many, many years ago! Nobody on the stations or trains except during rush-hours; so what to do?
Is it the demographics?

Mr. Payne....Maybe you have not noticed....I am not here to argue to debate with you about Gray Line. I don't want to hear about 37 Block, Mrs. Bennett, etc; as others have told you, they have nothing to do with Metra Electric.

Simple question..Why should the CTA agree to accept responsibility of the $64 million yearly deficit operations of the Metra Electric?

DH

the urban politician Jul 3, 2016 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicagopcclcar1 (Post 7492970)
Simple question..Why should the CTA agree to accept responsibility of the $64 million yearly deficit operations of the Metra Electric?

I hate to intervene in this epic and everlasting debate between you two stalwarts of south side transit but.....

1. Mass transit is not a money making endeavor, it is a service

2. Have you considered that if the MED actually upgraded to full, CTA style rapid transit service it could see a vast uptick in ridership? Especially if the city did the unthinkable and promoted dense development around its newly created L stations

chicagopcclcar1 Jul 4, 2016 12:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the urban politician (Post 7492986)
I hate to intervene in this epic and everlasting debate between you two stalwarts of south side transit but.....

1. Mass transit is not a money making endeavor, it is a service

2. Have you considered that if the MED actually upgraded to full, CTA style rapid transit service it could see a vast uptick in ridership? Especially if the city did the unthinkable and promoted dense development around its newly created L stations

Mr. Urban Politician, you didn't answer the question.....why should the CTA....

DH

Nouvellecosse Jul 4, 2016 12:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicagopcclcar1 (Post 7493002)
Mr. Urban Politician, you didn't answer the question.....why should the CTA....

DH

In case anyone missed it, he clearly did.

He said yes, the CTA should accept an operation deficit because transit is supposed to be a service rather than a money making endeavour, but that the deficit wouldn't be as high if there was an increase in ridership brought on by service improvements an accompanying urban development.

chicagopcclcar1 Jul 4, 2016 2:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nouvellecosse (Post 7493018)
In case anyone missed it, he clearly did.

He said yes, the CTA should accept an operation deficit because transit is supposed to be a service rather than a money making endeavour, but that the deficit wouldn't be as high if there was an increase in ridership brought on by service improvements an accompanying urban development.

I bet none of you live in the catchment area of Metra Electric. Most probably don't even live in Chicago, let the south side, or Roseland. Have you been through the area in the last year? "Improvements...urban development"?? Tell Mr. Carter at the CTA he only provides a service. Watch the video to see what a real transit should look like . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQ7oTzKTJpY

CTA Gray Line Jul 4, 2016 4:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicagopcclcar1 (Post 7492970)
Mr. Payne....Maybe you have not noticed....I am not here to argue to debate with you about Gray Line. I don't want to hear about 37 Block, Mrs. Bennett, etc; as others have told you, they have nothing to do with Metra Electric.

Simple question..Why should the CTA agree to accept responsibility of the $64 million yearly deficit operations of the Metra Electric?

DH

Mr. Harrison, I am not here to "debate" anybody either;
But when YOU ask a "simple question" - YOU are initiating yet another debate. There is nothing more to debate, it's all been discussed a zillion times -- and nobody is changing their goals or actions.

Do you actually expect us all to say "never mind" like Roseann Rosanadanna on Saturday Night Live?


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