The Brightline Thread
 

Jacksonville-based FEC has just announced they are moving forward with developing their own statewide passenger rail service between Orlando and Miami. They plan to have it up and running by 2014 before expanding it to Tampa and Jacksonville.

http://photos.metrojacksonville.com/...ographic-L.jpg

Full article: http://www.businesswire.com/news/hom...-Plans-Private

This is great news. What kind of speeds is FEC planning on? Unfortunately I doubt it will be the full 220 mph high speed rail but I'm hoping it will be faster than Amtrak.

The top speed would be 110mph.

full article: http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/...ssenger-trains


I'm guessing that this is a way for them to become a freight player in Orlando and Tampa. Currently, CSX is the only major rail carrier in those metros. This should be big news around the state over the next couple of days, as the details come out.

Interesting proposal to say the least. If it does come to fruition it will probably kill Amtrak's route between Miami & Orlando. I have personally riden the Amtrak route and it takes about 6 hours since they stop at every podunk town in between so this would be a vast improvement.
As for building an extra 40 miles of track between Cocoa & Orlando I wonder if the state and the Orlando Expressway Authority would cede a right of way to the FEC since the SR 528 / Bee Line Expressway is a tolled road.
If it follows the Bee Line route it will obviously connect to the Orlando Airport & continue west until it would eventually intersect with Sunrail whenever that gets down to Orlando.

How much track do they currently control? It seems like it would take longer than 2 years to build out that line, with stations.

They already have 200 miles of track in place and in great condition. To get to Orlando, they would need to build 40 miles of track. I assume they'll probably want the median of the BeachLine, which is what the HSR project Rick Scott killed was going to use. That would give them a straight shot right into OIA, International Drive, Sunrail connectivity and Disney. I imagine, this will kill Amtrak's horribly operated service statewide, assuming the two entities don't end up teaming resources for this system (ex. like California's Amtrak corridor operations).

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/...ssenger-trains

Like all American railroads of a certain age, the FEC once operated passenger trains, too.

Yeah, they basically built Florida a century ago. It appears like their dusting off Henry Flagler's old game plan of using rail infrastructure to spur supporting land development.

Hmm... Financially this is very unusual. It's certainly possible for FEC to recoup their operating costs from ticket sales, but to also recoup $1B in capital expense? That's a very tall order.

It makes me think that FEC will be demanding a grant from the Feds somehow (which requires the Feds to HAVE a grant program...) Maybe Mica will support additional HSR funding if private groups like this step up to operate.

I'm cautiously optimistic. I'm strongly in favor of additional and better rail service for the US and don't really care whether it's Amtrak or private, so long as it interfaces well with the national system. Amtrak has strong institutional inertia and a resistance to change, which is only reinforced by the subsidies they get year after year regardless of their ridership. It sounds like FEC has already committed to providing a good customer experience with frequent service, wifi, and good food.

For years, there has been talk about connecting Orlando to the Port Canaveral area with freight rail services. While this is being billed as passenger rail, there's no reason the track could not be used to get FEC and NS into two major Florida markets (Orlando and Tampa) where CSX is currently the only major player. Over the next few months, we'll find out more about their real game plan but I wouldn't doubt if freight access to Orlando, Tampa, and Port of Tampa is a "side benefit." It also looks like they'll probably want the State to donate the ROW that was set aside for HSR. This should be interesting.

If the track is built to high-speed standards with the possibility of future electrification, that's fine by me.

Something I noticed about the FEC's line looking at maps is that it very directly and conveniently serves the center of all the coastal cities in Florida.

If there was a freight line that could be repurposed for passenger use, that would be it.

This makes a lot more sense than the Tampa to Orlando line proposed a few years ago.

Look at the Beeline Expressway using Google Earth or another mapping program. It's almost straight as an arrow. Building within the median of the tollway would require grade separation, at least on the new tracks. So, it'll be perfect for upgrading to HSR operations in the future.
The only real problems I see with using the median of the Beeline is once that corridor reaches Orlando. There's several highway bridges over the Beeline, I assume with concrete pillars in the median holding the overpasses up that the rail line would have to avoid, while at the same time the width of the median shrinks to almost nothing just north of the airport property. Of course, the rail line could leave the median and enter airport property. It'll have to to reach the existing wye just south of the Beeline anyways. I'm just not sure of the geography of that area, if such a rail routing would be possible. Don't forget, freight trains don't like grades, and we all know FEC would also want to run freights over the new line.

Tampa to Orlando, had projected costs over $2 Billion, and was less than 100 miles long. This proposal early projections has projected costs around $1 Billion, and is 240 miles long.

What worries me most about this proposal is the lack of stations between Orlando and West Palm Beach. You would think a station in Melbourne/Coco area would be appropriate, if only to connect to the cruise terminals at Cape Canaveral.

125mph/200kph would be perfect over this distance, the economics would probably skew off the rails (pardon pun). Having trouble finding the main / existing line already in situ to have a look at the type of curvature and the like.... anyone want to help out? lol

Miami-Orlando - what would a potential stopping pattern me?

Miami - For Lauderdale - West Palm Beach - Melbourne - Orlando? Too many stops would slow the service down too much if you go above 125m/200kph top speed trains

Actually found it (mainline) - it's incredibly straight which is conducive to higher-speeds outside the urban areas but three issues I can see just looking at Sat maps:

1) a lot of single track
2) heavily urbanises around the track
3) level crossings galore!

They haven't announced station locations yet. I'm sure there will be a lot more stations along the corridor. The graphic is just for illustrative purposes. Also, the Tampa/Orlando HSR project cost so much because it was HSR. This will be traditional trains at speeds of 110mph using a line where 200 miles of track are already in place. I'm interested to see if it will be strictly long distance intercity rail, corridor service like the Pacific Surfliner, or a mix of both. I'm hoping its a mix of both because Florida needs corridor service moreso than rail that skips past population centers (ex. Daytona, Melbourne, St. Augustine, Lakeland, etc.) between the four major metros.

Yeah...Private Rail! Only a billion dollars for hundreds of miles of rail. Wow! Let me guess...they only need $999 million in public assistance. :rolleyes:

200 of the 240 miles are already in place and used by the FEC for freight service.

http://photos.metrojacksonville.com/...48_p295A-L.jpg

http://photos.metrojacksonville.com/...82_XLJso-L.jpg

Many of the cities already have existing stations still remaining in their downtown cores from the time when FEC ran passenger trains (they stopped in 1968). The last 40 miles appear to be state owned ROW in the middle of the Beach Line Expressway, which would connect the FEC directly with Orlando International Airport and Sunrail (now under construction). We're all waiting for more detail but I wouldn't be surprised if the plan calls for the State to let them use the ROW that had been reserved for the HSR project Rick Scott killed last year.

Also, FECI has a real estate development arm called Flagler Development.

http://www.flaglerdev.com/

They operate somewhat different from larger companies like CSX. Don't be surprised if opening additional land up to TOD and industrial development is a part of their long term strategy.