Macy's is not long for the world, COVID or not.

don't bring your uk variant over here boy, we got enough trouble.

or you know, your interstate peoria variant, whatever the case may be. :rolleyes:

It's not genetics, your country is just run by a bunch of incompetent morons. So is mine.

Your theory doesn't explain why places like Australia and New Zealand have been very successful at stopping the spread. Preventing a very contagious virus from spiraling out of control in the first place seems to have done the trick in APAC.

Well, if you all stopped doing all of your shopping online, we’d actually have a reason to have cities again after Covid, besides just being places to ooh and aah at all of the tall buildings.

^ i go into macys. its pretty empty. nice shopping experience actually vs normal.

Macy's sealed its fate when they bought out other department store chains; Marshall Fields, Foley's, Hess's, etc. and then became a stripped down version of its former self and ubiquitous as a Target. Last time I was in Chicago, we went to Bloomingdales across the street because everyone has a Macy's and the only special Macy's ripe for a touristy area is the one in NY.

Many countries are good about wearing masks, and people act like they care. Or at least they don't want the shame of endangering others.

The fact that the US and UK are full of selfish d-bags is the biggest reason our shutdowns have had limited effect. That plus the lack of shutdowns in many areas of course.

The Macy's in the loop is actually cool (I live a block away from it). The Macy's in Water Tower Place is I'm sure as cool as the ones in suburban malls.

Water Tower Place opened in 1976 and half of the shops in it including Macy’s seem just about as dated. :ancient:

As long as I’ve lived in Chicago, I’ve half wondered whether the Water Tower stores should just ditch the place and join the rest of the middle class mall shopping on State Street or even Block 37 if they could get a critical mass there.

Then convert the old mall into whatever else makes sense- offices, apartments, warehouse, etc.

Yeah right, I love cities, but I'm never shopping in some overpriced shopping district just to be seen or supposedly help a brick and mortar retailer like Macy's. I'm getting my stuff at a discount online with free delivery so I don't have to schlep it around. But don't worry, I'm not leaving the city anytime soon, and I'll be happily contributing in all other ways that make a city great.

I'm more than happy with the paradigm shift that's focusing cities and property owners to rethink their approach to retail and office uses due to the pandemic.

^ Are you? Last I checked, this is SkyscraperPage.com

If concentrating large numbers of people together to work or shop is being subjected to a "paradigm shift" that you are "more than happy with", then I'd like you to explain how that paradigm creates the types of highrise-dominated, walkable, vibrant cityscapes that this forum celebrates.

Last I checked, just having a bunch of residential highrises where everybody just sits in their condo and takes deliveries, works from home, and hardly goes anywhere for anything is NOT what the majority of the people in this forum think of when they are celebrating our great cities.

Australia and New Zealand are island nations that employed very strict travel restrictions (of the sort Trump proposed and most here opposed) early in the pandemic. Australians living abroad still can’t go home. And then they had extremely draconian lockdowns that, even in retrospect, are not justifiable in my view.

It’s amazing that people ask “why didn’t we do what China did” without asking themselves whether we should have.

And currently, they are still dealing with outbreaks in Sydney and elsewhere, closing beaches, etc. After all of this they’re going to be in the same boat as the rest of us.

Everyone is going to get Covid. It’s going to circulate again next winter.

Right, the Loop Macys is quite nice. The Water Tower Macys is mall generic.

I always wondered why they kept both. I guess it's because Michigan Ave. is the primary shopping hub, but the Loop store is iconic. But Covid forced them to pick one.

^ correct. state street macy's (the old gargantuan and historic marshall fields beast) is the important one.

the macy's in water tower place was nothing terribly special, little different from any generic mall macy's anywhere else.

the fact that downtown chicago was able to support and hold on to two different macy's for as long as it did is really the only surprising thing.

You live in an island nation, lol. What's your point?

China is operating at something far more resembling normal than the U.S., so I appreciate the steps that they took in hindsight. If your country had done what they did, you wouldn't be crying about another lockdown right now.

You don't know that anymore than you knew a year ago how the world would look today.

LoL. Hilarious!! I'm all for mixed-use neighborhoods and housing of all types. I live in a skyscraper, and haven't owned a car for many years of my life until recent. To this day, I walk or take transit to work. I've never been a fan of segregated land-use types like having acres of downtown space reserved for offices. The pandemic may very will kill the office-only district in favor of mixed-use. A good thing in my eyes. Care to guess how many hours a day I actually spend in my apartment? I hate being indoors at home all day, even if it's winter! It's unfortunate that in your eyes I also have to shop an an overpriced retailer, taking advantage of minimum wage employees, to be considered an urbanite. :rolleyes:

Especially when Macy’s is shutting down at least a quarter of its stores nationwide to save itself from effective bankruptcy, the luxury of two stores a mile down the road from the each other isn’t an option anymore.

$85 million revenue in 2014 to only $54 million revenue in 2019, with Covid as the nail in the coffin.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/06/macy...full-list.html

Macys isn't expensive nor do its employees make minimum wage. In fact Macys is unionized with good benefits.

I think the underlying point is that if you support mixed-use urbanism, you should support brick-and-mortar urban retail, and not order all your crap online. We try and support our neighborhood brick-and-mortar retailers whenever possible.

I though the State St. Macy was still called 'Marshall Fields'. I've been there a couple of times but never paid attention to the signs. That's a Chicago institution though.

I'll support my neighborhood pub, neighborhood restaurant, neighborhood specialty store (like my butcher selling high-quality meats) or other similar small business, but not necessarily businesses that just buys their stuff in bulk from the third-world and resells it at an inflated price because it's in a trendy retail district. I'm going to get the exact same product online for 2/3rd the cost. To each his own I guess, but unless it's a supermarket, I'm not a fan of the big or trendy department stores when it comes to retail unless it's for something unique, not something that can be found in most cities, towns and suburbs in America.

I didn't know that Macy's was unionized and pays a livable wage to their employees, that's a good thing at least, but not the norm from my experience.

The historic "marshall fields" plaques embedded in the side of the building are still there (macy's wasn't allowed to remove them because the property is landmarked), but the store inside the building was completely rebranded as "macy's" and the marshall fields brand was officially retired.

There was much anger here in chicago back when the switch was made roughly 15 years ago.

:tup:

Thank you. Many people don't know how to discuss things in this forum, they just strawman you to death.

Anyhow, once we've had our vaccines (only a couple more days to go for my second dose, my wife follows 1 week after) and then my parents do, I will be making an effort to patronize brick and mortar retail and food establishments more frequently. I am so sick of Amazon!

I'm the opposite: I never shop online, except for air tickets. I'm adamant to buy things on real places, preferably from my neighbourhood shops.

I really don't care to pay a little more for it. Money is for spending, shopping is for the whole experience. Arguably, people stuck on online shopping ends up spending more, buying things out of impulse, things they really don't need.

Sadly, I'm aware people will be more and more buying stuff online, spending most of time locked at their homes, less human interactions, less social life. I think our cities, big or small, will suffer. Needless to mention depressing wages for employees, erradication of small businesses, big money controling the whole economy and even society.

^ I have no qualm about your ethical issues with department stores--they are laudable, but department stores and the warehouses that supported them played a HUGE role in concentrating people into downtowns, and their allure, for much of the late 19th and 20th centuries. Read about Chicago's history and you'll know what I mean..

This. Couldn't agree more

New Orleans goes back into phase 1 starting Friday. We've been in phase 2 for the past few months. Back to 25% capacity for most businesses. There has been a sharp uptick in elderly cases which has resulted in increased hospital use. The uptick is likely tied to the Christmas holiday gatherings.

It's also disheartening to see that less than half of the healthcare workers have opted to take the vaccine in the New Orleans area. Those vaccines are now being doled out to people over the age of 70.

The Gap store in Chicago’s Magnificent Mike is closing due to Covid

Is this more of the “paradigm shift” in commercial real estate I’m supposed to look forward to?

Yay, our greatest commercial streets get to be replaced by Amazon to go stores! Alright!! :tup:

Got an email on gmail regarding my time line of locations I've been in 2020.

Damn pandemic. The extent of my travels in all of 2020. :(

https://aws1.discourse-cdn.com/busin...406e79f5c.jpeg

I'd be curious if others could share their own time line. How 2020 and the pandemic impacted your travels and plans.

We in Quebec are under curfew as of 20 minutes ago. Until 5 am. Probably the first curfew in living memory here.

I was not going to go out tonight anyway but it feels really weird.

Just FYI for folks in NJ.

Here is the vaccine registration.


https://covid19.nj.gov/pages/vaccine

New Jersey will roll out COVID-19 vaccines in a phased approach to all adults who live, work, or are being educated in the State. Within six months, New Jersey aims to vaccinate 70 percent of the adult population.

Pre-Register for the Vaccine: Enroll in the State's vaccination registration portal.

No trips to Chicago?

Too bad it’s been that long since you’ve had good pizza

I was suppose to go, but canceled it. Now my Europe trip... that sucked because it would of been three weeks in May. UK, France, Spain, Portugal, and Amsterdam. That shit got canceled though because flights were banned.

:(

Times change, cities must adapt or they become a museum. Think of the shift like the transition from payphones to cells.

I'm biased as the gap is another store I would never set into. Another shop that can really be found in any mall in America. Why come to Chicago and experience the great city and shop at something anyone can find back home (or online). The "Magnificent Mile" was also one of my least favorite parts of Chicago when I visited last year. I had much more fun in the neighborhood spots around the North and Milwaukee area. It's the local neighborhoods where Chicago really shines, IMO. I realize I'm sharing a minority opinion here, but I think whatever replaces the gap once the economy opens back up will be better as it's something people may actually use to justify its existence.

**edit - I should clarify that the retail options on the Magnificent Mile were the most boring to me. The museums and parks were absolutely fantastic!

Lol... This might touch a nerve but... Isn't that Chicago's business model? Attract a bunch of Midwesterners to shop at the same stores on the Mag Mile that they could shop at in their local mall? Sprinkle in dinner at the Cheesecake Factory, and a couple of pictures at the bean sculpture in Millennium Park, and call it a weekend.

Mine's little better, although Google didn't register any of my time at the South Pole the first week of 2020, so it's basically Christchurch, (seemed to miss my 5-hour layover at AKL) and within 90 miles of Chicago...

No, that's Times Square

That's definitely Chicago, lol. Times Square doesn't have much shopping. But it is the world capital of spending $50/plate on dinner at Applebees and Red Lobster.

Sure it does. Perhaps not the glut of large department stores the Mag Mile has but there's quite a bit of smaller stores in the area.

There is some shopping, but not a lot. There is much more shopping around Herald Square than Times Square.

In a nutshell, yes. Of course all cities, including NYC, rely on some of this gimmicky-ness to generate tax revenue.

People who actually like cities all know that Chicago’s downtown has vastly more to offer, but the business model of people coming to shop on the Mag Mile, have dinner, and stay at a hotel has long been one of the huge money makers for the city.

The Times Square example is a great comparison! Tourists love checking it out, but literally anyone else that lives in the city avoids it like plague if they can help it. One of the most annoying things living in New York is when you had friends or family come into town wanting to visit Times Square. You roll your eyes at first, suck it up, then go through the area dodging all the racist elmos, comedy club hustlers, and desnudas while passing all the overpriced corporate chains, including the county's most expensive Ruby Tuesday. There is so much more to NYC, superior products that can be had a better price in literally any other neighborhood, but to some visitors they are content shopping at Aldo and dinner at the Bubba Gump Shrimp Company.

To someone's point, these types of tourist areas keep the money coming in, but let's not pretend that it's representative of city living. It's just a tourist trap. Let the tourist dollar's support it if there is demand. You'll be hard pressed to find a New Yorker on this forum that goes to Times Square to support the area's retail businesses.

Times Square was extremely seedy in the 70s. Giuliani cleaned it up pushing it to the other end of the spectrum. Like a Disneyworld, complete with a Disney store. COVID-19 will usher in another transformation. The point is, neighborhoods change and that's not necessarily a bad thing.

Sort of, but there's a bit more to it than that. A lot of the mall chains on Michigan Ave are larger than versions found in other cities, so it can be nice to see items you'd only be able to see online back at home.

There's also plenty of stores, whether they're mall chains, department stores, designer boutiques, etc, that aren't going to be universally found in the rest of the Midwest.

I, for one, would like a Bloomingdales, Uniqlo, and Zara here in St. Louis, but sadly we don't have any.

^ Well, thanks to Covid and Jeff Bezos ("Oh but he's a 'tech' CEO, so he's cool and we'll give him a pass!" :rolleyes: ), Chicago probably won't have any of these stores within a couple of years either.

We all might as well just live in random subdivisions and get everything delivered to us. No reason for city living at all any more, the way consumer habits are trending. Even some of the most dedicated so-called urbanists here are watching this happen before their very eyes without even the slightest concept of how much our cities and makes them tick are literally fritting away.

I'm a bit confused because the reason I live downtown is decidedly not because Zara, Anthropologie and Macy's are a block away. Maybe there will be less reason for people from Libertyville to go downtown but I don't think many people live in the city because of Zara (do people in suburbs like living next to a mall?). How often do people buy clothes?

You are. Stick to physics

Let the economy of cities be dealt with by people who actually care about that, instead of “I have no personal interest in going to stores to buy clothes, hence retailers aren’t important to the vibrancy of cities”

Forest for the trees

Uniglo, Express and Zara actually makes clothes that fit. The Gap and Macy's don't have the time.

A city with strong fundamentals will adapt to change.

you're coming off extremely pompous for someone who is lamenting the loss of a freakin Gap

Let the economy of cities be dealt with by people who actually care about that, instead of “I have no personal interest in going to stores to buy clothes, hence retailers aren’t important to the vibrancy of cities”

Forest for the trees

Correct. And that adaption will probably be an end to a large amount of ground level storefronts, and more shopping from the couch of your 19th story condo.

...........why are we into cities again? :shrug: