So Ontario is officially entering "Phase 2" of reopening on June 30th.

I'll get a haircut, finally! Toronto barbershops, forced closed by the government for over 9 months (you read that right), are finally allowed to open to recoup some of their crippling debt incurred over that period.

The generous government has decided to allow indoor gatherings of up to 5 people now too, how kind! Plus now groups of up to, you guessed it, 6 people can sit on a restaurant patio! Indoor dining is still too dangerous though, so it's haram.


Still no word on the repeal of mask mandates or social distancing guidelines. Still no guidance officially from the government for fully vaccinated people despite over 25% of adults being fully vaccinated now (including me as of yesterday). Even when we enter Phase 3 in 3 weeks (if we behave ourselves!), there will be capacity limits, mask mandates, and social distancing rules still in place.

Meanwhile Alberta is repealing all public health regulations on July 1, mask mandates, capacity limits, etc. Saskatchewan is pulling theirs on July 11.

Ontario continues to be the most locked down jurisdiction in the western world and nobody seems to care all that much.

I don't know about nobody caring. The feeling I get is that people are at the end of their patience. If one of these variants does end up passing the vaccine barrier, the province is going to be in a tough spot since they've basically used up all of the public goodwill for another lockdown.

If I were Canadian I would be looking to emigrate after that nonsense.

No word at the provincial level, but the City of Toronto recently extended all mask & social distancing mandates to September 30th.

The masking laws don't really bother me too much (it's certainly the least onerous of the restrictions), but still, it's going to seem a bit silly when we're 70-80% fully vaccinated and still wearing masks.

Just got my second dose yesterday as well - at this point I'm going back to 100% life-as-usual as much as I can, regardless of whatever guidelines that treat fully-vaccinated, partially-vaccinated, and unvaccinated people as if there were no difference.

To be fair, it's mostly just Ontario at this point. Most provinces either already are or shortly will be back to ~100% life-as-usual (including some provinces that never really shut down to an onerous extent in the first place).

^ Still, I’m surprised you haven’t relocated for the summer.

I’m not really wearing a mask anywhere now. Rules are in place until 19 July but many people are now openly ignoring them. It’s the fact that you still need to be seated to go into any bar or restaurant, no dancing, no performances or entertainment, etc that is making life still not fun. And in this country we’ve only got like 4 good months of the year due to weather, which are already half over.

I have been a guest on this forum since 1998? Never posted anything. I joined because of how dismayed I am by some of the members here. Why the fuck do you care about someone wearing a mask or not? I will probably wear one forever...on the subway or in crowded places. Calling someone stupid for protecting themselves is irritating and dumb. I didn't have a cold for an entire year after a lifetime of sickness. Mask works. Shut up.
Mind yourself.

You're wrong. An anti-masker is one that refuses to wear a face covering, refusing to follow the rules. I complied with all arbitrary mandates imposed by my local government.

Also, I didn't buy lighter fluid and burn my mask on the sidewalk. That was a joke with a grinny face emoji thing :-D

Wot?

You decided to post after 23 years because some people think that other people wearing a mask by themselves on a bike is stupid and not following very basic science?

I don't have a problem with fully vaccinated adults wearing masks outside by themselves. They have the right to look like a fool in public, but it doesn't bother me at all.

Yeah same here. I bitched about masks and never saw the logic in wearing them outdoors but always wore it where and when required and would be annoyed when I saw others flouting the rules refusing to wear them. I haven't worn mine in three weeks and barely even notice those who do. No longer looks out of the ordinary and will probably always be a fixture for some.

Yeah, it’s obvious that the outrage and emotions are far stronger coming from the people who are ardently defending mask wearing (even where its not necessary) than from those of us who are pointing out how irrational it all is. Goes to show you that it’s rooted in a deep place, like a religion or superstition. When questioned, those types get this worked up—I think we’ve found a new hipster religion here, kind of like Scientology... :haha:

In many cases it is irrational NOW. It was not irrational to wear them indoors when few if any people were vaccinated. You say you are a doctor--do you find it irrational to wear one in the presence of other infectious diseases or during surgery? The principle is the same . . . or was. I agree that it isn't necessary outdoors and stopped wearing one there many months ago and also when and where a high percentage of people are vaxxed as in CA it's arguably not even needed indoors, but if I were in Alabama I would certainly still wear one inside any store and would want other customers to be wearing them (although the same reasons they aren't vaxxed likely would mean they wouldn't wear masks).

As for the future, they have proven their usefulness in preventing airborne respiratory diseases other than covid and in circumstances where those are an issue I plan to wear one. When I used to be a regular transit rider in SF during winter, I used to get multiple colds every year. Should I find myself on a city bus during cold and flu season in the future I will be wearing a mask. Wearing them for covid stopped those other diseases in their tracks and we should have learned something (evidently you didn't).

Finally, we may not have seen the last coronavirus, or other virus, transfer from animals to man and next time I hope no one will believe anyone who says there's no value in wearing a mask. With covid, I knew there was but it should have been obvious. Every doctor and nurse you saw on TV was wearing one while the CDC was saying don't bother.

^Changing the goal posts. Your phobia whether it's real or not, should not be placed upon others that are going about their lives and they're doing it without dying from the plague.

Sent you a reply didn't know if you got it yet.

I have no phobia and, frankly, you don't know what you're talking about. You are a fanatic who just likes to argue for argument's sake. Unlike you, I am a physician who believes in the germ theory of disease--something medicine has understood for 150 or more years.

Frankly, I don't even know what part of what I said you are disagreeing with. I'm a trained professional who has worked at NIH and in 4 different medical schools, you are a know-nothing nobody on this subject. I actually don't care what you think and JManc is probably right--no minds are ever changed here. But in case some newby wanders in who doesn't realize your ignorance, I think it has to be refuted.

Are you saying masks didn't help prevent the spread of coronavirus when no one was vaccinated? Are you saying in places where most people still aren't vaccinated they can't add an extra layer of protection some people might feel is wise? Are you saying they can't help protect people who care about such things as cold and flu viruses now and into the future? Are you saying you don't think they can protect people in the event of a new respiratory virus for which there is not yet a vaccine? Because if you are saying any of those things you are wrong and being ignorant.

https://abc7news.com/sf-workers-vacc...tion/10826327/

:tup:

We are talking in circles. People here have short memories, I guess. Once again, I challenge anyone to find a post from me in 2020 (or early 2021) criticizing mask wearing. I strongly advocated for it here and elsewhere.

It’s only now when people are wearing them outdoors or in their cars everywhere that it seems silly and “Church of Scientology-esque” to me.

California officially opened up June 15th, and 10 days after the opening, things seem to slowly be getting back to normal. The only thing is that many restaurant and store employees are still wearing masks, though it's up to their employers to determine mask-wearing. Because I'm fully-vaccinated, I no longer am required to wear a mask around the office at work. There are still some mask-wearers at my job, but only because they are not (for whatever reason) vaccinated. I know of 2 Trumpers that outright refuse to get vaccinated. Our HR department (of which I'm in) is asking all vaccinated people to submit copies of their vaccination cards for us to put in their medical files, and only then can they go around unmasked.

At least in Los Angeles County, the restaurants my partner and I have been going to vary in terms of rules for mask-wearing. Some have completely removed the mask signs at their entrances and are not requiring people to wear masks; other restaurants are requiring masks when walking through the dining space, but you may remove your masks at your table. The supermarket we go to has a sign at the entrance that says something like "If you are fully-vaccinated, you are not required to wear a face mask." Inside the supermarket, the mask-wearing seems half-and-half among the customers. I think some people still feel unsafe, or maybe some people still for whatever reason are not vaccinated and choose to wear a mask. It's nice for me and my partner not to be wearing masks while we shop for stuff. The employees are all masked, though.

Walking around, I keep my mask in my pocket, just in case I decide to enter a business that requires a face mask.

^^In every restaurant I’ve visited in SF, the staff is still masked. Not sure but it may be a city health policy/rule. It actually seems a little jarring since I’m still only eating outside and niether me nor my dining companion are normally masked at table.

We went to a Venezuelan place the other day, the kind of place where you order at the counter and then they give you a number on a rod, and someone else will take your order to your table. The person behind the counter who took our order was not wearing a mask (though the counter had really high plastic barriers and nearly encircled the counter), but the person who gave us our food was wearing a mask.

My work has us in every other week , which started in June and we will be back full time in September after Labor Day. I take Muni for the commute and I was surprised how busy it already is. Masks are mandatory but there are already a small minority who board not wearing them. I am not concerned now, but when the time comes and it is probably soon where we're all packed in like sardines and your face is literally in other people's faces I cannot imagine not wearing a mask. I too got sick all the time and presumed it was Muni. Heck I think I caught covid from muni if February 2020. Anyway public transit (especially in a place like SF where people are packed in) is the one place I just still may wear a mask. I imagine a fair amount of people may. Time will tell.

When I commuted to work in the FiDi only by Muni, I got at least two or three colds a year. I didn't catch a cold even one time in the first three years I biked to work. Muni is essential, but there's no question it enables easy transmissions.

It would appear that COVID-19 is no longer impacting life in the City.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...dcd703ec_b.jpg

https://www.reddit.com/r/sanfrancisc...ride_saturday/

Another fun read (if you can get past the pay wall) on how the pandemic has permanently shifted the work landscape for everyone, and how companies are still figuring out where the dust ultimately will settle.

I know some will argue against this, but there's no denying that remote work for a significant portion of the workforce is here to stay.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/remote-...us-11624680029

Glad to see the Fruit Shelf so full! Looks like Fixie Flats was also jammed up.

Santa Monica was packed so tight today that we skipped the pier and the beach and opted instead for a couple rounds of cocktails and a long dinner on the veranda at the Georgian. Not as gay, but the people watching was just as fun.

Muni seems very busy (just looking in the windows of passing busses--there are people standing now but not earlier in the months before the Grand Reopening). But my gut feeling tells me that people not wearing masks on Muni also haven't gotten vaccinated and I don't want to be around them. As long as we still have cases every day (most recently about 11/day) I'll be using Uber/Lyft to places I don't want to drive myself, and that's new for me. Before covid I rode Muni quite regularly but not now. It's not worth saving a few bucks to me.

It is but not in any way that would prevent a crowd like that. Union Square still has far too many empty or boarded up storefronts. Starting to see tour busses with the upper decks full passing again though.

Not that it would be bad to see most retail in Union Square replaced with something more interesting to locals…

Buses, subways, trains are always moving with doors regularly opening and closing and often with windows permanently open. People are constantly going in and out and lots of air circulation. Stations likewise are usually always somewhat open. On the other hand, offices are inhabited for hours on end by the same people. Yes, there is HVAC and doors opening here and there, but it still seems like a just as bad place to catch a respiratory disease.

I am not a public health expert, virologist or HVAC/air flow expert - just very dubious that public transport is a particularly dangerous place for transmission of Covid. Instead, I think it is more of a psychological thing based on the fact that everyone in your office is wearing Dockers and familiar or vaguely familiar to you (in other words, you are from the same tribe), while people on the bus/train are strangers, from varying social strata and sometimes unkempt.

Such as? I would have thought you’d be a fan of the sort of high end stuff that’s been there for decades. I mean what if you want another $5000 sofa?

I did notice Louis Vuiton was open. And of course Saks and Nieman’s and Macy’s. The Apple Store was closed (that’s of interest to me anyway—it’s where I can get service as well as buy a new iphone maybe). I think the Nike store was too. Not sure about Tiffany or Hermes.

Truth is, locals more and more do their shopping online in SF like everywhere.

I know for a fact it’s a particularly dangerous place for transmitting colds. I did that experiment too many times and now I’m doing the control. The result: About 3 colds per winter riding Muni, zero not riding Muni. Covid is transmitted roughly the same way. And I can recall at least twice when somebody in the seat behind me coughed and I could literally feel their breath (cum aerosol) hitting my neck and I said to myself I bet you get a cold now and sure enough, within 3 days I did.

I’m not talking about the high end stuff, but the very low end, Herald Square or east end of Oxford Street type places. I would think that quite a few SF locals shop at Saks and Nieman’s.

An anecdote from someone who's already primed to believe a causal relationship between public transit and respiratory illness is just backing up what I originally said about psychology. I mean, maybe you are right but many people were also saying that public transit wasn't a major source of Covid transmission.

In 48 hours I will be boarding my first airplane since the pandemic.

Flying to northern California to visit in laws for a week. Will be around the Bay Area and thereabouts.

All of us will be wearing masks in the airport and throughout the flight, my wife and I mostly in solidarity with our two unvaccinated children.

I've been a frequent flyer all throughout the pandemic. Right now, you don't have a choice. Airports and airlines are still making mask-wearing mandatory. So it may be in solidarity with your unvaccinated children, but, you can't fly right now without wearing one.

I mean, you could fly private. Depending on circumstances, you can fly private for not much more than commercial. It isn't as expensive as popularly perceived.

If you have a large group, it's possible to fly private for less, even.

Doesn't SF have a mask rule on public transit? I assume transit will have mask requirements for 2021, at least.

In NY, it appears that everyone is wearing masks on transit.

It's always just me...I work for myself. I remember looking into that a couple years ago and it wasn't feasible at all...costs many multiples of a comparable commercial flight. I bill clients lump sum and my travel expenses have to be built into the fee. I'd never get any work if I was pricing in private flights.

And maybe they were right when it wasn't crowded as usual. Or maybe they weren't. There's not much actual data and the people saying there was nothing to worry about mostly were highly motivated to keep people riding.

I just know I don't want to be packed onto a bus like a sardine, which is the usual pre-covid Muni condition, right now. But if you do, go for it.

The CDC has a mask rule on public transit (I guess they can enforce it on systems receiving federal funding which is just about all of them). SF Muni says they are following federal policy by still requiring masks. I assume NY is too.

One thing: Ventillation and the spread of disease have always been issues on airliners so airline manufacturers and airlines have worked to improve the situation in recent years and have reportedly done a pretty good job. The air in a plane is totally exchanged every 3 minutes they say. This is certainly NOT true of a city bus or train but more important in my mind is the crowding on transit where people can literally cough or sneeze right on you (you can feel it).

Just ridiculous, this country's lost the plot. Nearly half the population now under a 'hard lockdown' - time's like this I wish we had a proper constitution that guaranteed some freedoms.

https://edition.cnn.com/2021/06/28/a...hnk/index.html

Sounds like the UK, or Canada.

No coincidence that it’s the U.K. and its two smaller (by population) English-speaking colonies that didn’t fight wars for independence that are still restricting their citizens’ freedoms almost a year and a half in.

Countries need revolutions from time to time, or at least major upheavals, and they certainly need written constitutions to define what government can and cannot do.

They should just copy and paste the US Constitution and Bill of Rights!

My instructions for Australia, Canada and the UK:
CTRL C
CTRL V
CTRL P
and then go live life and make, spend, save and invest money for the future! :D

Skip the 2nd amendment and I don’t see a problem with this.

Um, I'm thinking it has more to do with the fact that only 5% of Australians are fully vaccinated? Maybe more of them should get on the vaccination train?

Is that why they lock down whole states because six people have Covid? Really?

^ Don't forget how fast COVID spreads, though.

Reality is, the rest of the hilarious nitwits in the world were smugly laughing at America in 2020 because of how many of our ornery people had problems with lockdowns. But we went with the technology and science route because getting all Americans to do the same thing is like herding cats--we aren't fans of authoratarianism, while other countries revel in it and like to brag about how they can get 100 million people to all do the same thing at the same time. Well, good for them, I guess, but I'm glad I live here.

America does much better with innovation. We now have our population heavily vaccinated so that we don't have to putz around in our basements like Canadians and Australians still apparently do, the same folks who were laughing at the "stupid Americans" in 2020.

The only better thing we could have done is immediate quarantine, but that ship sailed long, long ago.

https://uniim1.shutterfly.com/ng/ser...006988/enhance
https://data.sfgov.org/stories/s/COV...ess/7mye-zncy/

^Sick.

I had to edit. Sick = good, just realized I was responding to Pedestrian.