SkyscraperPage Forum

SkyscraperPage Forum (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/index.php)
-   Transportation (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=25)
-   -   CHICAGO: Transit Developments (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=101657)

Jenner Apr 1, 2011 12:45 AM

:previous: Regarding fare integration, it would seem that a good test would be to have a CTA machine take a transit card, and spew out a Metra ticket. Or, I think some trains are accepting credit cards for payment. I don't know if such devices can be modified to take CTA transit cards. In either case, the payment fare would go to CTA, who would have to reimburse Metra for the fare.

For the ticket machines, perhaps CTA can add a $.50 premium for such a ticket. Once at Millennium station, CTA transfer rates would apply for buses, and L trains. Two stops could be used on a trial basis just to see how it would work out.

denizen467 Apr 2, 2011 9:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by denizen467 (Post 5223061)
Have people noticed new street lights along the northernmost 1 mile (at least on the northbound side) or so of LSD? I think they are noticeably whiter and brighter -- they must be LEDs or something.

...

Also noted southbound (west side of LSD) from North to Oak.

Beta_Magellan Apr 2, 2011 9:19 PM

Digressing to the traffic signal timing and pedestrians, I also made all the lights on North Avenue on Wicker Park without trying last night as well…guess I lucked out in moving to a city that’s in step with my stride. :)

ardecila Apr 5, 2011 8:45 PM

Metra 35th/Bronzeville Station opens
 
All pictures courtesy of vxla

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5147/...ee690e4c_b.jpg

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5061/...87c53872_b.jpg

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5229/...2f37a2ce_b.jpg

New signage: I wonder if this is a new prototype signage for Metra to replace their 1970s-vintage white on blue plastic? It feels very fresh and contemporary; I hope it gets installed system-wide.

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5030/...3d9caca5_z.jpg

Complicated boarding instructions... what a weird way to operate a railroad.

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5100/...7db5360f_z.jpg

denizen467 Apr 6, 2011 5:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardecila (Post 5230008)
Complicated boarding instructions... what a weird way to operate a railroad.http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5100/...7db5360f_z.jpg

Well I'm sure the platform scheduling was done with the best intentions. My beef would be with the sign itself ... shouldn't the 5am part be written above the 2pm part?
Also, the capitalization of words is haphazard. Mr Downtown, doesn't Metra have professional signage people at their disposal? This (including the line breaks and indentation, and the missing space before one "AM") looks it was put together by a summer intern. For the good of the city, your services might be needed here.

ardecila Apr 6, 2011 6:29 AM

You don't think it's odd that the trains run on the right in the morning and on the left in the afternoon/evening? It's not like there's any freight traffic causing conflicts. Maybe it has to do with the storage of unused trains? 35th is between LaSalle and the Rocket House yard, so a lot of the trains passing the station in midday won't be actual trains, but deadhead ones being taken back to the yard.

The Helvetica of the sign doesn't match either Metra's traditional white-on-blue, or the "new scheme" at 35th. If I didn't know better, I'd say it was a CTA sign.

It honestly looks like a temporary sign, though. Ordinarily Metra would use paper signs to announce temporary or short-term service patterns, but the design of this station leaves no good place to post paper flyers.

denizen467 Apr 6, 2011 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardecila (Post 5230634)
You don't think it's odd that the trains run on the right in the morning and on the left in the afternoon/evening? It's not like there's any freight traffic causing conflicts. Maybe it has to do with the storage of unused trains? 35th is between LaSalle and the Rocket House yard, so a lot of the trains passing the station in midday won't be actual trains, but deadhead ones being taken back to the yard.

I got no idea but in addition to those possibilities (and that maybe CREATE or other work is fouling up normal routing schedules for freight/commuter/Amtrak/deadhead trains), I thought that maybe it somehow was related to crowd control/efficiency/safety of 1000s of ballpark visitors using the station (even if only 1/5 to 1/4 of the days of the year have games) and 35th Street.

Mr Downtown Apr 6, 2011 2:18 PM

^I think you mean the safety of 10s of ballpark visitors using the station.

I'm sure RID runs lefthanded in the afternoon to reduce conflicts with trains coming out of storage at the Rocket House, which is west of the main. The retrieved trainsets run straight to the throat of LaSalle St. Station.

Beta_Magellan Apr 6, 2011 4:33 PM

There’s been talk of adding a third track to the Rock between LaSalle and somewhere on the south side (74th? 79th? 87th?) in conjunction with eventually letting the Southwest Service on their tracks—that might help simplify traffic patterns. Unfortunately, I don’t see how they’d be able to fit one in or around this station.

denizen467 Apr 7, 2011 3:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown (Post 5230820)
^I think you mean the safety of 10s of ballpark visitors using the station.

Are there no high hopes for the weekends? Wouldn't Southlanders be more than happy to avoid driving the Dan Ryan with their kids, through the South Side, and then saving on parking costs, while being dropped off across the street from the stadium?

Seems a park-n-ride system somewhere down the line (especially Joliet?) could be successful on weekend game days. Bonus: enjoy cold beer because you left your keys at home.

ardecila Apr 7, 2011 8:28 AM

^^ I think it can work. I'm always amazed at the number of Cub fans that ride the UP-NW to Irving Park, or to Ogilvie and then walk to the Red Line. Of course, Cub fans are demonstrably insane, unlike Sox fans who - while they're definitely not fairweather fans - are more realistic. If the team is failing miserably, they won't keep dropping money on tickets when watching the game at home or in a bar is so much cheaper.

Also, the ballpark environs play a role. The long list of bars in Wrigleyville is a big reason for fans to take transit - the drinking can continue after the game, and once plastered, the inconvenience of a long CTA ride followed by a wait and then a long Metra ride, isn't too bad. But there's nothing near the Cell to keep fans around after the game ends.

CTA Oakton Station

I wonder why they chose to evoke a Gothic cathedral with those "rib vaults"?

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/7...skokiecta3.jpg
http://img703.imageshack.us/img703/997/lnskokiecta2.jpg
http://img809.imageshack.us/img809/3...skokiecta1.jpg

Beta_Magellan Apr 8, 2011 3:06 AM

Didn’t realize it was so long in comparison to the trains—is that just due to long ADA ramps, an over-generous waiting room, or Skokie anticipating longer trains in the future. I know the Yellow Line extension only anticipates two-car trains with the one-track segment is short enough to allow for 7.5-minute headways, and I doubt the Yellow Line will ever have demand for much more than that.

emathias Apr 8, 2011 3:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beta_Magellan (Post 5233182)
Didn’t realize it was so long in comparison to the trains—is that just due to long ADA ramps, an over-generous waiting room, or Skokie anticipating longer trains in the future. I know the Yellow Line extension only anticipates two-car trains with the one-track segment is short enough to allow for 7.5-minute headways, and I doubt the Yellow Line will ever have demand for much more than that.

I suppose if they extended to Old Orchard and after the north main rebuild, if and had a small yard at Old Orchard (which I don't think is the plan, though), they could run the Red Line as split branch between Evanston and Skokie.

ardecila Apr 8, 2011 5:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beta_Magellan (Post 5233182)
Didn’t realize it was so long in comparison to the trains—is that just due to long ADA ramps, an over-generous waiting room, or Skokie anticipating longer trains in the future. I know the Yellow Line extension only anticipates two-car trains with the one-track segment is short enough to allow for 7.5-minute headways, and I doubt the Yellow Line will ever have demand for much more than that.

None of the above. Skokie wanted entrances at both Oakton and Searle. It's like an at-grade version of the Eisenhower median stations with the long ramps... most of the length is just a walkway. The actual platform is only about 2/3 the length of the longer stationhouse, although if in some distant future situation CTA wants longer trains, it's easy to extend the platform northward towards the Searle entrance.

The Yellow Line Extension is pretty much dead... transit dollars are scarce enough that the CTA will not waste resources on a expensive suburban project that the community rejects.

Chicago Shawn Apr 8, 2011 11:56 PM

New RI station is off to great start...

Fans ‘join hands’ for the Sox Train
BY STEVE METSCH smetsch@southtownstar.com Apr 8, 2011 01:16PM

Yes, the Rock Island Line is a mighty fine line — especially if you had a ticket to Thursday’s home opener for the White Sox.

Dozens of Sox fans brimming with enthusiasm climbed aboard the Metra train when it stopped at Tinley Park’s Oak Park Avenue station at 10:51 a.m.

It was the first game day for the train that takes fans to U.S. Cellular Field, whisking them to a new station at 35th Street, just a couple of Paul Konerko fly balls from the ballpark.

Besides the thrill of Opening Day, riders were happy they didn’t have to sit in traffic or fork over $23 to park.

------
Metra spokesman Michael Gillis said Metra is “excited to have the line open and very anxious to see how many people use it. We hope a lot do.”

An estimated 1,200 rode to the game Thursday, he said.


Full article and a additional video:http://southtownstar.suntimes.com/47...sox-train.html

denizen467 Apr 9, 2011 9:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown (Post 5230820)
^I think you mean the safety of 10s of ballpark visitors using the station.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicago Shawn (Post 5234305)
An estimated 1,200 rode to the game Thursday, he said.

Take that, Mr Downtown !

denizen467 Apr 9, 2011 9:12 PM

And congratulations to Mr Downtown for the shout-out to him by Geoffrey Baer on Chicago Tonight the other day.

ardecila Apr 10, 2011 12:42 AM

Well, there is the novelty factor. Will those fans enjoy the experience and use transit repeatedly to get to the game? Or will the ridership fall off after the novelty wears off?

The news today is encouraging, though.

emathias Apr 10, 2011 7:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardecila (Post 5235158)
Well, there is the novelty factor. Will those fans enjoy the experience and use transit repeatedly to get to the game? Or will the ridership fall off after the novelty wears off?

The news today is encouraging, though.

With an old tradition like the White Sox, it's not just novelty factors that come into play, but deep-set habits. If people are used to driving, they may not even want totry taking the train until other people have tested the waters. I think it's just as possible for the numbers to increase significantly as to go down significantly.

Beta_Magellan Apr 10, 2011 4:41 PM

FWIW, Metra Electric carries a lot of passengers going to Bears games and even sees a spike in traffic for the Chicago Auto Show—of course that’s using decades-old stations, but I wouldn’t be surprised if Metra continues to pull at a few hundred passengers per game (especially since, based on this map, the Sox have strong support in the south suburbs).

I’m curious how this will affect travel to IIT—again Metra Electric serves a number of passengers commuting to jobs at the U. of C. However, that relationship was cemented during the 1950’s-’70’s, when a lot of faculty and staff moved out of the south side and to suburbs further down the line—I wonder if, in ten years, suburbs along the Rock Island line will have a greater share of IIT faculty and staff than they do now…

ardecila Apr 10, 2011 9:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beta_Magellan (Post 5235697)
FWIW, Metra Electric carries a lot of passengers going to Bears games and even sees a spike in traffic for the Chicago Auto Show—of course that’s using decades-old stations, but I wouldn’t be surprised if Metra continues to pull at a few hundred passengers per game (especially since, based on this map, the Sox have strong support in the south suburbs).

That map also shows the reason I live in New Orleans. :cool:

Ch.G, Ch.G Apr 11, 2011 2:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardecila (Post 5235942)
That map also shows the reason I live in New Orleans. :cool:

Man, it's funny to see where the fans have spread out. So New Orleans has a lot of Cubs fans? I wonder how that came to be.

I know this is completely o/t, but, living in urban Connecticut, I've noticed a lot of people wearing White Sox hats. It might have something to do with Obama, or maybe the White Sox culturally resonate with a segment of the population of the whole country? I don't know, but it always kind of makes me smile when I see someone her supporting the other Sox team (...and especially not the Yankees).

ardecila Apr 11, 2011 3:11 AM

Man, I have no idea. It's not terribly widespread or prominent, but people here consider themselves Cub fans for some reason. There's at least two Cubs bars in the city...

CTA Gray Line Apr 11, 2011 6:52 AM

South Side Transit gets city's attention
 
http://www.chicagotribune.com/classi...3523647.column

South Side transit gets city's attention

CDOT forum expected to elicit several proposals that could provide quick solutions

Jon Hilkevitch
Getting Around

7:07 p.m. CDT, April 10, 2011


Whether at bus stops or inside local transit think tanks, there is no shortage of ideas to improve public transportation on Chicago's South Side.

Yet minimal progress has been made over the years to capitalize on the most beneficial ideas that would enhance economic vitality and the quality of life.

The most ambitious proposals either lack government funding (specifically the Chicago Transit Authority's more than $1.4 billion plan to extend the Red Line from 95th Street to 130th Street) or acceptance among transit agencies (most notably a concept to transform the Metra Electric District commuter line into a CTA-style rapid-transit service, especially on the South Chicago Branch of the Electric).

So what are the answers? And how much longer must South Siders wait for results?


Acknowledging the need for improved transit service, the Chicago Department of Transportation is launching a study aimed at improving public transportation for residents of 13 South Side communities: Douglas, Grand Boulevard, Oakland, Kenwood, Hyde Park, Woodlawn, South Shore, South Chicago, Washington Park, Avalon Park, Calumet Heights, Greater Grand Crossing and Burnside.

The area extends from the Stevenson Expressway (Interstate Highway 55) on the north to 95th Street on the south and from the Dan Ryan Expressway (Interstate Highways 90/94) and Cottage Grove Avenue on the west to Lake Michigan on the east.

The goal is to come up with several recommendations no later than early 2012 — some that can be implemented quickly, others that will take some time and additional funding.

An important public meeting on the South Lakefront Corridor Transit Study will be held from 4 p.m. to 8 p.m. Wednesday in the atrium of University Technology Park at the Illinois Institute of Technology, 3440 S. Dearborn St.. The study was initiated by CDOT and the Chicago Department of Housing and Economic Development.

At the meeting, officials will review early findings about the travel market and existing conditions and, here's the important part, take comments from the public on potential improvements.

"We expect a lot of ideas," said Richard Hazlett, coordinating planner at CDOT. "At the end of the year, we will narrow down the range of alternatives to three or four final ideas and do further analysis. They will then be reviewed by our commissioner, the city plan commission and the new mayor."

The chosen final plans will be incorporated into a grant application to the Federal Transit Administration to compete for funding as a "new starts" project.

But in light of budgetary belt-tightening at the federal and state levels, officials said they will focus on developing improvements that are cost-effective and offer strong benefits. The study would be a failure, they said, if it ended up producing unattainable proposals that would end up on a shelf.

"We are being very upfront with the public about scarce resources," said Heather Tabbert, a planning manager at the Regional Transportation Authority, which is providing 80 percent of the money for the $450,000 study. Chicago is paying the remainder.

"You can come to us and say that you want a new rail line or new stations, but that may not happen," Tabbert said. "What we have heard so far is the need to improve the existing system so it serves the residents properly."

There is a lot that can be accomplished — and should already have been done — that doesn't require huge investments. Many people will avoid using public transit in any part of the city and the suburbs if they fear for their safety at dimly lit rail stations, for instance. Infrequent service can also be easily addressed for workers going to their jobs or traveling home from late-night shifts.

Some improvements to South Side transit service are in the works. The CTA is finalizing plans to test a form of bus rapid transit along Jeffery Boulevard from 103rd Street and Stony Island Avenue to Jefferson Street and Washington Boulevard west of the Loop. The experiment will use bus-only lanes and onboard technology that communicates with traffic signals to allow buses to pass through busy intersections ahead of other traffic, shortening commuting times on the crosstown trips.

A separate CTA project involves eliminating slow zones on the south branch of the Red Line in the median of the Dan Ryan.

Much more can be done, and residents who turn out at Wednesday's public hearing will likely offer a laundry list for the CTA.

In addition to bus service that is too infrequent in some neighborhoods, the CTA should look at where it is running too much bus service from end to end on some routes. Reliable transfers from one bus to another is also critical, particularly along routes where the scheduled time between buses is 20 minutes.

"The CTA needs to stick to its schedule and operate the lower-density routes with a great deal of more care," said Adam Kerman, a transit activist who heads the Transit Riders Authority. "People on the Far South Side tend to have the longest commutes in the whole area, and it's not uncommon for them to make three or four transfers to get to a job."

Contact Getting Around at jhilkevitch@tribune.com or c/o the Chicago Tribune, 435 N. Michigan Ave., Chicago, IL 60611. Read recent columns at chicagotribune.com/gettingaround

ardecila Apr 11, 2011 7:26 AM

Anybody remember this? There hasn't been any news recently... but how long can it possibly take to do engineering work on a $24 million project?

(I'm assuming construction can't proceed until Washington and Madison are re-opened across Wacker, meaning 2012 at the earliest)

Quote:

Project: Chicago Central Area Transitway: E-W Corridor BRT (Urban Circulator)
Sponsor: Chicago Department of Transportation
Amount: $24,650,000

The E-W Corridor BRT will consist of designated bus priority lanes on two miles of downtown surface streets to be used by seven CTA bus routes. The project includes bus signal priority, "next bus" information, and bus shelter branding. This project will connect Union Station through several districts in the downtown Loop to the Navy Pier. It will also expedite bus services through the downtown and serves a community not currently served by transit. Bicycle lanes, bus lanes and streetscape enhancements are also expected to be provided as part of the project.

lawfin Apr 12, 2011 4:10 AM

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...0,365627.story

Daley spells out idea for bullet train to O'Hare
New elevated tracks required; no homes razed, he says

Still making big plans as his tenure winds down, Mayor Richard Daley on Monday fleshed out his concept for an ultra-fast train between downtown and O'Hare International Airport.

The bullet train would run on new elevated tracks along one of two undisclosed public routes that would not require razing any homes, Daley said. But it's unclear who would pay for it and whether it would work in Chicago.

"It has to go from the downtown area right to the airport, and you process everything downtown," Daley said. "You go through one security check. The train is completely secured. It goes right to the airport. And you go right up to the plane."

The outgoing mayor talked about the idea while discussing the benefits to the city of his recent 12-day trip to China to promote Chicago as an economic partner. In recent years, he has frequently spoken with admiration of China's rapid economic expansion and the public projects that have fueled that growth.


His most recent trip, billed as the start of the "Chicago-China Friendship Initiative," was taken with Chicago architecture and business leaders, the Chinese consulate general to Chicago and Aviation Commissioner Rosemarie Andolino. The aim was to make Chicago the "most China-friendly city" in the nation.

It came about two months after Chinese President Hu Jintao came to Chicago at Daley's invitation, following an official state visit in Washington. In China, Daley and Chicago business leaders met with Hu.

Daley again rode on a train with a top speed higher than 200 mph. "We have not built any of these trains," he said. "So you have to go, you have to go to China and listen to them and to their operations and their technology, and that's what we have done."

VivaLFuego Apr 12, 2011 5:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ch.G, Ch.G (Post 5236246)
Man, it's funny to see where the fans have spread out. So New Orleans has a lot of Cubs fans? I wonder how that came to be.

I know this is completely o/t, but, living in urban Connecticut, I've noticed a lot of people wearing White Sox hats. It might have something to do with Obama, or maybe the White Sox culturally resonate with a segment of the population of the whole country? I don't know, but it always kind of makes me smile when I see someone her supporting the other Sox team (...and especially not the Yankees).

FWIW, while in Toronto this weekend the two sports teams that weren't the Leafs or Habs which had the most representation on the streets were.... the Blackhawks and the White Sox.

CTA Gray Line Apr 12, 2011 5:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lawfin (Post 5237906)
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...0,365627.story

Daley spells out idea for bullet train to O'Hare
New elevated tracks required; no homes razed, he says

Still making big plans as his tenure winds down, Mayor Richard Daley on Monday fleshed out his concept for an ultra-fast train between downtown and O'Hare International Airport.

The bullet train would run on new elevated tracks along one of two undisclosed public routes that would not require razing any homes, Daley said. But it's unclear who would pay for it and whether it would work in Chicago.

"It has to go from the downtown area right to the airport, and you process everything downtown," Daley said. "You go through one security check. The train is completely secured. It goes right to the airport. And you go right up to the plane."

The outgoing mayor talked about the idea while discussing the benefits to the city of his recent 12-day trip to China to promote Chicago as an economic partner. In recent years, he has frequently spoken with admiration of China's rapid economic expansion and the public projects that have fueled that growth.


His most recent trip, billed as the start of the "Chicago-China Friendship Initiative," was taken with Chicago architecture and business leaders, the Chinese consulate general to Chicago and Aviation Commissioner Rosemarie Andolino. The aim was to make Chicago the "most China-friendly city" in the nation.

It came about two months after Chinese President Hu Jintao came to Chicago at Daley's invitation, following an official state visit in Washington. In China, Daley and Chicago business leaders met with Hu.

Daley again rode on a train with a top speed higher than 200 mph. "We have not built any of these trains," he said. "So you have to go, you have to go to China and listen to them and to their operations and their technology, and that's what we have done."


It's "The Emperors New Clothes" all over again; everybody knows this will never work or happen, but nobody dare tell "His Honor".

nomarandlee Apr 12, 2011 5:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lawfin (Post 5237906)
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...0,365627.story

Daley spells out idea for bullet train to O'Hare
New elevated tracks required; no homes razed, he says
."

On its face it seems like an unduely expensive copycat scheme by Daley driven again by recent envy of what he saw in China. Over 17 miles how much could a bullet train really get up to speed and save on time over traditional rail?

I also get a chuckle that a supposedly contorted Blue Line track express idea was at one point deemed to be a great leap forward while Quinns Amtrak proposal according to Daely would be too slow.

I am curious about what the two potential routes would be the articled referred to though.

ardecila Apr 12, 2011 5:51 AM

If Daley wanted better airport access from downtown, he shouldn't have closed Meigs Field. (somebody had to say it...)

Quote:

Originally Posted by nomarandlee (Post 5237978)
I am curious about what the two potential routes would be the articled referred to though.

The only two possible corridors - UP-NW (splitting off at the Kennedy) or MD-W (splitting off at Mannheim or I-190).

I just don't understand why Daley is so adamant about providing access to the airport while the rest of the transit system is a joke by international standards. Hell, Tehran has a better train system than we do.

If Da Mare is this out of touch with the needs of real Chicagoans, then I'm glad he's leaving. At least his dad spent billions giving the city an expressway system, three new transit lines, and a major university (among other things). What have we gotten from the son? A paintjob on the CTA , some bike lanes, and some plants and wrought-iron fencing. That sh*t has no magic to stir my blood.

lawfin Apr 12, 2011 5:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nomarandlee (Post 5237978)
On its face it seems like an unduely expensive copycat scheme by Daley driven again by recent envy of what he saw in China. Over 17 miles how much could a bullet train really get up to speed and save on time over traditional rail?

I also get a chuckle that a supposedly contorted Blue Line track express idea was at one point deemed to be a great leap forward while Quinns Amtrak proposal according to Daely would be too slow.

I am curious about what the two potential routes would be the articled referred to though.

I am not sure the distance is a limiting factor. The Shanghai Maglev only covers I think 18 or 19 miles...so not much further.

CTA Gray Line Apr 12, 2011 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardecila (Post 5238007)
If Daley wanted better airport access from downtown, he shouldn't have closed Meigs Field. (somebody had to say it...)



The only two possible corridors - UP-NW (splitting off at the Kennedy) or MD-W (splitting off at Mannheim or I-190).

I just don't understand why Daley is so adamant about providing access to the airport while the rest of the transit system is a joke by international standards. Hell, Tehran has a better train system than we do.

If Da Mare is this out of touch with the needs of real Chicagoans, then I'm glad he's leaving. At least his dad spent billions giving the city an expressway system, three new transit lines, and a major university (among other things). What have we gotten from the son? A paintjob on the CTA , some bike lanes, and some plants and wrought-iron fencing. That sh*t has no magic to stir my blood.

You hit it right on the head ardecila, His Honor does not seem to give a Flying Eff about plain old Chicagoans who can't afford First Class.

He has already (along with the City Council) w a s t e d +$250 Million on an unusable White Elephant under Block 37; can that ever be recovered?

Nowhereman1280 Apr 12, 2011 2:26 PM

B37 is not unusable. It was a once in a lifetime opportunity to create tracks that connect the Blue and Red Line in the heart of downtown. Whether or not its put to use now or in 20 years, it is something we may never had a chance to do again as the loop is pretty much approaching complete buildout, especially between State and Dearborn...

VivaLFuego Apr 12, 2011 2:58 PM

Having a consistent multi-phase strategic plan and actually sticking to it for the ~20 years required to get results would be a good start. Chicago's now built two downtown airport express terminals with various integration schemes with existing CTA service, the first providing only O'Hare service and the latter requiring full O'Hare and Midway service.... and now, the two options on the table are regional HSR integration with service to Union Station, and a brand new bullet train.

Nowhereman1280 Apr 12, 2011 3:00 PM

Oh yeah, I had completely forgotten about the original intention to use Clark/Lake as an airport express station.

Still, the interlocking under B37 will be useful at some point in the future if Chicago decides to actually put some thought and money into its subway/El system.

emathias Apr 12, 2011 3:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nowhereman1280 (Post 5238257)
...
Still, the interlocking under B37 will be useful at some point in the future if Chicago decides to actually put some thought and money into its subway/El system.

Yeah, if they developed the west portal where the Lake subway turns north under Milwaukee, you could run the Green Line through the subways.

Quote:

Originally Posted by VivaLFuego (Post 5238251)
Having a consistent multi-phase strategic plan and actually sticking to it for the ~20 years required to get results would be a good start. Chicago's now built two downtown airport express terminals with various integration schemes with existing CTA service, the first providing only O'Hare service and the latter requiring full O'Hare and Midway service.... and now, the two options on the table are regional HSR integration with service to Union Station, and a brand new bullet train.

I still think something like this would be the best long-term solution. Train to downtown in a subway loop that ties the Loop and North Michigan together. Could run circulator trains in it in between airport trains:

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5052/...1258020a_b.jpg

the urban politician Apr 13, 2011 3:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTA Gray Line (Post 5237977)
It's "The Emperors New Clothes" all over again; everybody knows this will never work or happen, but nobody dare tell "His Honor".

^ You and your whining. This is getting old.

I'd like somebody here to explain to me why an express train between O'Hare and downtown will never happen? Yes, I'm not saying it would be easy, but how exactly is this project impossible? The only limiting factor is money.

Daley has (for better or for worse) been a trendsetter when it comes to infrastructure privatization. He has built the grandest American urban park in decades with huge amounts of private money. Why is it completely out of the realm of possibility that he may find a private consortium of investors who (with matching local/federal funds) could build such a line, if it is seen as profitable?

CTA Gray Line Apr 13, 2011 4:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the urban politician (Post 5239308)
^ You and your whining. This is getting old.

I'd like somebody here to explain to me why an express train between O'Hare and downtown will never happen? Yes, I'm not saying it would be easy, but how exactly is this project impossible? The only limiting factor is money.

Daley has (for better or for worse) been a trendsetter when it comes to infrastructure privatization. He has built the grandest American urban park in decades with huge amounts of private money. Why is it completely out of the realm of possibility that he may find a private consortium of investors who (with matching local/federal funds) could build such a line, if it is seen as profitable?

What I'm whining about got old years ago.

Why doesn't he seek some private consortium funds somewhere to restore the X-Bus routes (like Apple at the North&Clybourn Station - how about the Target X55 Garfield, or the Wal-Mart X80 Irving Park). Or work on getting the Transit Agencies to implement a UFC - something regular Chicagoans could really use; I've never heard him say crap about a UFC, and if he had thrown his power behind it - it would have been implemented years ago.

Who would use a $15 to $20 Airport Train - certainly not most regular Chicagoans (who could afford it along with the plane ticket). There are already two rail services to O'Hare - why do we need three rail services to O'Hare, when other parts of the city are Transit deficient. And what are we going to do with his money-well-spent +$250 Million Block 37 SuperStation???

Just like Meigs Field, the Skyway, and the Parking Meters; the Public gets no say in his Paternalistic endeavours (and who's getting buggered for 70 something years in that Parking Meter deal - certainly not Da' Mayor).


But I shouldn't whine about these things, and I should understand that other people always know what's best for me and my Community.


Question urban politician: Who knows what's best for you, and your Community???

the urban politician Apr 13, 2011 4:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTA Gray Line (Post 5239362)
What I'm whining about got old years ago.

Why doesn't he seek some private consortium funds somewhere to restore the X-Bus routes (like Apple at the North&Clybourn Station - how about the Target X55 Garfield, or the Wal-Mart X80 Irving Park). Or work on getting the Transit Agencies to implement a UFC - something regular Chicagoans could really use.

Who would use a $15 to $20 Airport Train - certainly not most regular Chicagoans (who could afford it along with the plane ticket). There are already two rail services to O'Hare; and what are we going to do with the money-well-spent +$250 Million Block 37 SuperStation???

^ Why would a private consortium fund any of the routes that you mentioned? Private money is looking at profit margins. Those routes probably aren't profitable. A $20 train that whisks tourists/business travelers from O'Hare to the Loop in under 20 minutes, or whisks you from the Loop to O'Hare in the same time post-TSA could perhaps run a profit. What don't you get about that?

Quote:

Just like Meigs Field, the Skyway, and the Parking Meters; the Public gets no say in his Paternalistic endeavours.
^ Thank God for that! There is no way in hell the public is capable of making good and rational decisions when it comes to urban development. They are too stupid & self-centered. I have long agreed with Steely Dan that people need to be told what to do instead of the other way around.

Beta_Magellan Apr 13, 2011 4:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTA Gray Line (Post 5239362)
Why doesn't he seek some private consortium funds somewhere to restore the X-Bus routes (like Apple at the North&Clybourn Station - how about the Target X55 Garfield, or the Wal-Mart X80 Irving Park).

We already do this—it’s called putting ads on the side of the bus. I doubt naming rights would add much value.

CTA Gray Line Apr 13, 2011 8:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the urban politician (Post 5239376)
^ Why would a private consortium fund any of the routes that you mentioned? Private money is looking at profit margins. Those routes probably aren't profitable.

> I am trying to create jobs, and access to jobs, however it's funded; lots of transit lines are not necessarily profitable, but are subsidized for economic reasons - right or wrong?



A $20 train that whisks tourists/business travelers from O'Hare to the Loop in under 20 minutes, or whisks you from the Loop to O'Hare in the same time post-TSA could perhaps run a profit. What don't you get about that?

> What I don't get is that the money could be spent elsewhere in the city to profit and serve city residents; air travelers already have two rail services (and cabs, shuttle buses, limos, autos, etc...). And as has been pointed out, if the Blue Line were improved to full train operating speed condition (or the Metra North Central with an ATS connection); an HSR or Maglev wouldn't be needed.

If he had found ways to better serve deficient parts of the city, I would think a Maglev was a great idea; and it would draw tourists and novelty seekers (like a Roller Coaster does): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqAJe...eature=related


^ Thank God for that! There is no way in hell the public is capable of making good and rational decisions when it comes to urban development. They are too stupid & self-centered. I have long agreed with Steely Dan that people need to be told what to do instead of the other way around.

> Does that include you?? (let me guess - "Oh no, I'm smart enough to think for myself").

CTA Gray Line Apr 13, 2011 8:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beta_Magellan (Post 5239390)
We already do this—it’s called putting ads on the side of the bus. I doubt naming rights would add much value.

It might draw customers into the sponsoring store or business (especially if it was a frequent service); I would shop at Target if they were sponsoring an X-bus service that I used (and I'd let the Store Manager know).

CTA Gray Line Apr 13, 2011 8:56 AM

South Lakefront Corridor Transit Study Meeting
 
Is anyone from this Forum attending the Corridor Study Meeting tomorrow: http://www.redeyechicago.com/news/ct...4569031.column

Mr Downtown Apr 13, 2011 2:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the urban politician (Post 5239376)
A $20 train that whisks tourists/business travelers from O'Hare to the Loop in under 20 minutes, or whisks you from the Loop to O'Hare in the same time post-TSA could perhaps run a profit. What don't you get about that?

The part where it ever happens. What prevents a private transportation company from offering such a service today? GO Airport Express, with nonunion drivers, cheap vans, and no tracks or terminals to pay for, is $28 plus tip.

The business-traveler market for a train from the Loop to O'Hare is badly constrained by the fact that only two hotels are within walking distance of a Union Station terminal, and only four or five within walking distance of Block 37. Continuing downstate trains on out to O'Hare, though, seems like an idea worth exploring. I was sorry to see Mayor Daley so dismissive of it.

the urban politician Apr 13, 2011 8:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown (Post 5239686)
The part where it ever happens. What prevents a private transportation company from offering such a service today? GO Airport Express, with nonunion drivers, cheap vans, and no tracks or terminals to pay for, is $28 plus tip.

The business-traveler market for a train from the Loop to O'Hare is badly constrained by the fact that only two hotels are within walking distance of a Union Station terminal, and only four or five within walking distance of Block 37. Continuing downstate trains on out to O'Hare, though, seems like an idea worth exploring. I was sorry to see Mayor Daley so dismissive of it.

^ Says the same guy who said that "tens" of people would use Metra to get to the Sox game, and instead 1200 did so. Your pessimism about everything rail gets old.

I'm sure solutions to what you mentioned can be worked out and still make it competitive with those private shuttle companies. Besides, with traffic I doubt those shuttles would compete with a train, especially if the train truly offered riders to go through TSA security while still downtown.

Nowhereman1280 Apr 13, 2011 9:09 PM

Let me take a minute to change the topic from the typical incessant pessimism of this thread:


I would just like to rejoice in the fact that I am using the train to get to work for the first time in over a year. After I started working out by O'Hare instead of downtown, I was forced to drive to my job since I was not close enough to the Blue Line for it to be a reasonable commute. I just moved to Logan Square and my life is so much better now thanks to the CTA and their cost-effective, reasonably high quality, frequent service. I've been enjoying the crap out of my stress-free 10 minute walk from my house to the subway. It feels so good to be car-free again...

Also, until now (having always lived on the North Side) I never realized how reasonably efficient the East-West buses between Logan Square or Avondale and Lincoln Park are. I'm able to get from my house to Lincoln Park in 15 or 20 minutes which is not bad at all.

Beta_Magellan Apr 13, 2011 11:08 PM

You’re right, Nowehereman—as much as we worry about expansion, the core network is in pretty good shape with the exception of the Red Line north of Belmont, whose repair has been bumped up to the CTA’s first priority. Even without the X-routes our buses are still pretty good—I ended up doing a lot of running around yesterday afternoon and ended up having to take four buses and a two train rides, all without any problem. As a Boston native, the train was my first choice and I never really considered the bus an option—Chicago changed my mind about that.

Do you have to worry about Pace for your commute? Last summer I considered taking a job in Arlington heights, but one of the things that dissuaded me from pursuing it was having to rely on both Metra’s reverse trains and Pace to get to my destination, not so much a problem with the trains as with me (I don’t think I could take having to wait more than fifteen minutes if I missed my bus/train to work).

ardecila Apr 14, 2011 2:29 AM

I don't know how you can call the east-west buses efficient. Sure, they don't break down, and - eventually - they get you where you're going, but they're an agonizingly slow way to get around.

At a minimum, they need to drastically reduce the number of stops on Irving Park, Belmont, and North. Not a separate express service that only comes every 20 minutes - I mean eliminating the other stops completely. This would lower travel times and increase frequency (a driver can complete more end-to-end runs in a given shift).

Jenner Apr 14, 2011 3:12 AM

Why wasn't the Paulina connector moved to Ashland during the rebuild? That would seem to make more sense if they were interested in the circle line, as the CTA wouldn't need to buy so many properties (assuming they will go through with it.)

emathias Apr 14, 2011 5:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jenner (Post 5240775)
Why wasn't the Paulina connector moved to Ashland during the rebuild? That would seem to make more sense if they were interested in the circle line, as the CTA wouldn't need to buy so many properties (assuming they will go through with it.)

Why would you move it? You can route it to Ashland if a Circle Line is ever built (doubtful in my lifetime) and in the mean time it's much more efficient where it is, seeing as it can go straight up from the Pink Line's route on existing right-of way without covering a busy street with either disruptive or extremely expensive (or both) elevated structures.


All times are GMT. The time now is 6:17 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.