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-   -   How Is Covid-19 Impacting Life in Your City? (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=242036)

iheartthed May 8, 2020 4:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10023 (Post 8915868)
A. It’s the responsibility of those younger people to not interact with older people unless they are also isolating themselves.
B. This is false unless they have underlying health conditions, including obesity. Or at least the risk is so low that applying the same risk avoidance standard would preclude most daily activities, like getting behind the wheel of a car.
C. This can be monitored, but the risk of overwhelming the health system appears to have passed.
D. Most people don’t need PPE.
E. This will only be possible with comprehensive testing, which isn’t going to be feasible.
F. Not an argument.

I know you're trolling but it is not only fatal to younger people when they have health issues. A child on Long Island just died today, in fact. And, considering that he was training for tryouts with the NFL, I would bet $10,000 that this guy was in better shape than you before he died: https://bgcmonmouth.org/2020/04/17/a...e-simon-press/

Kngkyle May 8, 2020 5:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iheartthed (Post 8916187)
I know you're trolling but it is not only fatal to younger people when they have health issues. A child on Long Island just died today, in fact. And, considering that he was training for tryouts with the NFL, I would bet $10,000 that this guy was in better shape than you before he died: https://bgcmonmouth.org/2020/04/17/a...e-simon-press/

Anecdotes do not change the underlying statistics that show healthy young people have nothing to worry about.

iheartthed May 8, 2020 5:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kngkyle (Post 8916226)
Anecdotes do not change the underlying statistics that show healthy young people have nothing to worry about.

^This is a nonsensical statement. Statistics do not change the fact that young healthy people CAN die from it and HAVE died from it.

Kngkyle May 8, 2020 5:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iheartthed (Post 8916231)
^This is a nonsensical statement. Statistics do not change the fact that young healthy people CAN die from it and HAVE died from it.

Young healthy people CAN die from and HAVE died from being struck by lightning, eaten by sharks, automobile accidents, the flu, and a million other causes. The odds of dying from such causes are so low that we tend to go about our normal life without living in fear.

The forcing of all young people to stay home, with many losing their jobs and livelihoods, over something that they are statistically not at material risk for, is what 10023 is questioning.

the urban politician May 8, 2020 5:33 PM

According to ihearthed, if you don’t 100% agree with him you’re trolling.

Emblematic of what’s wrong with discourse today at a larger level

iheartthed May 8, 2020 5:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kngkyle (Post 8916249)
Young healthy people CAN die from and HAVE died from being struck by lightning, eaten by sharks, automobile accidents, the flu, and a million other causes. The odds of dying from such causes are so low that we tend to go about our normal life without living in fear.

The forcing of all young people to stay home, with many losing their jobs and livelihoods, over something that they are at very little risk of consequence is what 10023 is questioning.

I know what he's questioning. I'm saying it's stupid. I'm pretty confident that I can drive as fast as I want without killing myself, but we all seem to understand why there are speed limits. We force people to do shit every day out of the interest of public health.

Yuri May 8, 2020 5:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kngkyle (Post 8916028)
That is a forecast, not actuals. And nobody can accurately forecast what is going to happen right now, so it's pretty worthless as well. What if Denmark and Norway have a second wave and Sweden doesn't? Is Sweden just pulling the bandaid off quickly and Denmark and Norway are delaying the inevitable? We don't know. You don't know. Why do you act like you know?

Precisely because we don't know, society should be cautious, buying time to get prepared. An actual: as today, Denmark and Norway are far more successful protecting their population and ending their outbreak earlier.

Yuri May 8, 2020 5:54 PM

I know it's all about trolling, political radicalism, misanthropy, etc. but let's argue:

Covid-19 death rates are at 0.5%-1.0%, depending on the country's age pyramid and health systems working. By doing nothing, not even social distancing, the virus could reach the entire population within 3 months, killing between 1.5 million to 3.0 million people in the US alone. The actual number would probably be higher as millions of people would get very ill and would receive no treatment whatsoever.

Could the US cope to those numbers? Would the US economy be normal in such scenario?

Vlajos May 8, 2020 6:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iheartthed (Post 8916231)
^This is a nonsensical statement. Statistics do not change the fact that young healthy people CAN die from it and HAVE died from it.

Every year I read about a young athlete dropping dead during training. Of course young can die, you will never prevent that.

iheartthed May 8, 2020 6:26 PM

nevermind

SIGSEGV May 8, 2020 6:57 PM

In Illinois, 14% of deaths are below age 60, and 31% are below age 70.

mousquet May 8, 2020 7:03 PM

Ah, you know about this famous quote by Benjamin Franklin.

Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

Then they get none of the 2, I think he added.

This whole debate is about taking risk versus seeking safety. It's always worth taking some risk when it's wisely assessed, but no one should act arrogant to mother nature or science, or they'll be harshly punished, if not humiliated in the end.

For now, the wisest and obvious deal is probably to keep elders at home, so they don't stupidly die for a tiny ugly virus. Old people often have some rather interesting purchasing power, huh. So they are significant consumers to the economy. It would be too bad to lose too many of them.
And people under age 60 need to go back to their occupations, or the economy would end up completely ruined, which would kill countless people.

Guess that's about it.

10023 May 8, 2020 9:03 PM

In London, cycling has never been more popular. I rode about 30 miles today across the city, and you can basically join pelotons and draft behind people the whole way.

Parks also very full. People are observing social distancing, but you can’t keep Brits at home when it’s 75 and sunny.

10023 May 8, 2020 9:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIGSEGV (Post 8916364)
In Illinois, 14% of deaths are below age 60, and 31% are below age 70.

And how many below 50 and not obese?

10023 May 8, 2020 9:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yuriandrade (Post 8916279)
I know it's all about trolling, political radicalism, misanthropy, etc. but let's argue:

Covid-19 death rates are at 0.5%-1.0%, depending on the country's age pyramid and health systems working. By doing nothing, not even social distancing, the virus could reach the entire population within 3 months, killing between 1.5 million to 3.0 million people in the US alone. The actual number would probably be higher as millions of people would get very ill and would receive no treatment whatsoever.

Could the US cope to those numbers? Would the US economy be normal in such scenario?

Yes, absolutely, given the demographics affected. Losing a million retirees would have very little impact relative to the current lockdown measures.

10023 May 8, 2020 9:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by glowrock (Post 8915898)
Oh yes, Chicago is normal. Perfectly normal, nobody even notices the pandemic. Oh good lord, dude. You're 110% flat-out wrong on this one. You've not seen photos of virtually empty streets in the Loop? Closed parks? No Lakefront trail? Close to empty L Trains and buses? Everyone under a mask order for any situation where 6 foot distancing isn't likely? Only take-out and delivery options for restaurants? No bars? No pretty much everything other than groceries and household staples?

Wow, yeah, Chicago is normal, all right. :(

As for 10023, you don't think our numbers are still high? 3000 new cases, 130+ deaths just yesterday? The vast majority being in Cook County? Nah, just statistical noise. Sheesh.

Aaron (Glowrock)

Case numbers are irrelevant and no, 130 deaths per day in a state with 13 million people is not something that justifies such a dramatic response.

SIGSEGV May 8, 2020 9:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10023 (Post 8916534)
Case numbers are irrelevant and no, 130 deaths per day in a state with 13 million people is not something that justifies such a dramatic response.

Yes, 130 deaths per day does not justify such a dramatic response. The predicted ~100,000 deaths that would occur in the state on the way to herd immunity on the other hand...

dc_denizen May 8, 2020 9:28 PM

I tend to agree, let young people go about their business

this is getting ridiculous

mousquet May 8, 2020 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIGSEGV (Post 8916548)
Yes, 130 deaths per day does not justify such a dramatic response. The predicted ~100,000 deaths that would occur in the state on the way to herd immunity on the other hand...

I think they don't even really know whether having been infected once would make you immune for good. It's not like any well known childhood sickness.

That's the whole problem about that virus. They keep telling us they're learning about it every day, but it's still actually widely unknown. Like it's a brand new mean thing that was released out of nowhere in the middle of China just 6 months ago.

Virologists and epidemiologists are upset over here, arguing like restless kids on a playground in the media, then people as the government are freaking out, 'cause it's such a sneaky vicious thing.

There's something sure about it. If you are in a decent health condition, the probability for you to die from it is very thin, close to nil. Tens of millions of people around the world might have been infected already without even noticing. That must be taken into account too.

Centropolis May 9, 2020 12:45 AM

sat in a bit of evening rush hour traffic in st. louis coming back from southern illinois. i didnt expect this...while st. louis city and county remain in a lockdown the state has opened and it is having some effect in the center of the st louis region. the restaurants in places like cape girardeau are allegedly packed tonight.


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