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CTA Gray Line Aug 5, 2016 7:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by i_am_hydrogen (Post 7522797)
I don't think anyone is celebrating those things. People in poor neighborhoods desperately want to see investment and positive change. But they want to be around to enjoy that change without being priced out in five to fifteen years. I agree there are many benefits of gentrification, but it's also a runaway train. Once it gets going and builds momentum, it can't be stopped. Hispanics have experienced this in neighborhood after neighborhood across the city. How do we find a balance between improving neighborhoods and allowing poor and lower middle class people to remain?

I agree with you 1,000%, I work midnight shift in a gas station, and from my experiences there I would like to see Greyhound Buses SHOVED-UP into everybody, until the Buses started popping out of their GD mouths.

SORRY!!

chicagopcclcar1 Aug 6, 2016 4:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the urban politician (Post 7522751)
Having said that, I 100% disagree with Chicagopcclcar1 in that investing in better and more frequent transit on the south side is a waste. I think there is a case to be made that if such an investment is made along the south lakefront,...... WE CAN PERHAPS HAVE POSITIVE CHANGE on the south side for the first time in a century.

Quote:

Originally Posted by orulz (Post 7522283)
As far as improving transit to the south side goes - I'm all for it within reason. I don't buy the argument that chicagopcclcar1 is making - that because usage is low today means it's a waste to invest in making it better. But that also doesn't mean the city should throw hundreds of millions at it instead of investing in where the riders are currently at. There is a balance.

Thank you for your responses....in light of your input, I will amend my criticisms and offer that the ME South Chicago is far enough from the CTA Red line, and has been equipped with passenger facilities, in line with the faded proposals called "Silver" line, "Gold" line??..... that line might be salvaged... as Metra Electric operation, not a CTA "L" line. It has not been shown that ME equipment can be operated in a rapid transit mode....they are running four car trains when only a single car is utilized. Can ME car consists be broken down easily?

The main line, from 75th to Kensington has no value worth saving and is within the CTA Red line catchment area and someday, residents will get the one-seat ride on the extended CTA to 130th St. Those timber platforms and "third-world" passenger facilities can be dispatched in weeks with construction bulldozers and front loaders....a they would be only dreams of yesterday.

DH

CTA Gray Line Aug 6, 2016 4:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicagopcclcar1 (Post 7523545)
Thank you for your responses....in light of your input, I will amend my criticisms and offer that the ME South Chicago is far enough from the CTA Red line, and has been equipped with passenger facilities, in line with the faded proposals called "Silver" line, "Gold" line??..... that line might be salvaged... as Metra Electric operation, not a CTA "L" line. It has not been shown that ME equipment can be operated in a rapid transit mode....they are running four car trains when only a single car is utilized. Can ME car consists be broken down easily?

The main line, from 75th to Kensington has no value worth saving and is within the CTA Red line catchment area and someday, residents will get the one-seat ride on the extended CTA to 130th St. Those timber platforms and "third-world" passenger facilities can be dispatched in weeks with construction bulldozers and front loaders....a they would be only dreams of yesterday.

DH

When I created the Gray Line I lived 3 blocks from the Woodruff MED station (87th & Cottage Grove); didn't we learn enough about demolishing Transit Facilities from that I D I O T Brazier destroying the Eastern end of the Green Line? (which now everybody wants back)

N E V E R . E V E R destroy a Transit Facility, unless it's being immediaetly replaced like the Congress Expy. Line replaced the Garfield Park 'L'. The West Side has the Pink, Blue, and Green Line triumvirate, which are much closer together than the Red and 2 Metra Lines on the South Side? According to the way you seem to think, one of the West Side Lines should be eliminated -- because their catchment areas overlap -- Right?



WHY are you so blasted determined to ELIMINATE Transit services in the Black Community?



The Capital Cost of RTP ID# 01-02-9003 INCLUDES updating the Mainline stations also (except 91st, and 107th, which would be closed)

What is it, the Black people along the Mainline don't deserve the Jobs and Economic Development that are ALWAYS created around A N Y New 'L' station. There's ALL KINDS of new TOD along the Milwaukee Ave. Blue Line; and now even at the 63rd & Cottage Green Line -- but you would ELIMINATE any possibility of that happening along the Mainline with your misguided actions.

Grand Crossing, Chatham, Avalon Park, Burnside, CSU, Roseland, and Pullman Nat. Park also need adjacent CTA Rail services for Jobs and Economic Development - WHY would you leave them out?

Highliners can be operated as 2, 3, 4 or more units, so there is much flexibility in consists, and 1 (one) Highliner seats more than THREE little toy 'L' cars, and on only 2 trucks, instead of 6 trucks, and the associated mechanicals like Air, AC to DC power conversion, braking, power collection, etc.; please describe for us the "rapid-transit" mode you question if the Highliners could (or could not) be operated in? The MED has stations every 4 blocks (rapid-transit spacing), and EMU (rapid-transit type) Rolling Stock -- what is the issue? The AC powered Highliner II's have acceleration equivalent to any CTA 'L' equipment: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pjH2AO6DCQ

Even CMME put their video along the MAINLINE specifically relating to Pullman Nat. Park; we want a Transit System - not crumbs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHNxL3JHUek

chicagopcclcar1 Aug 6, 2016 6:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTA Gray Line (Post 7523574)
When I created the Gray Line I lived 3 blocks from Woodruff (87th & Cottage Grove).

You didn't notice I responded to two other posters...not to you. A year ago there were complaints.....about the endless bickering and arguments about the Gray line. I took those complaints as worthy and set about to just read but did not post. I saw a legion of stories laced with political persons now incarcerated, block 37, questions about plans in other metropolitan Chicagoland areas....lastly a school CEO, school closings, and Greyhound bus and the human body. What does all this have to do with transit?? I'm glad I resisted.

Finally, I posed the question...."How could a deficit operation be considered?" I was told, "why not." Then I questioned, who here would used ME as a rapid transit....no response...meaning all the people favoring....no one lives in SE Chicago.

It's no secret, there's no groundswell support for this idea. Support from people who live in the area and would use the service. At least I supplied the YOUTUBE to view the CTA board meeting.

DH

CTA Gray Line Aug 6, 2016 7:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicagopcclcar1 (Post 7523623)
You didn't notice I responded to two other posters...not to you. A year ago there were complaints.....about the endless bickering and arguments about the Gray line. I took those complaints as worthy and set about to just read but did not post. I saw a legion of stories laced with political persons now incarcerated, block 37, questions about plans in other metropolitan Chicagoland areas....lastly a school CEO, school closings, and Greyhound bus and the human body. What does all this have to do with transit?? I'm glad I resisted.

Finally, I posed the question...."How could a deficit operation be considered?" I was told, "why not." Then I questioned, who here would used ME as a rapid transit....no response...meaning all the people favoring....no one lives in SE Chicago.

It's no secret, there's no groundswell support for this idea. Support from people who live in the area and would use the service. At least I supplied the YOUTUBE to view the CTA board meeting.

DH

I am sooooo hurt that you didn't respond to me!!!

NO groundswell: WOW, so you manage to I G N O R E the inputs of MULTIPLE South Side Chambers of Commerce: http://chicagoreporter.com/revamped-...he-fast-track/

Chambers of Commerce are staffed by leading business owners of local areas, but they don't understand what THEIR O W N COMMUNITIES NEED according to you -- Right?

You manage to ignore anything that doesn't agree with your thinking; and anybody of course would listen to MULTIPLE Chambers of Commerce before they would listen to ONE individual. And like always you ignore questions about exactly what the "rapid-transit mode" you describe means to you? You love "posing" questions, BUT won't "answer" them!

I've seen you at CTA Board Meetings before, so you are perfectly welcome to show-up Wednesday and oppose my testimony.

And if you hadn't noticed, it's out of my hands -- CMME PAID to have their video made, and formed a Coalition; if I stopped, do you think they would stop also?

And I did not create this Tribune article, but the Gray (and Gold) Lines were mentioned in it: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/c...623-story.html So now you have to contact City Hall and tell the Mayor that he needs to forget the idea -- Good Luck!

chicagopcclcar1 Aug 6, 2016 7:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTA Gray Line (Post 7523634)
I am sooooo hurt that you didn't respond to me!!!

Many posters here are glad too!
CTA Aug. 10, 2016, will be broadcast two hours after on YOUTUBE.

DH

CTA Gray Line Aug 6, 2016 9:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicagopcclcar1 (Post 7523652)
Many posters here are glad too!
CTA Aug. 10, 2016, will be broadcast two hours after on YOUTUBE.

DH

Are you going to contact and school the Mayor DH?

chicagopcclcar1 Aug 7, 2016 5:40 PM

No need to do that...unlike a solo presentation "long in tooth", municipal officials from mayor, administration personal, CEO's, board members, elected officials, etc, etc, are all onboard.

"In 2015 the CTA continued its work on the proposed $2.3 billion Red Line Extension (RLE) project that would extend the Red Line from 95th Street to the vicinity of 130th Street. The proposed 5.3-mile extension would include new stations at 103rd Street, 111th Street, Michigan Avenue and 130th Street. The project would provide a one-seat ride for far South Side residents from 130th Street to downtown. The Red Line Extension would also foster economic development and revitalize communities, improving resident access to jobs and education."

Source: http://www.transitchicago.com/assets...Compressed.pdf

DH

CTA Gray Line Aug 7, 2016 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicagopcclcar1 (Post 7524198)
No need to do that...unlike a solo presentation "long in tooth", municipal officials from mayor, administration personal, CEO's, board members, elected officials, etc, etc, are all onboard.

"In 2015 the CTA continued its work on the proposed $2.3 billion Red Line Extension (RLE) project that would extend the Red Line from 95th Street to the vicinity of 130th Street. The proposed 5.3-mile extension would include new stations at 103rd Street, 111th Street, Michigan Avenue and 130th Street. The project would provide a one-seat ride for far South Side residents from 130th Street to downtown. The Red Line Extension would also foster economic development and revitalize communities, improving resident access to jobs and education."

Source: http://www.transitchicago.com/assets...Compressed.pdf

DH

I am going to ignore that, like you are able to ignore this:

Source: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/c...623-story.html

chicagopcclcar1 Aug 7, 2016 11:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTA Gray Line (Post 7522928)
I agree with you 1,000%,

SORRY!!


And DO YOU READ what you advertise....Chicago Tribune article....Coalition For ME??? Seems that they are at different ideas than what you have proposed for decades....Coalition DOES NOT propose a CTA takeover.....Coalition does not propose CTA fares on ME. Sounds like they are more interested in ME connected to Union Station and ME being used to power an O'Hare rail service.

Yes, the Coalition wants rapid transit headways, but they seem to know the service would be provided by Metra Electric trains, run by ME personnel, and run under the ME name.

"The main problem with the Metra Electric is that the trains just don't run frequently enough. Trains should run every 10-15 minutes, like a CTA rail line, to unlock the potential of the entire region."

"Ventra card on the MED, Metra will be able to integrate MED fares and provide transfer discounts with the CTA and Pace." Source: ModernMetraElectric...

I don't see CTA takeover. Does any one else???

DH

eleven=11 Aug 7, 2016 11:56 PM

hello The google&wiki maps are new about Aug 1st

CTA Gray Line Aug 8, 2016 2:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicagopcclcar1 (Post 7524410)
Ignore what YOU WROTE.....Are you prescribing sodomy???

And DO YOU READ what you advertise....Chicago Tribune article....Coalition For ME??? Seems that they are at different ideas than what you have proposed for decades....Coalition DOES NOT propose a CTA takeover.....Coalition does not propose CTA fares on ME. Sounds like they are more interested in ME connected to Union Station and ME being used to power an O'Hare rail service.

Yes, the Coalition wants rapid transit headways, but they seem to know the service would be provided by Metra Electric trains, run by ME personnel, and run under the ME name.

"The main problem with the Metra Electric is that the trains just don't run frequently enough. Trains should run every 10-15 minutes, like a CTA rail line, to unlock the potential of the entire region."

"Ventra card on the MED, Metra will be able to integrate MED fares and provide transfer discounts with the CTA and Pace." Source: ModernMetraElectric...

I don't see CTA takeover. Does any one else???

DH

We'll just have to wait and see, I am going to ask Don and Martin to let me work with their Planning Dept. (Free), which Harvey Kahler and I done several times already.

He drew up a berthing diagram for Millennium Station allowing for a train dispatched every 5 minutes during Rush hour, and Harvey is a recognized Transit Planner!

We also recommend flat CTA Fares in-city.

CMME has goals, buy they know nothing about the infrastructure, the Gray Line is wholly baed on the existing MED infrastructure!

chicagopcclcar1 Aug 8, 2016 3:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CTA Gray Line (Post 7524732)
We'll just have to wait and see....
CMME has goals, buy they no nothing about the infrastructure, the Gray Line is wholly based on the existing MED infrastructure!

CMME could have my support. They leave the CTA routes alone.

Here's a tote on the "Ceremonial Indian Calumet"...peace pipe...I'll watch you on Wednesday on YOUTUBE, peacefully.

DH

CTA Gray Line Aug 8, 2016 5:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicagopcclcar1 (Post 7524789)
CMME could have my support. They leave the CTA routes alone.

Here's a tote on the "Ceremonial Indian Calumet"...peace pipe...I'll watch you on Wednesday on YOUTUBE, peacefully.

DH

Remember I'm addressing CTA's Board on Wednesday, Metra is the 24th. And I'm not tampering with any present CTA Routes, I'm attempting to add a NEW one!

Soooooo Wrong of me!!!

orulz Aug 9, 2016 1:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicagopcclcar1 (Post 7523545)
Thank you for your responses....in light of your input, I will amend my criticisms and offer that the ME South Chicago is far enough from the CTA Red line, and has been equipped with passenger facilities, in line with the faded proposals called "Silver" line, "Gold" line??..... that line might be salvaged... as Metra Electric operation, not a CTA "L" line. It has not been shown that ME equipment can be operated in a rapid transit mode....they are running four car trains when only a single car is utilized. Can ME car consists be broken down easily?

Really it does not matter to me who operates it. What matters is the frequency and fare integration with CTA so there is no fare penalty for changing between CTA<->Metra and so a trip on the train costs the same as a trip on a bus or on the L.
Quote:

The main line, from 75th to Kensington has no value worth saving and is within the CTA Red line catchment area and someday, residents will get the one-seat ride on the extended CTA to 130th St. Those timber platforms and "third-world" passenger facilities can be dispatched in weeks with construction bulldozers and front loaders....a they would be only dreams of yesterday.
The fact that it has the same catchment area as the red line extension is a feature, not a bug. The red line extension is a horrible allocation of resources. Not because the people living there don't need transit, but because of the terrible cost per mile. The ME actually has a better, more useful routing between the south side and the Loop than the red line, serving useful clusters of density and employment such as Hyde Park and McCormick Place. So as long as the frequency is good and the fare doesn't cost any more than a comparable red line trip, people will ride it. You could take the $billions planned for the red line extension, use it to upgrade facilities on the MED, buy more trainsets, and operate them at rapid transit frequency, and still have over a $billion left over to subsidize *ALL* Metra fares within the city for all eternity so they cost the same as CTA fares and you get free/discounted transfers to CTA L lines and buses.

Under this scenario a useful extension of the red line would be a roughly 3/4 mile extension in the median of the Bishop Ford to 100th & Cottage Grove where a transfer station with the MED could be built. This would allow people from further down the MED to transfer to the red line to access what destinations there are along the Dan Ryan line (IIT, White Sox ball games, etc)

CTA Gray Line Aug 9, 2016 2:20 AM

:slob: the
Quote:

Originally Posted by orulz (Post 7525389)
Really it does not matter to me who operates it. What matters is the frequency and fare integration with CTA so there is no fare penalty for changing between CTA<->Metra and so a trip on the train costs the same as a trip on a bus or on the L.

The fact that it has the same catchment area as the red line extension is a feature, not a bug. The red line extension is a horrible allocation of resources. Not because the people living there don't need transit, but because of the terrible cost per mile. The ME actually has a better, more useful routing between the south side and the Loop than the red line, serving useful clusters of density and employment such as Hyde Park and McCormick Place. So as long as the frequency is good and the fare doesn't cost any more than a comparable red line trip, people will ride it. You could take the $billions planned for the red line extension, use it to upgrade facilities on the MED, buy more trainsets, and operate them at rapid transit frequency, and still have over a $billion left over to subsidize *ALL* Metra fares within the city for all eternity so they cost the same as CTA fares and you get free/discounted transfers to CTA L lines and buses.

Under this scenario a useful extension of the red line would be a roughly 3/4 mile extension in the median of the Bishop Ford to 100th & Cottage Grove where a transfer station with the MED could be built. This would allow people from further down the MED to transfer to the red line to access what destinations there are along the Dan Ryan line (IIT, White Sox ball games, etc)

SMART MAN!!!!

CTA Gray Line Aug 9, 2016 3:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orulz (Post 7525389)
Really it does not matter to me who operates it. What matters is the frequency and fare integration with CTA so there is no fare penalty for changing between CTA<->Metra and so a trip on the train costs the same as a trip on a bus or on the L.

The fact that it has the same catchment area as the red line extension is a feature, not a bug. The red line extension is a horrible allocation of resources. Not because the people living there don't need transit, but because of the terrible cost per mile. The ME actually has a better, more useful routing between the south side and the Loop than the red line, serving useful clusters of density and employment such as Hyde Park and McCormick Place. So as long as the frequency is good and the fare doesn't cost any more than a comparable red line trip, people will ride it. You could take the $billions planned for the red line extension, use it to upgrade facilities on the MED, buy more trainsets, and operate them at rapid transit frequency, and still have over a $billion left over to subsidize *ALL* Metra fares within the city for all eternity so they cost the same as CTA fares and you get free/discounted transfers to CTA L lines and buses.

Under this scenario a useful extension of the red line would be a roughly 3/4 mile extension in the median of the Bishop Ford to 100th & Cottage Grove where a transfer station with the MED could be built. This would allow people from further down the MED to transfer to the red line to access what destinations there are along the Dan Ryan line (IIT, White Sox ball games, etc)

DH -- Please define (in detail) this mysterious "rapid-transit mode" you speak of for us???

Also, an even better idea for the RLE would be to turn it back North along the MED, for a joint Transfer Station at 95th & Cottage Grove - directly serving the CSU Campus, and a Neighborhood Transit Hub!! I will mention that to CTA on Wednesday.

Thanx for the suggestion orulz!

CTA Gray Line Aug 9, 2016 4:17 AM

The 6 mile Red Line Extension, at 2.3 Billion - costs approximately 380 million per mile (use your own Calculator)

The 25 mile Gray Line System, at 500 Million - costs about 20 Million per mile.

Which seems a more sensible application of Transit Funds to you folks?

The first thing that comes into my mind is restoration of the entire city-wide X-Bus system - spreading the benefits to the ENTIRE CITY (ALL Neighborhoods); instead of one tiny little 6 mile appendix: http://www.grayline.20m.com/photo.html

orulz Aug 9, 2016 10:53 AM

I think the sensible way to implement upgrades to the MED is not to add CTA fare gates which would cost bundles, but rather to implement it as a proof of payment system. Really all of Metra should do this. Works all over the world. Handling free and deeply discounted transfers is just a matter of resolving the agency turf wars and then updating some software.

CTA Gray Line Aug 9, 2016 1:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orulz (Post 7525600)
I think the sensible way to implement upgrades to the MED is not to add CTA fare gates which would cost bundles, but rather to implement it as a proof of payment system. Really all of Metra should do this. Works all over the world. Handling free and deeply discounted transfers is just a matter of resolving the agency turf wars and then updating some software.

Nice thought -- but UNbarriered platforms (with open access by non-passengers) would result in multiple Robberies and Rapes several times EACH and EVERY DAY; I lived on the South Side for 58 of my 67yrs, we're NOT talkiing about Winnetka, Lisle, or Barrington Hills here. "All over the world" ISN'T the South Side of Chicago (AKA "Chi-raq")

I absolutely N E V E R . E V E R . E V E R rode the Metra Electric because I personally didn't want to get Robbed or Worse, and that is a VERY BIG PART of why N O B O D Y else rides it now (except maybe in Hyde Park); E V E R Y B O D Y living on the South Side K N O W S this already!!! I'm thinking especially of women traveling ALONE at night, what protection would they have with open-access Platforms???

Heck -- We get Robberies regularly on the CTA with O N L Y Paid Platform Access: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...601-story.html http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...809-story.html http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...421-story.html

What do think would happen with platforms with open access to ANYBODY???


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