SkyscraperPage Forum

SkyscraperPage Forum (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/index.php)
-   Skyscraper & Highrise Construction (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=103)
-   -   CHICAGO | BMO Tower | 727 FT | 50 FLOORS (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=224752)

ardecila Jul 1, 2018 3:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the urban politician (Post 8238622)
Yeah, the grandeur of the exterior does not continue when you enter the building.

Perhaps that can be corrected in a future remodeling?

I think within the classical paradigm, it's difficult to design a building with open stacks, because it creates so much more square footage that then has to be treated with expensive materials and ornamentation. The famous NY Public Library on 42nd St has closed stacks, so most of the books are contained within a very raw unfinished space that is off-limits to all but librarians, while the public only sees a series of gorgeous lobbies and reading rooms. Of course, this means they need to hire a lot of librarians, but it's also more space-efficient because the stacks can be collapsible or automated, you don't need a bunch of aisles.

For this reason, the interior of the HWPL is mixed quality. Parts are spectacular, like the lobby with the round hole in the floor and the winter garden. Other parts are very pedestrian, like the elevator banks and restrooms. I don't mind having to go up into the stacks, it's a symbolic transition, the knowledge of the library is literally contained on a higher level and you have to go up to access it, often through a relatively constrained staircase. The escalators themselves at the HWPL remind me of malls and I wish they were replaced with an actual staircase.

The lobby itself is gorgeous with the round hole in the floor, and the access sequence to upper levels is literally the same as other renowned libraries like Labrouste's Bibliotheque Ste Genevieve. It doesn't have the cavernous reading room of that library, but instead it has a series of pretty neat study carrels contained within the uber-thick brick perimeter on every floor, that bring a little mystique to every floor of the building.

Mr Downtown Jul 1, 2018 3:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilsenarch (Post 8238606)
The entry sequence? It's just a very bad joke.

I'm not sure I'd agree with that. You come through an elegant but compressed portal and then into the high-ceilinged central court, which was organized as an impressive rotunda. Then up the escalators past a couple of big pieces of public art and into the reference and circulation area. From Congress, you pass through a gallery to reach the rotunda. The entry from Van Buren or Plymouth was less straightforward.

Now that lengthy sequence was very frustrating for us frequent users who just wanted to get to the books rather than be impressed by civic grandeur twice a week—but "a very bad joke?" My understanding was that the library insisted on such separation from the sidewalks, for security purposes. That was also what reportedly scotched the direct entry from the L station.

Recently, they've eliminated the third-floor checkpoint, so you can now get straightaway to an elevator right on the ground floor. Unfortunately, that means going to what seems like the service corridor in the back of the building.

rgarri4 Jul 1, 2018 6:59 PM

The Harrold Washington Library is ugly and just plan silly looking. I remember in architecture school how it always came up as a bad example of Post Modernism. And its interiors, other than the top floor, are atrocious.

10023 Jul 1, 2018 7:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rgarri4 (Post 8238775)
The Harrold Washington Library is ugly and just plan silly looking. I remember in architecture school how it always came up as a bad example of Post Modernism. And its interiors, other than the top floor, are atrocious.

I’ve always thought it was OK if one looked at it as an intentionally over-the-top, flamboyant design. Sort of like Gaudi’s work.

Busy Bee Jul 1, 2018 10:21 PM

^Concur

pilsenarch Jul 2, 2018 4:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown (Post 8238677)
I'm not sure I'd agree with that. You come through an elegant but compressed portal and then into the high-ceilinged central court, which was organized as an impressive rotunda. Then up the escalators past a couple of big pieces of public art and into the reference and circulation area. From Congress, you pass through a gallery to reach the rotunda. The entry from Van Buren or Plymouth was less straightforward.

Now that lengthy sequence was very frustrating for us frequent users who just wanted to get to the books rather than be impressed by civic grandeur twice a week—but "a very bad joke?" My understanding was that the library insisted on such separation from the sidewalks, for security purposes. That was also what reportedly scotched the direct entry from the L station.

Recently, they've eliminated the third-floor checkpoint, so you can now get straightaway to an elevator right on the ground floor. Unfortunately, that means going to what seems like the service corridor in the back of the building.

Yes, you enter through a compressed portal, which is fine, and then you arrive at an *adequate* space with the whole in the floor (looking down on a space that hardly anyone inhabits)...

the real problem starts once you arrive in that ground floor space which one would most likely be in only if they didn't know where they were going... once you do realize how to get up into the library, you either have to wait for an elevator, or you *turn-around* and have to use *single-wide*, *switch-back* escalators to arrive in a completely *pedestrian* space...

what is elegant about that? what about that sequence was even remotely beaux-arts inspired? where is the grand staircase? all of the regular users never get even remotely close to the lobby with the round whole because they know to just immediately turnaround upon entering to take the two, narrow escalator rides to... more boredom.

Rizzo Jul 2, 2018 11:13 PM

At some point I think the interior of the library will need to be overhauled. It was designed for books and study, but now it’s less of that and more about learning through experiences and experimentation. I would hope for more large open spaces, improved digital fabrication labs, spacious and modern exhibit rooms, more computer labs tailored to design and production.

Personally I love the ostentatious exterior. Its heavy masonry walls and contrasting metal crown are rich in shadow, texture and contrast. Its only downside is a dark interior with stale fluorescent lighting, but that’s a better reason to pursue a future interior design thats immersive in digital display

Busy Bee Jul 2, 2018 11:30 PM

Books? What is books?

left of center Jul 3, 2018 12:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Busy Bee (Post 8239684)
Books? What is books?

Its like the internet, but printed on trees

:cool:

ardecila Jul 3, 2018 2:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rgarri4 (Post 8238775)
The Harrold Washington Library is ugly and just plan silly looking. I remember in architecture school how it always came up as a bad example of Post Modernism. And its interiors, other than the top floor, are atrocious.

A bad example? I think it's great Postmodernism. Certainly it fits in well with neighbors like the Monadnock and the Second Leiter Building. I like it much better than anything by Michael Graves or Charles Moore.

Busy Bee Jul 3, 2018 2:51 AM

Preach it brother

ethereal_reality Jul 3, 2018 5:48 AM

I remember I was at the Dearborn Street Book Fair when a helicopter flew over dangling one of the giant owls (in route to the library for installation)
It's an image I'll never forget....for a moment it felt like I was in a Fellini film.

Steely Dan Jul 3, 2018 2:16 PM

^ wow, that's awesome! what a great memory to have.

i don't care what anyone says, those giant owls are freaking cool.

i've come to appreciate the over-the-top ridiculousness of HWL's exterior.

but the interior spaces and circulation? yeah, those leave A LOT to be desired.

ChiHi Jul 3, 2018 3:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 10023 (Post 8238782)
I’ve always thought it was OK if one looked at it as an intentionally over-the-top, flamboyant design. Sort of like Gaudi’s work.

If function plays any role in design then the library may be the worst ever built. I've spent a lot of time in that place over the years trying to get work done and that place is almost a megaphone for sound to travel through. There's also so much dead wasted space in there.

And pretty sure the interiors were created with the intention of technology never being a thing. Good luck finding a well placed outlet somewhere. Need to bring a 20' extension chord.

Clarkkent2420 Jul 4, 2018 8:56 PM

#

pilsenarch Jul 4, 2018 9:15 PM

^I get your point,

but art has a function as well,

and architecture IS art,

and key to art as architecture is that, number 1,

it functions!

r18tdi Jul 5, 2018 6:21 PM

I figured there would be some kind of change.org petition by now.. A bit too lazy to start one myself.

spyguy Jul 6, 2018 2:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by r18tdi (Post 8242292)
I figured there would be some kind of change.org petition by now.. A bit too lazy to start one myself.

You can always email the Alderman with your feedback:

Quote:

Your feedback is crucial in Alderman Reilly's negotiations with the development team. If you were unable to attend the community meeting, and would like an opportunity to share your thoughts this proposal, Alderman Reilly wants to hear from you. Contact us at development@ward42chicago.com.

Mr Downtown Jul 6, 2018 3:33 PM

I'm not sure I see Reilly rejecting a PD over aesthetic concerns—though there's no harm in trying. I think a better bet is to make a preservation principles–based argument to members of the Landmarks Commission.

(IT UGLY!!!!
is not such an argument.)

Clarkkent2420 Jul 7, 2018 9:38 PM

#

Rizzo Jul 8, 2018 12:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clarkkent2420 (Post 8244410)
Art’s function is visual stimulation. Architecture can BE art, but architecture’s primary emphasis is to create functionally usable space. Architecture that doesn’t function is bad architecture. Form is important but still subordinate to function.


True, I guess from a pure academic standpoint. But Architecture must be both to be taken seriously. A society’s level of sophistication can be judged by its architecture. The lay perspective is something is “architectural” when it goes beyond status quo with a prominent spacial layout or contains embellishments it complex structures that are not easily created....again...lay perspective. The value poured into human skill and craftsmanship and the intelligence and technology to create gravity defying structure is art. And that’s generally what is appreciated, as society already feels entitled to a functional space. Function has become prescribed either by code, familiar precedent and rule of thumb. We need art more than ever to differentiate our buildings.

Mister Uptempo Jul 10, 2018 7:44 AM

Just a small update on the restoration currently taking place in Union Station's headhouse, specifically, the restoration of the ceiling of the Great Hall-

From February-
https://i.imgur.com/ohsYbcU.jpg

From late June-
https://i.imgur.com/iJJ612l.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/eEOWdd9.jpg
img src - Union Station facebook page

The work shown appears to be the ceiling above one of the Canal St. staircases.

KWillChicago Jul 10, 2018 10:33 AM

So beautiful. Thanks for pictures.

left of center Jul 10, 2018 11:55 PM

Gorgeous! Thanks for the pics!

Clarkkent2420 Jul 11, 2018 6:56 PM

#

BVictor1 Jul 20, 2018 9:27 PM

Expect to see a redesign.

Busy Bee Jul 20, 2018 10:54 PM

Thankyoulord

nomarandlee Jul 21, 2018 2:42 AM

The first rendition was so awful I cynically wonder almost if it was on purpose so that critics and observers are thankful of whatever they have cooked up for 2.0.
I seriously doubt that was the modus operandi but I know I'll sure as hell be appreciative of whatever comes next by comparison.

r18tdi Jul 23, 2018 4:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BVictor1 (Post 8257125)
Expect to see a redesign.

:worship:

Chicago E Aug 25, 2018 11:07 PM

Considering all the great new additions to the CBD of Chicago and the terrific proposals on the drawing board I hate to throw out a negative opinion, but PLEASE redue that last proposal for the wonderful Union Station! The glass addition is so terrible as an addition to the classic look of the original structure. It is reminiscent of the Soldier Field addition which is in my opinion still an eyesore. Wish the original Train Station was not torn down in the early 1970's. I remember going there and it was like Grand Central Station to some degree. The classic look of that building along with the existing Waiting Room would have made that area so unique. I plead that the developer's go back to the drawing board and add something more classical to the top. Thanks!

spyguy Aug 31, 2018 1:34 AM

Round 2. Have they potentially nixed the addition since there's no mention of apartments and the hotel room count has increased a bit?

Quote:

Upcoming Community Presentation for proposed development at Chicago Union Station, 210 South Canal Street

Alderman Reilly invites you to join him and the Neighbors of the West Loop (NOWL) at a second informational presentation regarding a development proposal for Chicago Union Station located at 210 South Canal Street.

After the first community meeting on June 25, the original proposal was deemed unacceptable by the community and the Alderman due to architectural and traffic concerns. As a result, the development team decided to completely revise their vision for the project. Their revisions respond directly to the community feedback gathered at the first community meeting.

Representatives of the Riverside Investment and Development Co. and Convexity Properties development team will present their revised plans and answer any questions you may have about this proposal. Alderman Reilly will be present at this meeting to monitor the discussion and record your feedback.

WHAT: 210 South Canal Street, Chicago Union Station

WHO: Co-Hosted by Alderman Brendan Reilly and
Neighbors of West Loop (NOWL)

WHEN: Tuesday, September 11, 2018, 6:00 P.M. - 8:00 P.M.

WHERE: Chicago Union Station - Burlington Room
500 West Jackson Blvd., Chicago, IL 60661

The proposal includes an amendment to Planned Development No. 376 to permit the Developer to build 400 hotel rooms at Union Station and build an office building on the corner of Clinton, Van Buren, and Canal Streets.

We hope you can join Alderman Reilly and NOWL to engage in a direct dialogue with the development team to gain a better understanding of this proposal and receive answers to any questions you may have.

marothisu Aug 31, 2018 1:59 AM

Really hoping their revision doesn't suck, and if it does, then it's an acceptable amount of suckage unlike the first pass.

left of center Aug 31, 2018 2:38 AM

The developers either need to commit to the Burnham expansion plan (blend with the Art Deco base) using quality materials, or go all out with a thoughtful, modernist design (tastefully contrast with the base) ala Hearst Tower. But don't make some piece of crap then paint it beige in the hopes that no one notices it.

Another option is leave the station alone, and simply build the adjacent tower on the Union Station Transit Center on the south side of Jackson.

Skyguy_7 Aug 31, 2018 2:43 AM

^Agreed. There’s great potential with this building. Just really hope they don’t monkey it up.

What’s the sq footage of office space they’re planning?

Mr Downtown Aug 31, 2018 3:23 AM

That's very promising. If it's all hotel rooms, they don't have the problem of needing additional depth to allow double-loaded apartments above the skylight. So now the cantilever is unnecessary, meaning they can clad the building however they think appropriate without it looking bizarre.

LaSalle.St.Station Aug 31, 2018 4:18 AM

The community has traffic concerns ?. The main train station in the West loop and the community has traffic concerns.

Mr Downtown Aug 31, 2018 4:22 AM

The folks who live on the north side of Adams had some very specific, very local concerns about Uber/Lyft/taxi dropoffs and hotel valet operation. The link between those and deleting all the residential units, however, eludes me.

I think the real story is that Ald. Reilly and some guys from the mayor's office noted the public reaction and looked across at the developer and architect and said "is this really the design you want to build?"

k1052 Aug 31, 2018 12:20 PM

very good news

RedCorsair87 Aug 31, 2018 4:38 PM

I heard from a source close to this project that the addition will be scrapped and the hotel will be moved to the new tower.

Mister Uptempo Aug 31, 2018 8:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown (Post 8299776)
The folks who live on the north side of Adams had some very specific, very local concerns about Uber/Lyft/taxi dropoffs and hotel valet operation. The link between those and deleting all the residential units, however, eludes me.

If the residential component disappears from the top of the headhouse, that should allow the dropoffs for the hotel to be moved to Jackson Street, which, I'd imagine, would make them happy.

Rendering of the planned hotel dropoff along Adams
https://i.imgur.com/97KgGsel.jpg

Rendering of the planned entrance for residential along Jackson
https://i.imgur.com/LpEyxgGl.jpg
imgsrc - NBC5.com

It's almost laughable that those residents are so concerned about Adams, when their building greets Adams with a huge blank wall.

In addition to ditching the residential structure, if they also forgot about using floors 2 & 3 of the existing headhouse for offices and instead converted them into hotel space, as they are planning to do to floors 4-8, then it's possible that nothing new gets built on top, no? Is the existing unused space large enough for 400 rooms?

Originally, plans called for two 750,000 sqft. office buildings for Phase 2, where the Amtrak garage now stands. Might they instead build a single 1.6 million sqft office building at Clinton and Van Buren (the two 750,000 sqft buildings plus the 100,000 sqft of office planned for the headhouse combined), and a 1 million sqft residential or residential/hotel tower along Canal and Jackson, on top of the Transit Center? That would still leave 500,000 sqft available for Phase 3 (over the south train shed) as planned.

Also, there is discussion that the Legacy Club, the $20/day lounge in what used to be the Gold Lion dining room, will be closing within the next twelve months and be converted into restaurant/retail.

nomarandlee Aug 31, 2018 9:16 PM

A bit of a shame if there will be no addition but better that than a horrendous addition that was on offer a few months ago.

Shame they don't use the two tower addition mock-up by Goettsch Partners. I like the massing of their proposal I just felt it could use a different curtain wall.

chicubs111 Aug 31, 2018 9:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedCorsair87 (Post 8300162)
I heard from a source close to this project that the addition will be scrapped and the hotel will be moved to the new tower.

Interesting...perhaps this means we could get a fairly sizable mixed use tower ..wasn't there originally a large tower (kinda looked like a cheese grater) we were all excited about around this location but then plans changed for two 750k towers?... from reading crains today they mentioned one tower at 1.5 mil sq ft of office space and then the hotel component added (assuming there is no tower place on top of union station as the rumor states) we could be looking at something near 1000ft again?... Correct me if I'm mixing up my parcels near union station ..hard to keep track of all this development

bnk Aug 31, 2018 10:00 PM

https://chicago.curbed.com/2018/8/31...ent-new-design


Developers have ‘completely revised’ controversial Union Station addition

...


Architectural historians—and unamused Twitter users—can exhale a collective sigh of relief knowing that Union Station’s developers have “completely revised” their plans to build a controversial seven-story, hat-like addition atop the landmarked Beaux Arts building.

The team of Riverside Investment & Development, Convexity Properties, and architecture firm Solomon Cordwell Buenz will reintroduce plans to redevelop the historic station at a community meeting set for 6 p.m. Tuesday, September 11 in Union Station’s Burlington Room...


After the first community meeting on June 25, the original proposal was deemed unacceptable by the community …


The updated redevelopment plan is expected to ditch the earlier scheme’s 404 apartments while boosting the number of hotel rooms from 330 to 400.

Given the shape of the existing building and its enormous central skylight, any expansion of Union Station is limited when it comes to potential layouts. It’s likely that the revised proposal will still take the doughnut shape of the June plan or perhaps something akin to two-tower configuration shown in spring 2017.

Meanwhile, the same developers are working to eventually replace an Amtrak-owned parking garage south of the station with a new 1.5 million-square-foot office tower. That plan, which has yet to be shown to the public

RedCorsair87 Aug 31, 2018 10:33 PM

Also heard we are looking at a tower similar in height to 150 Riverside and the height could increase or decrease depending how the 9.11 meeting goes...

chicubs111 Sep 1, 2018 11:06 PM

New renderings for Union Station office tower acquired

Word is hizzoner worked quietly behind the scenes with Ald. Brendan Reilly (42nd) and Riverside Investment & Development to preserve Union Station and build a new office tower and plaza across the street from the historic train station.

Sneed has also learned an anchor tenant has been already lined up for the building, which will bring several thousand jobs to the city, according to mayoral spokesman Adam Collins.

The new rendering plans will debut at a public community meeting soon before heading to the City Council for approval.

https://chicago.suntimes.com/news/ne...ower-acquired/

https://suntimesmedia.files.wordpres...0218.jpg?w=763


https://suntimesmedia.files.wordpres...pg?w=463&h=300

MorganChi Sep 1, 2018 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicubs111 (Post 8301183)
New renderings for Union Station office tower acquired

Word is hizzoner worked quietly behind the scenes with Ald. Brendan Reilly (42nd) and Riverside Investment & Development to preserve Union Station and build a new office tower and plaza across the street from the historic train station.

Sneed has also learned an anchor tenant has been already lined up for the building, which will bring several thousand jobs to the city, according to mayoral spokesman Adam Collins.

The new rendering plans will debut at a public community meeting soon before heading to the City Council for approval.

https://chicago.suntimes.com/news/ne...ower-acquired/

https://suntimesmedia.files.wordpres...0218.jpg?w=763


https://suntimesmedia.files.wordpres...pg?w=463&h=300


Anyone knows what the height on this ? This looks exactly like 110 wacker

RedCorsair87 Sep 2, 2018 12:57 AM

^Less than 150 N Riverside, but not by much.


It looks like they are still working on the design. I wonder who the tenant is. I would be very surprised if it was Salesforce, but the description certainly sounds like it.

The green space also aligns with one of SF's requests.

MorganChi Sep 2, 2018 1:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedCorsair87 (Post 8301255)
^Less than 150 N Riverside, but not by much.


It looks like they are still working on the design. I wonder who the tenant is. I would be very surprised if it was Salesforce, but the description certainly sounds like it.

Lol I was gonna say that . I think the ppl at West Point and sales force couldn’t strike a deal

chicubs111 Sep 2, 2018 1:57 AM

^ and why would you think its sales force again?...it was just a few weeks ago that reports have been they have confirmed to be looking into wolf point south but there was still some things to be worked out with signage and such..i doubt this quickly they change there minds to go to this tower?.

MorganChi Sep 2, 2018 2:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chicubs111 (Post 8301281)
^ and why would you think its sales force again?...it was just a few weeks ago that reports have been they have confirmed to be looking into wolf point south but there was still some things to be worked out with signage and such..i doubt this quickly they change there minds to go to this tower?.

It’s a major company , and from what I understood in this article I think I will take up majority of occupancy


All times are GMT. The time now is 12:57 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.