Originally Posted by Abner (Post 4173330)

I have seen people randomly attacked on the Green Line and the Blue Line. I know many people who have been robbed on train platforms and on trains, sometimes right after school when the train is full of kids. I've never seen that on a bus and I've never heard of it except on lightly used lines in the most dangerous neighborhoods at night--and I've taken such "seedy" buses as the 54, the 9, and the 55 regularly. I've also never been a captive audience to an aggressive speech-giving panhandler, a soapbox preacher, or a three-card hustler on a bus. I'm not saying that people should be afraid to take the train--I still prefer the train--I'm just saying that in bad situations, you can't have the level of safety on the train that you can have on a bus by simply sitting or standing near the driver. (As for murder, that's a rare enough thing on any mode of transit that I don't generally take it into account.)

Originally Posted by Rilestone75 (Post 4173494)

Abner, you must not take the train much then... I take the red or brown line every day, and can honestly say that at least once, perhaps twice a week there is an incident with someone on the train. This has also escalated over the past year, and I can only point to the state of the economy as a reason why.

Originally Posted by Rilestone75 (Post 4173494)

Abner, you must not take the train much then... I take the red or brown line every day, and can honestly say that at least once, perhaps twice a week there is an incident with someone on the train. This has also escalated over the past year, and I can only point to the state of the economy as a reason why.

Originally Posted by Taft (Post 4173890)

C'mon, this is just crazy. Either you are getting REALLY unlucky or I am getting REALLY lucky, because I've lived in Chicago 9 years and can count on one hand (maybe two, tops) the number of "incidents" I've seen on the trains or buses. I ride the trains almost every day.

Something in your account doesn't add up (no, people who give you the heebie-jeebies on the train don't count as "incidents")...

Originally Posted by orulz (Post 4173387)

Thinking about how to save money.

There are a couple components of the WLTC that probably can't be moved. A west loop subway probably does have to happen under Clinton. One station on this line would probably be located at Monroe. This station would connect directly to the Monroe transitway, and via a concourse to Union Station and Ogilvie. So that's 2 levels: tracks/platforms, plus the concourse/mezzanine.

As for the other two levels:
The "Clinton Transitway" (aka busway) - does that really have to be below ground? Who knows.

For HSR, though, there are numerous complicating factors that make it difficult to run HSR trains to the WLTC under Clinton. First, the HSR trains are envisioned on the bottom level, which would make the approaches extremely long and expensive. Also, how do you power the trains when they're in this tunnel? Dual mode trains? Do you build an expensive but probably still imperfect ventilation system? A 4-level escalator to reach the HSR platforms seems extreme, too. And how many HSR tracks/platforms can fit under Clinton anyway? The renderings I've seen show apparently just 2 tracks and 1 island platform. Dedicated HSR platforms and lead tracks increase speed and efficiency, but is it worth all that expense?

The easier and less expensive (but also less flexible) solution would be to rebuild union station to have more through tracks. Through-routing commuter trains would free up some slots, making Metra more convenient to boot. This does come with its own set of issues though, not the least of which is that there are only 3 tracks on approach to Union Station from the north and that could severely restrict capacity. In addition, this would cause the added expense of condemning and demolishing 222 S Riverside.

So, to summarize: which one will cost less: a 3-4 level WLTC with expensive approaches for HSR, or a 2-3 level WLTC PLUS the union station reconfiguration. And, how do you deal with the complications of each?

Originally Posted by Rilestone75 (Post 4173494)

Abner, you must not take the train much then... I take the red or brown line every day, and can honestly say that at least once, perhaps twice a week there is an incident with someone on the train. This has also escalated over the past year, and I can only point to the state of the economy as a reason why.

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown (Post 4170692)

Probably the best way to use a Larrabee-Clinton subway is to run Red Line trains that way, with Brown-Orange throughrouted via the State Street Subway.

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown (Post 4174155)

I believe a total of four through tracks could be squeezed in on the east end of Union Station without altering any foundations. The original caissons were placed to make another runthrough track possible, and this alteration was contemplated during WWII. Earlier discussion of subject.

Originally Posted by denizen467 (Post 4174997)

Has it been determined exactly how the tubes would get from Larrabee to Clinton? Underneath the existing surface rail r-o-w? Underneath the river (hmmm, a risky idea maybe; see 1992)? In particular, on which side of the Kinzie Station tower?

Originally Posted by denizen467 (Post 4174997)

Has it been determined exactly how the tubes would get from Larrabee to Clinton?

Originally Posted by the urban politician (Post 4175285)

The Circle Line

+



=

:tup: :yes:

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown (Post 4175402)

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown (Post 4175402)

http://i40.tinypic.com/2aeowed.jpg

Seems odd that there's no transfer to Blue or Green at Milwaukee/Lake

Originally Posted by Taft (Post 4175601)

The paulina stop on the brown line is reopening:

http://www.chicagobreakingnews.com/2...rown-line.html