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-   -   Phoenix Development News (3) (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=173764)

Vicelord John Dec 9, 2010 9:08 PM

FWIW, Verde didn't recycle on any of my visits. They had recycle bins but half of what they were serving on couldn't be thrown in one of the bins.

PHX31 Dec 9, 2010 9:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicelord John (Post 5087141)
FWIW, Verde didn't recycle on any of my visits. They had recycle bins but half of what they were serving on couldn't be thrown in one of the bins.

I think plates/napkins/etc they used were the recycled kind.

Don B. Dec 10, 2010 12:28 AM

Could one argue that the owners of Verde were poorly capitalized? I seem to recall reading that a small business owner needs to be able to survive for two years without pulling a dollar out of the business to live on. In other words, you need two years of reserves to make it work. I also recall reading that the majority of small businesses fail within a certain period of time, perhaps 18 months. Then again, I'm no business expert. :)

I liked Verde. Shame it didn't last.

--don

Vicelord John Dec 10, 2010 4:22 AM

A majority of restaurants fail within 24 months. If you can make it that long you should be good. Seems to go with the capital survival figure.

Schadenfreude Dec 10, 2010 2:46 PM

Pretty much have most of central station tore down.

http://i937.photobucket.com/albums/a...9/f566628e.jpg

HooverDam Dec 10, 2010 5:05 PM

^Ug, what a waste of time and money. We need a real transit station there, something at least the quality of what Tempe has, that should be the starting point. Instead we're getting some new trees and a purely cosmetic update- lame.

Vicelord John Dec 10, 2010 5:07 PM

They should build it underground with shopping on top like denver.

HX_Guy Dec 10, 2010 7:14 PM

This is just...sad. Over on the City-Data forums, there is a discussion on downtown Phoenix and someone who works at a downtown hotel posted...

Quote:

"i work at a hotel in downtown phx and the only time I send guests to CityScape is for CVS. I send them to Arizona Center if they ask me where they can do some shopping. obviously if someone is looking for something to eat i will send them any number of places depending on what they are hungry for.

The saddest thing about downtown is that there is absolutely no one out-and-about at night during the week. guests of the hotel are confused by this and always ask me if this is normal.

even on the weekends if guests are looking for something to do they have to take a $35 cab ride to scottsdale or mill ave. most of the time they are just looking to have a drink, but they want to have that drink in a place where they can "people watch" and interact with other humans. downtown phx is just not that kind of place.

doesn't help that the pro sports teams aren't winning."
My reply back was...

Quote:

Well that sucks, honestly.

If you work downtown, why would you send people to Scottsdale and Tempe, especially on the weekend? Are you yourself familiar with what there is to offer in downtown? My friends and I drive from NW Phoenix to downtown almost every weekend...if we drive all the way there from here, I'm sure someone already staying down there can certainly find things to do. Have you referred anyone to Hanny's? Or Lucky Strike? Even if they do go to Mill Ave from downtown...why would you recommend a $35 taxi when they could take a $3.50 (roundtrip) train ride?

It can't help the situation if hotels in downtown are sending people out of downtown. I would hope visitors are at least told about Cityscape as well in addition to Arizona Center for example, especially now that Cityscape has five clothing retailers open and a couple restaurants and it certainly has a lot more of an urban feel than Arizona Center.

gymratmanaz Dec 10, 2010 8:22 PM

That is pathetic. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot. Drive people away, and kiss your job goodbye. Simple basic economics, IDIOT!!!!!! (To the dumb hotel person not you HX)

Vicelord John Dec 10, 2010 10:28 PM

That person is doing a disservice to his city, and has no civic pride whatsoever.

On that note, I have to sort of stand up for that person at least a little bit. As a customer service employee, you have to find a good balance and you can't just sit back and do whatever will make your city better or what will make your peers happy... you have to focus on the guest's wants and needs.

If somoene asks me for a great upscale restaurant, I really don't feel comfortable recommending anything downtown. Compass room is fairly upscale, but isn't anything remotely interesting. That said, Tempe isn't the answer either.

So basically before I jump down his throat I would ask the gentleman what the guests were looking for that he sent to Scottsdale. If they were looking for a vibrant night life scene with many selections that were walkable, then he is right. As much as I love downtown Phoenix, that aspect just isn't there yet. There are no night clubs, there isn't a centrally walkable strip of bars unless you are a colored person, and there is very little selection of upscale restaurants in the vein of Lon's, T.Cook's, Vincent, etc.

Now, if somoene asked me where a good place to shop is, I'd have them take a taxi to Biltmore Fashion Park, as I still don't consider 5 or 6 stores to be a shopping area. People staying in downtown hotels are for the most part convention attendees with a little free time to shop or spouses with nothing to do while their SO is at a convention. Sure, they can go to Cityscape and poke in a few stores, or go to AZ Center and poke in a few more, but there isn't a whole lot at either place.

When someone just wants a place to pick up a few things, I'll send them to CVS. When they want a bar to get a drink and hang out for a bit, I'll send them Seamus, Roosevelt, Lucky Strike, etc. When someone wants basic shopping, I'll send them to Cityscape or AZ Center.

The number one concern is to take care of the guest. If the guest gives you the oppurtunity to recommend something that will help your neighborhood, then yay! Unfortunately that isn't always possible and if the guest wants something your neighborhood doesn't offer, then you're doing the guest a disservice by not recommending what is the best option for them.

As for inferring that they are shooting themselves in the foot and putting their job at risk, I'd argue that isn't true. As stated before, downtown is convention business, and the draw is the convention center. Not being a nightlife mecca or a shopping district isn't going to weigh on where their company puts everyone up for future conventions. It may affect their future, if any, leisure stays, but I wouldn't recommend downtown as a vacation hub at this point yet either.

I'd also like to add that most stays are on expense accounts. When someone goes out, the likely don't have the time or patience to take a train or bus. Also, since they aren't paying for the hotel room, airfare, or most of their meals, they typically don't mind the $35 cab fare. Now, with people who are footing their own bills, they will be more likely to stay downtown or Tempe because they can ride the train and save a few bucks. These are the people you'll be keeping downtown, but the guy didn't specify much and was probably talking about people who are mainly on expense accounts.

dtnphx Dec 10, 2010 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HX_Guy (Post 5088322)
This is just...sad. Over on the City-Data forums, there is a discussion on downtown Phoenix and someone who works at a downtown hotel posted...



My reply back was...

First off, Kudos for calling this schmuck out. Obviously he either: comes from another city that he thinks is way awesomer or he hates his job, or is a total sack of goo for not knowing what the hell he is surrounded by. There are dozens of cool restaurants to go to downtown. Cityscape, with all it's fault, is not fully open yet. Even if you have to send someone out of the area, send them closer: Durants, Cibo, Coronado Cafe, Barrio Cafe. Hello, moron?

Vicelord John Dec 11, 2010 12:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dtnphx (Post 5088624)
First off, Kudos for calling this schmuck out. Obviously he either: comes from another city that he thinks is way awesomer or he hates his job, or is a total sack of goo for not knowing what the hell he is surrounded by. There are dozens of cool restaurants to go to downtown. Cityscape, with all it's fault, is not fully open yet. Even if you have to send someone out of the area, send them closer: Durants, Cibo, Coronado Cafe, Barrio Cafe. Hello, moron?

Read Vicelord's rational thoughts above.

exit2lef Dec 11, 2010 4:31 AM

Having wasted time on CD Forum at times, I know it's full of trolls. The person claiming to be a Downtown hotel worker might be a fake, but even if real, might be playing up the story for effect.

Nevertheless, the Vicelord makes some good points. A good concierge at a Downtown hotel would always highlight the best of Downtown, but also be willing to refer elsewhere if a customer is asking for something that just can't be found there.

This story reminds me of an article I read a few years ago about Downtown PHX. I can't remember if it was in the Republic or maybe in the national media. Either way, one of the ambassadors employed by the Downtown Phoenix Partnership was interviewed and claimed he always sent people to Scottsdale or Tempe. I think he was fired promptly after the article came out.

Gump Dec 15, 2010 6:18 PM

Thought this blog on Summit was interesting....

http://www.weknowurban.com/blog/2010...copper-square/

HooverDam Dec 20, 2010 8:54 PM

This is good news...

Quote:

Pop the Soda Shop Moves to Downtown Phoenix
[Source: Michele Laudig, New Times Chow Bella]

Pop the Soda Shop was always the place where you could find those rare, nostalgic beverages that seem to pre-date beverage behemoths like Pepsi and Coke. Birch beer, sarsaparilla, Moxie, and countless kinds of cola filled the shelves of the longstanding store in South Scottsdale.

Now that location has finally closed up shop, and the operation is based out of The Duce in Downtown Phoenix (525. S. Central Ave.).

There, you can hang out at the circa 1915 soda fountain and order up handmade sodas, ice cream floats, milk shakes and other treats, as well as purchase bottled pop and candy.

Sweet!

Hours are 10 a.m. to midnight, Wednesday through Saturday, and 9 a.m. to 4 p.m., Sunday.
I loved this place when it was in Scottsdale, but this is a much cooler location. I hope it grows in popularity and is there for a long time to come.

Vicelord John Dec 21, 2010 12:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HooverDam (Post 5099849)
This is good news...



I loved this place when it was in Scottsdale, but this is a much cooler location. I hope it grows in popularity and is there for a long time to come.

I emailed the owner. Said almost all sodas will be special order by the case. If that so then ill just consider it a loss of a soda shop.

exit2lef Dec 21, 2010 2:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicelord John (Post 5100074)
I emailed the owner. Said almost all sodas will be special order by the case. If that so then ill just consider it a loss of a soda shop.

That's what I expected. I just didn't see any way to replicate the full inventory of Pop inside the Duce. This "move" seems more like a downsizing, but I guess it's better than having no Pop at all.

Vicelord John Dec 21, 2010 10:29 PM

Anyone have an update on the alcoholism enablement subsidized housing on central?

dtnphx Dec 21, 2010 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicelord John (Post 5101179)
Anyone have an update on the alcoholism enablement subsidized housing on central?

Yes, it's been converted into a detox facility focusing on treating delusional Phoenix area hotel employees who project racist diatribes against minorities with drinking problems while pretending one's own drinking problem is somewhat cool and edgy. Should be a success. :tup:

Vicelord John Dec 21, 2010 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dtnphx (Post 5101235)
Yes, it's been converted into a detox facility focusing on treating delusional Phoenix area hotel employees who project racist diatribes against minorities with drinking problems while pretending one's own drinking problem is somewhat cool and edgy. Should be a success. :tup:

My only drinking problem is I don't drink enough...:slob:


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