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-   -   CHICAGO: Transit Developments (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=101657)

Chicago3rd Dec 17, 2008 6:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taft (Post 3979174)
I wouldn't blame the CTA for this. I happened to drive to work yesterday (damn bad luck for an appointment in the suburbs!) and it took me an hour and 45 minutes to get to Lakeview from the loop.

How did 5 buse that means 60 minutes of buses all get bunched together? This is only 1.5 miles from the eastern terminus. If I saw it on bus tracker why weren't buses turned around at the halfway point to start picking up passengers running east? So after someone answers the first question....let me know.

Snow makes things slow down....not bunch up. Driving is like a conveyor belt...it can go slow or fast. Not bunch up for 90 minutes worth of lost service.

The converyor belt slows down to 2-3 miles an hour.....there should not have been a total work stoppage for 60 minutes.

Abner Dec 17, 2008 7:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicago3rd (Post 3979340)
How did 5 buse that means 60 minutes of buses all get bunched together? This is only 1.5 miles from the eastern terminus. If I saw it on bus tracker why weren't buses turned around at the halfway point to start picking up passengers running east? So after someone answers the first question....let me know.

Snow makes things slow down....not bunch up. Driving is like a conveyor belt...it can go slow or fast. Not bunch up for 90 minutes worth of lost service.

The converyor belt slows down to 2-3 miles an hour.....there should not have been a total work stoppage for 60 minutes.

Here is a layman's guess. People were arriving at bus stops at the same rate as usual, but the buses were going much slower. That means that as the first bus arrived at each stop, there were many more people than usual. So each stop took longer, which made the trip even slower. Since the first bus made such long stops, the second bus eventually caught up with it, and the rest would have caught up after that. Once the buses get bunched together there's not really a way to un-bunch them.

The bus tracker would have been wrong yesterday because its estimated arrival times are based on typical traffic and would not have taken the complete gridlock caused by the snow into account. It's not realistic to expect a bus tracker to account for chaotic conditions like that in real time.

Chicago3rd Dec 17, 2008 7:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abner (Post 3979480)
Here is a layman's guess. People were arriving at bus stops at the same rate as usual, but the buses were going much slower. That means that as the first bus arrived at each stop, there were many more people than usual. So each stop took longer, which made the trip even slower. Since the first bus made such long stops, the second bus eventually caught up with it, and the rest would have caught up after that. Once the buses get bunched together there's not really a way to un-bunch them.

The bus tracker would have been wrong yesterday because its estimated arrival times are based on typical traffic and would not have taken the complete gridlock caused by the snow into account. It's not realistic to expect a bus tracker to account for chaotic conditions like that in real time.

Actually, the first part of your answer sounds very logical. So thanks.

The bus tracker is pretty much live...that is why it showed all the buses bunched up together. It estimates bus stop arrivals...but it still reflects where buses actually are via satellite.

VivaLFuego Dec 17, 2008 8:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicago3rd (Post 3979113)
How do 5 west bound bus #81 get bunched up together?

Abner's response is very good, but only part of the story. Particularly with the #81 for example, the route begins from the west end headed eastbound: every bus leaving Marine Drive headed west is turning around from an eastbound trip.

Now apply the The Abner Effect headed eastbound the whole length of the route: it's possible all 5 buses arrived at the eastern Marine Drive terminal far behind schedule, and thus all turned right around and left headed westbound

In cases like yesterday, the schedule becomes meaningless - and generally speaking, the quality of the schedule is the main determining factor with the transit agency's control in whether buses get bunched. Buses arrive at the end of the line so late that they have no hope of starting back in the other direction on time. Writing a "snow" schedule, with extra long route running times that would actually be possible to follow on days like yesterday, is out of the question for two reasons: (1) against union work rules based on how bus drivers are assigned to operate certain bus runs, and (2) CTA wouldn't have enough vehicles to meet the scheduled frequency of service.

#2 is important: even if CTA somehow created and performed a perfect blizzard schedule that buses could actually follow, they could only do this if the interval between buses was incredibly long. So either way, short of CTA having hundreds of buses waiting in the wings to operate on snow days, it is more likely than not that a rider will wait much longer for a bus. Maybe CTA could unbunch the buses, but then the buses would be running every 40 minutes instead of every 8 minutes. Pick your poison.

I just took two trains yesterday.

Chicago3rd Dec 17, 2008 9:18 PM

^^^
Before the storm I have noticed that bunching is still occuring. The tracker should help manage this. That was what CTA said it would do...get the managers out and turn some of the buses around...keep the conveyor belts going.

I don't think there should be schedules on buses period...just intravals of time...with or without snow.

So are what you telling me is that at the halfway point CTA couldn't have turned a few of the buses around so that east bound wouldn't be effected too?

emathias Dec 18, 2008 5:29 AM

I noticed tonight that in addition to fare increases, the CTA is bumping up the parking fees for the park-n-ride lots. An idea I fully support, since $2/day was absurdly low. It appears $4/day is the new minimum.

CTA New Parking Fees

jpIllInoIs Dec 18, 2008 2:48 PM

Obama reportedly picking LaHood for transportation chief
 
This would be good for Illinois and the many Amtrak, Metra and CTA projects on the back burner. And also for CREATE. The Transportation Secretary is one of the most powerful domestic policy positions in the government.


http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...,4429068.story
By Mike Dorning | Washington Bureau
December 18, 2008
WASHINGTON — Peoria Republican Rep. Ray LaHood has been chosen as Barack Obama's transportation secretary, placing him in a key role in an administration that has signaled plans for an ambitious public works program, according to Democratic and Republican officials.

LaHood, 63, who planned to step down from Congress at the end of the current session, is a Capitol veteran, a former chief of staff to then-House Minority Leader Robert Michel (R-Ill.) who was elected to his former boss' seat in 1994.

Among those with whom LaHood maintained a friendly relationship over the years is Emanuel, whose aggressive approach to politics infuriated many Republicans; LaHood, however, praised him publicly for competence and pragmatism. LaHood and Emanuel co-hosted a series of bipartisan dinners for members of Congress and worked together on legislation to expand funding for children's health insurance.

Unlike many Republicans in Congress, LaHood has a record of supporting funding for Amtrak and public transit.
Tribune reporter Jon Hilkevitch contributed from Chicago.

mdorning@tribune.com

the urban politician Dec 18, 2008 3:22 PM

^ Glad that you posted that. I was a little concerned to see that a Republican was appointed, but reading this relieves a lot of that.

nomarandlee Dec 18, 2008 8:00 PM

Quote:

http://www.suburbanchicagonews.com/c...TRA_S1.article

Metra reports ridership increasing
It's good news for mass transit, but may be fleeting


December 18, 2008

By DAVID GIALANELLA dgialanella@scn1.com
........Metra is furnishing more rides to area residents than ever before, according to agency statistics. Systemwide ridership is up 4.8 percent for January 2008 through October 2008 compared with the same time period last year,

On Metra's Milwaukee District West Line, which includes Elgin's three station stops, the increase was even more dramatic: there was a 6.5 percent ridership spike for the same 10-month time span.

"Most of what we've seen is because gas prices went so very high," said Meg Thomas-Reile, a Metra spokeswoman. "It was easy to correlate that."...........
..

the urban politician Dec 19, 2008 3:25 PM

More pain parking downtown?
TRANSPORTATION | 'Congestion reduction' fee considered as part of effort to get people to change their driving habits

December 19, 2008
BY FRAN SPIELMAN City Hall Reporter
Motorists who insist on parking in downtown Chicago -- either on the street or in commercial lots or garages -- would pay a "congestion reduction" fee for the privilege, under a mayoral plan in the works to ease traffic jams and generate transportation funding.

Truckers who make downtown deliveries during peak periods would also pay a fee for every minute they block traffic, under the ordinance quietly introduced by Mayor Daley at Wednesday's City Council meeting.

CTA President Ron Huberman said the fees would go into a so-called "congestion reduction fund" to finance an array of improvements, including more trains and buses serving the Loop, turn lanes and synchronized traffic signals.

The mayor's ordinance makes no mention of specific congestion fees. It merely gives the city's revenue director unbridled power to set the rates and adjust them without City Council approval. A study under way by the Civic Consulting Alliance will determine the size of the increase.

"The price can be moved regularly until we find that sweet spot where it alters behavior. We're trying to have the minimum amount we need to charge in order to encourage people to drive a little earlier or a little later and use mass transit," Huberman said.

The timing of the increases could not be worse.

Daley's $1.15 billion plan to privatize Chicago parking meters already includes steep rate hikes that will force downtown motorists who now pay $3 an hour to cough up $3.50 Jan. 1, pay a whopping $6.50 an hour by 2013 and feed the meters 24/7, including holidays.

(Click link above to read whole article)

the urban politician Dec 19, 2008 3:26 PM

^ In regards to the article I just posted above:

This probably isn't the best timing for this, but I'm pleased to see a congestion pricing plan that does what it's supposed to to--fund TRANSIT.

Glad Daley's finally on board with this :tup:

ChicagoChicago Dec 19, 2008 4:50 PM

^^^
I'll hold my breath that it actually goes toward transit.

Nowhereman1280 Dec 19, 2008 7:27 PM

So what do you guys think of Ray Lahood as Trasportation Secretary? I've heard varying reports as to his credentials as a proponent of Mass Transit...


I'm watching his acceptance speech right now and he is really emphasizing Mass Transit and Amtrak expansions...

ardecila Dec 19, 2008 8:44 PM

^^ Well, he is from Illinois. He's a Congressman, not a Senator, and his district is downstate, so lobbying for Chicagoland transit funding was not one of his priorities (it has nothing to do with his district). That doesn't mean he won't support transit and Amtrak, though. Obama's agenda favors transit and urban areas, and his selection of LaHood is meant to reflect this. Obama will be LaHood's boss, after all.

Also, I want to stress that the transportation problems and lack of expansion in Chicagoland is NOT a problem on the federal level, but merely a side effect of the lamentable state and local governments and the corruption that infiltrates them. ALL of CTA's planned projects have been tentatively green-lighted at the Federal level, but it is political gridlock here that is holding them up.

Unless rationality prevails down in Springfield and at City Hall, we won't see too much progress on the transit front here in Chicago. Look at Milwaukee. Their only hope of getting rail transit (the KRM commuter rail plan) was shot down by political resistance on the local level, even after the Federal government agreed to pay 80% of the cost. That's even more tragic than Chicago's situation, because of all the detailed planning that went into the KRM plan.

lawfin Dec 19, 2008 8:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardecila (Post 3983927)
^^ Well, he is from Illinois. He's a Congressman, not a Senator, and his district is downstate, so lobbying for Chicagoland transit funding was not one of his priorities (it has nothing to do with his district). That doesn't mean he won't support transit and Amtrak, though. Obama's agenda favors transit and urban areas, and his selection of LaHood is meant to reflect this. Obama will be LaHood's boss, after all.

Also, I want to stress that the transportation problems and lack of expansion in Chicagoland is NOT a problem on the federal level, but merely a side effect of the lamentable state and local governments and the corruption that infiltrates them. ALL of CTA's planned projects have been tentatively green-lighted at the Federal level, but it is political gridlock here that is holding them up.

Unless rationality prevails down in Springfield and at City Hall, we won't see too much progress on the transit front here in Chicago. Look at Milwaukee. Their only hope of getting rail transit (the KRM commuter rail plan) was shot down by political resistance on the local level, even after the Federal government agreed to pay 80% of the cost. That's even more tragic than Chicago's situation, because of all the detailed planning that went into the KRM plan.

I never heard that about Milw...that is too bad

jpIllInoIs Dec 19, 2008 10:11 PM

^^ Yeah Chicago is in a good spot with the CREATE program and Metra/CTA "New Starts" having identified some needs.But these projects always need a guardian angel, someone to carry the water and do the heavy lifting and all those other euphamisms. Usually that someone is a Senator or Govenor or Congressman. Unfortunately we are short a couple. Illinois/Chi could be in the position of having a homegrown Prez and Trans Secy, but not be able to pull off a major Fed investment because of the schizo Gov. and a vacant US Senator seat.

Abner Dec 19, 2008 11:09 PM

This runs the risk of being off-topic, but does anybody happen to know how much of CREATE is "shovel-ready" and could theoretically be part of the first round of the stimulus package? It seems like a pretty small investment on the government's part for a substantial benefit. Obviously this is completely speculative since none of us knows what the priorities and procedures are going to be for stimulus spending.

schwerve Dec 19, 2008 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abner (Post 3984238)
This runs the risk of being off-topic, but does anybody happen to know how much of CREATE is "shovel-ready" and could theoretically be part of the first round of the stimulus package? It seems like a pretty small investment on the government's part for a substantial benefit. Obviously this is completely speculative since none of us knows what the priorities and procedures are going to be for stimulus spending.

http://www.createprogram.org/PDF/Pro...s_10-07-08.pdf

that's the current status of create programs.

the urban politician Dec 20, 2008 1:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpIllInoIs (Post 3984110)
Illinois/Chi could be in the position of having a homegrown Prez and Trans Secy, but not be able to pull off a major Fed investment because of the schizo Gov. and a vacant US Senator seat.

^ Well, Obama's presidency is 4 or 8 years, while Bagofshit's reign of terror ends in 2 (or sooner, depending on how this corruption case goes) years, so lets not lose hope

the urban politician Dec 20, 2008 1:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardecila (Post 3983927)
Also, I want to stress that the transportation problems and lack of expansion in Chicagoland is NOT a problem on the federal level, but merely a side effect of the lamentable state and local governments and the corruption that infiltrates them. ALL of CTA's planned projects have been tentatively green-lighted at the Federal level, but it is political gridlock here that is holding them up.

^ What "local political gridlock" is holding up the Red Line extension, Orange Line extension, or Circle Line?


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