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-   -   CHICAGO: Transit Developments (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=101657)

Vlajos Dec 6, 2017 6:12 PM

Is CTA definitely raising rates? If so, how much? What will the monthly pass cost?

emathias Dec 6, 2017 6:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vlajos (Post 8010392)
Is CTA definitely raising rates? If so, how much? What will the monthly pass cost?

Definitely doing it - the RTA is forcing them to. I've heard they're raising the base fares by a quarter, which seems fair given how long it's been since the last increase. I would guess that means that monthly passes will rise to either $110 or $115. It's possible monthly passes won't increase, though not likely.

Vlajos Dec 6, 2017 7:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by emathias (Post 8010461)
Definitely doing it - the RTA is forcing them to. I've heard they're raising the base fares by a quarter, which seems fair given how long it's been since the last increase. I would guess that means that monthly passes will rise to either $110 or $115. It's possible monthly passes won't increase, though not likely.

Thanks, I agree, it's completely reasonable. Just curious what the increase will be.

Jim in Chicago Dec 7, 2017 6:41 PM

All this talk about the ORD express train makes me want to ask about the current condition of the Blue Line track (redux). Every time I ride it to the airport, which is more often than I'd like, it seems to be getting worse, even on the stretches that were recently redone. You just get flung from side to side repeatedly, particularly bad as you leave ORD, but on other stretches as well. Do the tracks really take that much of a beating from the trains or is this a case of shoddy work or planned obsolesence?

Mr Downtown Dec 8, 2017 2:15 AM

New CTA fares:

https://i.imgur.com/F60IG1n.png?1

Monthly pass goes to $105.

tjp Dec 8, 2017 3:14 AM

Totally reasonable. I thought train fare was $2.50 already :haha:

Randomguy34 Dec 8, 2017 12:10 PM

David Reifman was interviewed about a month ago by Walter Burnett about development in the city, and Reifman mention that the "Division" Brown Line stop won't get rebuilt until after the Belmont Bypass project gets built. His justification was that the Brown Line is already at max capacity, and adding an additional stop which will add thousands of riders to the Brown and Purple Lines will be too much for the system until frequency can be improved by the bypass project. Unfortunately, it looks like construction for the bypass won't begin until 2019, and construction is expected to take 4-5 years.

Vlajos Dec 8, 2017 2:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tjp (Post 8012235)
Totally reasonable. I thought train fare was $2.50 already :haha:

Agreed, that's not even keeping up with inflation.

emathias Dec 8, 2017 4:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Randomguy34 (Post 8012480)
David Reifman was interviewed about a month ago by Walter Burnett about development in the city, and Reifman mention that the "Division" Brown Line stop won't get rebuilt until after the Belmont Bypass project gets built. His justification was that the Brown Line is already at max capacity, and adding an additional stop which will add thousands of riders to the Brown and Purple Lines will be too much for the system until frequency can be improved by the bypass project. Unfortunately, it looks like construction for the bypass won't begin until 2019, and construction is expected to take 4-5 years.

I wish the CTA could us some modern techniques to speed up their timelines on critical infrastructure work - could even save them money, possibly. I know it's relatively complicated to construct the bypass while running two of the busiest lines in the system through the site, but still seems like it shouldn't take 4-5 years to do it if they could.

ardecila Dec 8, 2017 7:59 PM

Will the few extra Brown Line trains from the Belmont Flyover project really add that much capacity? We just increased the capacity by 33% less than ten years ago with the increase to 8-car trains, and apparently it was filled up almost immediately. More importantly, if the Brown Line adds more trains, are there slots for them to enter the Loop? Already we have significant rush hour delays at Tower 18, I'm not sure more trains can be squeezed through.

If the Brown Line really is that maxed out that a station can't be added in a key area, maybe CTA should look at providing alternatives to the Brown Line like bringing back the #11 Lincoln bus, or switching the railcars back to longitudinal seating to pack more riders in.

PKDickman Dec 8, 2017 8:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardecila (Post 8012980)
Will the few extra Brown Line trains from the Belmont Flyover project really add that much capacity? We just increased the capacity by 33% less than ten years ago with the increase to 8-car trains, and apparently it was filled up almost immediately. More importantly, if the Brown Line adds more trains, are there slots for them to enter the Loop? Already we have significant rush hour delays at Tower 18, I'm not sure more trains can be squeezed through.

If the Brown Line really is that maxed out that a station can't be added in a key area, maybe CTA should look at providing alternatives to the Brown Line like bringing back the #11 Lincoln bus, or switching the railcars back to longitudinal seating to pack more riders in.

It's not about adding brown line capacity. It is about getting rid of bottlenecks that ultimately limit capacity.
Right now, this bottle neck affects three lines so even a minor increase in capacity is tripled.
Next it'll be tower 18 and the loop. They'll probable need to shift Clark & Lake a bit to the east to keep trains from backing up to the junction.

WrightCONCEPT Dec 8, 2017 8:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by emathias (Post 8012720)
I wish the CTA could us some modern techniques to speed up their timelines on critical infrastructure work - could even save them money, possibly. I know it's relatively complicated to construct the bypass while running two of the busiest lines in the system through the site, but still seems like it shouldn't take 4-5 years to do it if they could.

It seems that because they are dealing with two of the busiest lines in the system that this will take longer to build without significantly shutting down both lines to do the construction, which could probably shave a good 3-4 years off of the project.

MayorOfChicago Dec 8, 2017 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tjp (Post 8012235)
Totally reasonable. I thought train fare was $2.50 already :haha:

I actually thought that too, that trains were $2.50 and the bus $2.25.

OhioGuy Dec 14, 2017 12:39 AM

Morning Commute Feeling More Crowded? Blue Line Sees Explosive Growth, Data Show
The California stop is seeing twice as many morning riders compared with 2002, and growth elsewhere on Blue Line’s O’Hare branch is far above average.

Quote:

t’s not just you. Blue Line trains along the O’Hare branch are getting more crowded during morning rush hour.

Uber and Lyft have chipped away at CTA ridership overall in the last few years, but morning rush hour use (between 6 a.m. and 11 a.m.) has increased 13 percent across all stations since 2002, according to a Chicago analysis of CTA data acquired through a Freedom of Information Act request. Northwest Side stations have seen the highest rates of growth.

Six of the top 10 stations with the biggest increase in morning rush hour use are along the northern branch of the Blue Line, including all stations between Belmont and Damen.
Quote:

Though there are no plans to increase the number of cars running during rush hour, the agency is focusing on how it spreads out trains during rush hour and plans to introduce new, upgraded train cars on the Blue Line within the next few years.

ardecila Dec 14, 2017 8:49 PM

I'm curious to see what CTA can do to ease congestion in the medium-long term. It's not as simple as just running more trains... the boarding process takes time, so you can only set the headways so low. Even just "running more trains" requires expensive signal upgrades to maintain safety, and require new policies to quickly deal with the inevitable disruptions like medical emergencies, crime/police activity, etc. You don't want trains running right on top of each other without really careful coordination.

The easiest quick fix is to rip out or reconfigure seating in cars. CTA did this before on the Brown Line, it eases rush hour congestion a bit but offers fewer seats for riders during off-peak periods. CTA could also go to a three-door configuration, again at the expense of seating (at this point, the cars would be very similar to those on the numbered subway lines in NYC).

In Paris, I remember a lot of the seats were flip-down, which might be a good compromise, although they would require a new etiquette among riders, and might be more prone to vandalism. Open gangways could also help, by spreading out passengers more evenly among the cars. Platform doors might also help, so riders know where to stand while boarding.

Thinking even more outside the box, CTA could improve bus service on Milwaukee with bus lanes on the most congested portions and encourage riders to switch to the bus. Certainly disabled persons would be more likely to switch, to avoid the vertical journey up or down to the L platforms.

OhioGuy Dec 15, 2017 7:47 PM

^ Expand the blue line to accommodate 10 car trains? It’s been talked about with the red line. How about blue as well?

streetline Dec 15, 2017 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by k1052 (Post 8020352)
Five buildings within three blocks of each other. SB is pitching a corporate campus to somebody.

Looking beyond just SB, practically every lot along the train tracks between Morgan and Union now has something substantial proposed to be built.

It seems to me like now would be a good time for the alderman and developers to get together and propose some improvements over the tracks themselves. A raised park-like path over the tracks could really tie the area together into a coherent campus. You could walk from the retail and residential area along Desplaines 5 blocks west to Morgan without ever descending to the rail level. And restoring the bridge at Sangamon as a pedestrian plaza as part of that could improve circulation and connectivity across the tracks.

And the developers are already going to be paying into the neighborhood fund so they might as well find ways to spend some of that money on their own services and projects even if that means they have to kick in a bit more to get the project to happen.

ardecila Dec 16, 2017 4:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by left of center (Post 8019962)
Because its so well served, I dont see major tenants with hundreds or thousands of employees leaving the Loop any time soon. I feel that the West Loop/Fulton Market will remain more of a niche office market, with smaller tenants and fewer employees. It won't realistically be able to sustain more than that. It will compliment the Loop, rather than rival it.

The Clinton Street subway would be a huge help with transit connections. The best aspect of it is that it would create a huge underground Loop for the Blue Line, allowing the Forest Park and O'Hare branches to split into 2 separate lines (which would loop around the Congess/Dearborn/Lake/Clinton 'superloop', much like the Orange, Brown, Purple and Pink lines currently do on the elevated Loop). This will allow the CTA to balance out the two lines. Currently, the O'Hare branch has packed trains while the Forest Park branch runs a bunch of empty trains. The CTA can then focus more train service for the Northwest Side and the airport, as opposed to the underused west side line, which has duplicate service with the Green line half a mile to the north.

The problem with this is you don't wanna cut Blue Line service to UIC or the Medical District. Also, the Blue Line continues to provide service to the West Side long after the Green Line shuts down. That's mainly why CTA runs all those empty trains.

I'd rather see the Clinton Subway to go the Brown Line and through-route to the Orange Line (with transfers to Green/Pink at Lake and Blue at Congress). That would massively decongest the Loop itself, which would just be Green, Pink and Purple. Or give Clinton Subway to Red Line, and run "Brownage" trains via State St.

VKChaz Dec 16, 2017 7:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ardecila (Post 8020965)
The problem with this is you don't wanna cut Blue Line service to UIC or the Medical District. Also, the Blue Line continues to provide service to the West Side long after the Green Line shuts down. That's mainly why CTA runs all those empty trains.

I'd rather see the Clinton Subway to go the Brown Line and through-route to the Orange Line (with transfers to Green/Pink at Lake and Blue at Congress). That would massively decongest the Loop itself, which would just be Green, Pink and Purple. Or give Clinton Subway to Red Line, and run "Brownage" trains via State St.

Hasn't the Central Area Plan already long envisioned the Blue Line running through Clinton and the formation of an underground loop....
https://www.cityofchicago.org/city/e...plandraft.html
Splitting lines could provide more flexibility to the CTA without major service changes.
Separately, I don't know if there would be any value to running a Midway line through as well - providing easy connections between two airports and Amtrak

PKDickman Dec 16, 2017 8:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by left of center (Post 8019962)
allowing the Forest Park and O'Hare branches to split into 2 separate lines (which would loop around the Congess/Dearborn/Lake/Clinton 'superloop', much like the Orange, Brown, Purple and Pink lines currently do on the elevated Loop).

This will allow the CTA to balance out the two lines. Currently, the O'Hare branch has packed trains while the Forest Park branch runs a bunch of empty trains. The CTA can then focus more train service for the Northwest Side and the airport, as opposed to the underused west side line, which has duplicate service with the Green line half a mile to the north.

The blue line O'hare's problem isn't that they don't have enough train cars.
It's butting up against capacity for three reasons. Electricity, headways and train length.
They don't have enough electricty to move any more cars or trains even if they wanted to. The headways are down to 3 minutes now. I doubt that they could ever get below 2 1/2 and 2 3/4 is probably where they will end up. Which will get two more trains an hour.

CTA rail already has the capacity to give every resident of the city their typical 6 mile trip every hour. The problem is they all want to ride the same six miles of the same three rails in the same direction.


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