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-   -   NEW YORK | Hudson Yards; 40 msf of development (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123575)

Crawford Mar 26, 2012 3:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sbarn (Post 5641667)
IAs for the concerns raised by conventioneers, I think people need to realize that there is more to New York than Midtown Manhattan.

The thing is, Javits isn't a convention center; it's an exhibition center. That's why it's such a useless facility and needs to be replaced. It doesn't have much economic worth, because it's built to serve exhibits (mostly local visitors like auto show, boat show, etc.) not conventions (mostly out-of-town visitors).

The whole point about moving Javits is because NYC has no real convention center.

The complaints that were raised were by some exhibitors, because they're in Manhattan and they like the status quo. They don't want a convention center, because they would lose the primary use of the center, but the region would gain as a massive convention hub.

sbarn Mar 26, 2012 3:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crawford (Post 5641689)
The thing is, Javits isn't a convention center; it's an exhibition center. That's why it's such a useless facility and needs to be replaced. It doesn't have much economic worth, because it's built to serve exhibits (mostly local visitors like auto show, boat show, etc.) not conventions (mostly out-of-town visitors).

The whole point about moving Javits is because NYC has no real convention center.

The complaints that were raised were by some exhibitors, because they're in Manhattan and they like the status quo. They don't want a convention center, because they would lose the primary use of the center, but the region would gain as a massive convention hub.

I think that would be great for the overall NYC economy. I think the city needs to become more multi-nodal -- which I think it has been in recent years.

babybackribs2314 Mar 26, 2012 10:47 PM

My take on the issue:

http://newyorkyimby.blogspot.com/201...achronism.html

Quote:

Despite the huge pricetag, the refurbished and very slightly larger Javits will still fail to meet the needs of New York convention goers. The exhibit space, a mere 675,000 square feet (pre-renovation), pales in comparison to the country's major centers--Chicago's McCormick Place takes the number one spot with over 2.2 million square feet of event space, while Houston rounds out the top 10 with a facility just under 1 million square feet.
More at source.

I think that Javits needs to be equally if not MORE ambitious than the Hudson Yards--part of the problem with all the projects in Midtown is the focus on office. We could easily satiate the demand for residential with a mega-resi development where Javits is, and those living there would have an easy/quick commute to jobs nearby. I would hope any project would be of a massive scale, as we've tried huge commercial projects (the WTC) but never residential.

aquablue Mar 26, 2012 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by babybackribs2314 (Post 5642361)
My take on the issue:

http://newyorkyimby.blogspot.com/201...achronism.html



More at source.

I think that Javits needs to be equally if not MORE ambitious than the Hudson Yards--part of the problem with all the projects in Midtown is the focus on office. We could easily satiate the demand for residential with a mega-resi development where Javits is, and those living there would have an easy/quick commute to jobs nearby. I would hope any project would be of a massive scale, as we've tried huge commercial projects (the WTC) but never residential.

I doubt it. I would say it will follow the Battery Park City model as was hinted. Very tall buildings would block the views of the new buildings to the East, which wouldn't sit very well with those property owners.

RobertWalpole Mar 26, 2012 11:53 PM

The Javits site has massive air rights. The city wants to maximize its revenue from the site. Therefore, gigantic buildings will rise there. No one cares about blocked views to towers located east of there.

aquablue Mar 26, 2012 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobertWalpole (Post 5642473)
The Javits site has massive air rights. The city wants to maximize its revenue from the site. Therefore, gigantic buildings will rise there. No one cares about blocked views to towers located east of there.

Gigantic buildings? I'd say no bigger than the Yards.

Dac150 Mar 27, 2012 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aquablue (Post 5642480)
I'd say no bigger than the Yards.

Supertalls can be labeled as 'gigantic' . . .

Regardless of what's developed, it will / should be an improvement to the area.

sbarn Mar 27, 2012 1:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aquablue (Post 5642480)
Gigantic buildings? I'd say no bigger than the Yards.

And the two Hudson Yards towers aren't gigantic? :shrug:

aquablue Mar 27, 2012 2:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sbarn (Post 5642629)
And the two Hudson Yards towers aren't gigantic? :shrug:

Not in my opinion. We all have different perspectives on a word's meaning.

Gigantic is probably best reserved for the world's biggest and tallest structures today, not 300m towers. 300m towers are big buildings, but due to their commonness, they no longer evoke such feelings of extreme size (gigantic) as they once did IMHO.

sbarn Mar 27, 2012 2:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aquablue (Post 5642699)
Not in my opinion. We all have different perspectives on a word's meaning.

Gigantic is probably best reserved for the world's biggest and tallest structures today, not 300m towers. 300m towers are big buildings, but due to their commonness, they no longer evoke such feelings of extreme size (gigantic) as they once did IMHO.

We'll definitely have to agree to disagree.

At 1,292 feet (~390 meters), if the North Tower of Hudson Yards were built tomorrow it would be the third tallest building in the country and the second tallest building in NYC. Not calling that gigantic is a bit ludicrous IMO. But like I said, we'll have to agree to disagree.

NYguy Apr 12, 2012 1:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NewYorkDominates (Post 5662448)
How many buildings are being built at Hudson Yards?Maybe 4 or 5

That depends on what you mean.



http://archpaper.com/news/articles.asp?id=5990

West Side, Ho!
After years of politics and planning, community building, false starts, and new beginnings,
the transformation of the far Manhattan's West Side in the 30s is underway.


Tom Stoelker
4/11/12


Quote:

...Governor Andrew Cuomo’s January 4 State of the State message included welcome news for West Siders who dream of a day when the Jacob K. Javits Convention Center no longer dominates their neighborhood. The Javits was conceived by Governor Hugh Carey’s administration with the highest hopes and with the best talent brought to bear. James Ingo Freed of I. M. Pei & Partners (later Pei Cobb Freed & Partners) envisioned it as a 20th-century crystal palace where, according to firm descriptions, “the play of solidity and transparency in which the vast interior, flooded with natural light, combines indoor and outdoor views” makes the space, with its glass vestibule soaring as high as 150 feet, “a covered city square” rather than the industry-standard remote, windowless mega-box.

A vision of connecting to the waterfront with a retail and restaurant-lined galleria running from east to west and engaging the local population was never realized. Shortly before it opened, Paul Goldberger wrote in the Times of its contradictory nature, describing the exterior glass as forbidding and the use of concrete within as excessively heavy. “It seems to call at once for a Boeing 747 and for a string quartet,” he wrote.

Apart from political penny-pinching and neglected maintenance, Freed’s design was also a victim of bad timing in several respects. In the 1980s, the waterfront was in an apparently irreversible state of dereliction, prompting the architects to turn the building’s back on the river. It faced limited material choices, too, according to FXFOWLE principal Bruce Fowle, whose firm is now partnering with Chicago convention specialists Epstein and an all-star engineering team on the convention center’s current $463 million renovation. Pei & Partners initially specified a reflective glass (also used in Boston’s Hancock Tower), which would have brightened the appearance. “When that suddenly went off the market, they had to change it to the best-performing glass they could find, which was dark bronze with a very reflective coating,” Fowle recalled. “Any hope of transparency in the building from outside was lost.” Since 1980s’ glass was less flat than today’s, he added, “each pane was pillowed, in effect, so you don’t really see a very pure reflection; it’s a quilted look.”


The new Javits has a higher-performing curtain wall of flat, transparent, bird-safe fritted glass (Viracon VNE1-63) in 5-by-10-foot modules, not 5-by-5-foot ones (meaning less metal and a more open feel), with scaffolding and rolling gantries to ease maintenance. It will also be 26 percent more energy efficient, with a 6.75-acre green roof and high-performance rooftop HVAC units.

http://archpaper.com/uploads/west_side_dev_05.jpg


http://archpaper.com/uploads/west_side_dev_03.jpg



http://archpaper.com/uploads/west_side_dev_18.jpg


...The challenge of the Hudson Yards, Marianne Kwok, the project director working with Bill Pedersen at KPF, explained, is to knit the complex into the existing surroundings. “The main thing we tried to do was to make Hudson Yards as seamlessly connected to the rest of the city as possible—to stitch together the surrounding urban fabric: Chelsea to the south, Hell’s Kitchen and the new Hudson Boulevard neighborhood to the north, and midtown to the east,” Kwok said.

Key to achieving this connection will be the ability of the Hudson Park and Boulevard to serve as a pedestrian spine, reducing vehicular traffic by creating landscaped public spaces and providing easy access to public transportation. Station entrances in the northern and southern blocks of the three-block park and boulevard will issue commuters into a landscape that MVVA principal Matthew Urbanski calls, “a machine for lunching,” that then facilitates their flow to the Javits Center, the Hudson Yards, and Related Companies’ future commercial and residential buildings.

“Circulation drove the design, and circulation flows were the most important aspect of the design,” said Urbanski, explaining that “desire lines” to neighboring destinations create diagonal paths through the landscape, linking the station to corners and sidewalks. For cars, the site may prove even trickier to access. Carefully planned traffic circulation by Hudson Yards Development Corporation is intended to ensure low traffic levels and relative pedestrian safety. Due to the sloping design of Hudson Yards, cars will enter the complex from the north along 11th Avenue and a ramped driveway extending from the newly created Hudson Boulevard to reach 32nd and 31st streets, dead-ending in cul-de-sacs with access to street-level amenities. This will possibly reduce the speed of traffic along those streets, while through traffic to 12th Avenue will continue along 30th and 33rd streets. From the south, 10th avenue will slope up to 33rd Street, while pedestrians arriving along 10th Avenue will climb to the High Line from intermittent street entrances.







mrnyc May 31, 2012 9:18 PM

from the highline this afternoon

http://i945.photobucket.com/albums/a...L/20837bc2.jpg

DCReid Jun 15, 2012 11:10 PM

The Spire in Hudson Yards?
 
Why could not some developer buy Santiago Calatrava's design for the Spire in Hudson Yards? Helmut Jahn designed a 1400 tall building in the early 80s for Houston for the Bank of the Southwest. http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=148875

But Houston's economy went bad, so he designed something very similar in Philadelphia, Liberty Place. He used a similar design again for Two Prudential Plaza in Chicago a few years later.

I doubt if the Spire will ever be built in Chicago. It's such a great design to waste. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Spire

Crawford Jun 16, 2012 12:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCReid (Post 5735841)
Why could not some developer buy Santiago Calatrava's design for the Spire in Hudson Yards?

The Spire isn't an economically feasible design.

I doubt it would be built in the proposed form anywhere on earth. It's a cool vision, though.

Hypothalamus Nov 16, 2012 6:30 PM

Any new updates on these future towers? I assume the will deserve their own thread, though, when we acquire new details closer to their construction. =)

Hudson11 Nov 16, 2012 8:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tubeworm (Post 5904184)
Any new updates on these future towers? I assume the will deserve their own thread, though, when we acquire new details closer to their construction. =)

Phase One has been broken up into several threads, all 250m+ including a 407 meter supertall.

Coach Tower http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=202156
North office Tower (Supertall) http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=187315
Equinox Tower http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=199033
Culture Tower http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=198162

eleven=11 Nov 16, 2012 8:15 PM

is there a link for more info on jacob javits center??

Crawford Nov 16, 2012 8:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eleven=11 (Post 5904303)
is there a link for more info on jacob javits center??

It's just being renovated.

It will likely be torn down in the coming years, anyways. The land is too valuable for a low-slung convention center.

eleven=11 Nov 18, 2012 7:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crawford (Post 5904328)
It's just being renovated.

It will likely be torn down in the coming years, anyways. The land is too valuable for a low-slung convention center.

the new glass is awesome, love to see more pics.........
also why do people hate this center??

Hypothalamus Nov 18, 2012 4:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hudson11 (Post 5904286)
Phase One has been broken up into several threads, all 250m+ including a 407 meter supertall.

Coach Tower http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=202156
North office Tower (Supertall) http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=187315
Equinox Tower http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=199033
Culture Tower http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=198162

Thank you very much for the links! Hudson Yards will be real fun to watch!


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