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-   -   NEW YORK | Hudson Yards; 40 msf of development (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123575)

Dac150 Jan 9, 2012 12:57 AM

That would really be something - I love the idea of connecting the area with the waterfront.

NYguy Jan 9, 2012 5:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scalziand (Post 5542356)
The HKNA plan for the Javits site is better than I thought it would be. It restores the street grid to most of the site without cluttering the WSH up with too many intersections, and connecting the whole neighborhood to the waterfront with a bridge over the WSH.

The problem with that plan is it doesn't include much for office develoment. But when the state does develop a master plan for the site, it will of course include space for office development, similar to the BPC plan. The City is trying to create a new office district in that area. Turning over that much space to primarily residential development would be a mistake. There are few places to expand the commercial districts of Manhattan. Even given the time it will take to develop the existing sites zoned for office in the Hudson Yards, eventually those too will dry up. Meanwhile, residential towers and complexes go up all over Manhattan and the rest of the City. Residential's fine there, at least some. But I wouldn't wanna get carried away with it on that site.

NYguy Jan 9, 2012 7:05 PM

http://www.crainsnewyork.com/article...301089973/1009

Javits' end promises new dawn for W. Side
Redeveloping the six-block-long property overlooking the Hudson will give a huge boost to efforts
by the government and a growing number of developers to recreate the long-desolate far West Side of Manhattan.



http://www.crainsnewyork.com/apps/pb...q=100&MaxW=800

By Theresa Agovino
January 8, 2012

Quote:


Even Richard Kahan thinks it's time to demolish the Jacob K. Javits Convention Center—and he built the facility 26 years ago, as head of the Convention Center Development Corp. Mr. Kahan also praises Gov. Andrew Cuomo's proposal to transform the site into a mixed-use development modeled on Battery Park City—a project he also once led as the head of the BPC Authority.

“I don't like seeing my buildings torn down, but a mixed-use project is the highest and best use for that site,” said Mr. Kahan.

Legions of real estate executives agree with him. They say that redeveloping the six-block-long property overlooking the Hudson will give a huge boost to efforts by the government and a growing number of developers to re-create the long-desolate far West Side of Manhattan. The governor's vision of a mix of office buildings, apartment houses, museums and parkland for the 18-acre site would close a key gap.

“It's a great location,” said Douglas Durst, chairman of the Durst Organization, a prominent family development firm. “I'm sure my family would be interested in it.”

The developer with the most at stake is Related. It has several projects under way there. Late last year, Related and partner Oxford announced they would build the site's first tower, a 51-story spire at West 30th Street that will be home for luxury leather-goods maker Coach. To build out the rest of the site, however, the developers must first erect a $1.6 billion platform over the tracks. The timing of the Javits project could be critical for Hudson Yards. If it comes to fruition before Hudson Yards has lined up big tenants, Javits could pose a threat as a cheaper alternative, since it won't require building a pricey platform. On the other hand, if the project takes too long, it could be an eyesore that drags down Hudson Yards' value.

“We look forward to reviewing the details of the proposal, which is even further evidence of the potential of Manhattan's West Side,” said a Related spokeswoman.

599GTO Jan 9, 2012 8:26 PM

So what are the chances of the hideous Javits Center being demolished? Very good?

Please please please make it happen!!!!

Also, 450 West 33rd Street is so disgusting. Any plans to demolish?!

http://s3.amazonaws.com/trd_three/im...articlebox.jpg

scalziand Jan 9, 2012 8:36 PM

The chances of Javits being demolished now or in the imminent future? Very slim.

The chances in a decade or two? Very high.

THE BIG APPLE Jan 9, 2012 10:10 PM

450 West 33rd Street is the Daily News Building, so I wouldn't bet on it being demolished. It's the current headquarters for one of the city's major newspapers. But not as beautiful as their old east side building on 42nd Street.

NYC4Life Jan 11, 2012 10:43 PM

450 West 33rd Street is also the home to WNET Channel 13, highly unlikely this building will be demolished anytime soon.

THE BIG APPLE Jan 11, 2012 10:51 PM

^ That's what I said. It's the headquarters or includes tenants such as the Associated Press, WNET/Channel 13, Lerner New York, Coach, Barney's, and two City of New York agencies, and the Board of Elections and Financial Information Services Agency, and ofcourse the headquarters of the fourth major newspaper in the U.S the Daily News. But I did say it'll be gone in 15-20 years, now that's a guarenDAMNtee.

Dac150 Jan 11, 2012 11:15 PM

^^^I wouldn't count on it . . it's a perfectly fine building that meets the needs of those who occupy it. At a minimum it may go through a rehabilitation . . . I think that's a more realistic and likely scenario considering the transformation the neighborhood will be going through.

It would be a major expense and undertaking to bring down a structure of that size . . regardless of whether something similar has been done before.

NYguy Jan 11, 2012 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scalziand (Post 5543177)
The chances of Javits being demolished now or in the imminent future? Very slim. The chances in a decade or two? Very high.

The Javits will be demolished in 3 - 5 years, but not before the replacement opens in Queens, which will be no earlier than 2014-15. It's going to come down quickly because it's valuable land and the state wants (needs) the money. They'll develop a master plan for the site before then. It's state land, so it won't need to go through the City's approval process, which is what happened with the rest of the Hudson Yards rezoning. They keep pointing to Battery Park City as a model, so expect something along those lines, but not a duplicate.

THE BIG APPLE Jan 12, 2012 1:07 AM

Well it better be a masterpiece of a master plan, because the New Jerseyans like the master of the New York threads nyguy will loose the masterful view of the 1930's masterpiece the Empire State Building and Midtown

Crawford Jan 12, 2012 1:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dac150 (Post 5546264)
^^^I wouldn't count on it . . it's a perfectly fine building that meets the needs of those who occupy it.

This building will almost certainly be demolished and replaced during the next economic cycle.

It's zoned for 3.1 million square feet of space, and was purchased by a major development firm. Their subsequent leases all have demolition clauses.

Dac150 Jan 12, 2012 1:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crawford (Post 5546446)
This building will almost certainly be demolished and replaced during the next economic cycle.

It's zoned for 3.1 million square feet of space, and was purchased by a major development firm. Their subsequent leases all have demolition clauses.

100,000 sqft floor-plates . . . this building isn't going anywhere. Brookfield has too much in the pipeline to even think about redeveloping this site. I tend to believe that the only changes to this site will modernizing the existing structure . . and that'll be down the road as the area becomes more developed and modernized itself.

But then again . . were all just speculating . .

RobertWalpole Jan 12, 2012 2:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THE BIG APPLE (Post 5546222)
^ That's what I said. It's the headquarters or includes tenants such as the Associated Press, WNET/Channel 13, Lerner New York, Coach, Barney's, and two City of New York agencies, and the Board of Elections and Financial Information Services Agency, and ofcourse the headquarters of the fourth major newspaper in the U.S the Daily News. But I did say it'll be gone in 15-20 years, now that's a guarenDAMNtee.

I agree. There's no way that building won't be razed in 15 or 20 years. It has tons of air rights.

NYguy Jan 12, 2012 3:15 AM

http://www.streetsblog.org/2012/01/0...omment-page-1/

The Upside of Cuomo’s Convention Center Plan: Urbanism on the West Side

http://www.streetsblog.org/wp-conten...t_side_map.jpg


by Ben Fried
Jan 9, 2012

Quote:

The Javits Center, built in the 1980s, controls 18 acres on the far West Side, from 33rd Street to 40th Street. Most of the site is an enormous superblock occupied by the main convention center building. The only cross street that provides access to the waterfront and Hudson River Park is 34th Street. (39th Street, while not part of the main building, is barricaded off to serve the facility’s needs.)

“You look down the street and all you see is a black wall,” said Meta Brunzema, an architect and professor at the Pratt Institute who chairs the planning committee of the Hell’s Kitchen Neighborhood Association. “It’s very difficult for the community to have waterfront access.” Meanwhile, the area around Javits never caught on as a retail environment, said Brunzema, because the convention center is empty 100 days out of the year.

Cuomo’s plan to redevelop the Javits site using “the Battery Park City model” — presumably by offering long-term leases piece-by-piece to different developers, working from a set of planning guidelines — could create a cohesive district on the western edge of the neighborhood and finally reconnect city streets to the waterfront......The Javits site sits next to the larger Hudson Yards special district, which the city rezoned in 2005 and will eventually be served by the extension of the 7 train to 34th Street and Eleventh Avenue. One important detail to keep an eye on is that the hard cap on parking spaces in the Hudson Yards district does not apply to the Javits Center site.


What the earlier, Hudson Yards expansion looked like, before plans were scrapped for a much smaller extension.

http://www.pbase.com/nyguy/image/140863867/original.jpg


And then there was the hotel...

http://www.pbase.com/nyguy/image/140863972/medium.jpg

NYguy Jan 13, 2012 2:42 AM

http://www.rpa.org/2012/01/remaking-...west-side.html

Remaking the Far West Side

By Bob Yaro, President, RPA
Jan 12, 2012

Quote:

Gov. Andrew Cuomo's proposal to replace the Javits site with a new urban neighborhood heralds a transformational opportunity for Manhattan's Far West Side.

The area's potential has been undermined for decades by rail yards, empty lots and a hulking convention center that cut off the area from the rest of the city and the Hudson River. With the plan to remove Javits, a decades-long revitalization effort that began with Times Square, continued with the Hudson Waterfront and is under way at Hudson Yards would be fully realized.

Prominently featured in the governor's address was an endorsement of Regional Plan Association's longstanding proposal to develop new convention facilities on Manhattan's Far West Side and in Queens and then to remove the outmoded Javits facility and redevelop its 18-acre site into a major mixed-use waterfront community. This proposal would provide a range of important economic and other benefits to the city and state, including both short- and long-term job creation. The plan also would:

• Recapture the estimated $4 billion value of this large development parcel and put these funds to work in rebuilding New York's economy and infrastructure.

• Allow New York the join the ranks of virtually every other global city in relocating its large convention/trade-show facility from the central business district to a peripheral site that can provide better truck, car and airport access and accommodate the large, single-story structures that these events require.

• Provide for development of a smaller convention facility for high-value conferences and shows that need to remain in Manhattan. While the governor didn't recommend a specific site for this facility, RPA strongly believes that it should be located in the western half of the landmark Farley Post Office, adjoining the new Moynihan Station. The publicly owned Farley building, with its ample floor space and location adjacent to the country's busiest rail station, would be ideal for this facility.

FMIII Jan 13, 2012 9:36 PM

NYC is changing so quickly it becomes incredible.

As a Foreigner who first came in 1985 and almost every year since then until 2005, I can tell how much the city has changed. When you see NYC only once a year, it's like seeing a child growing every summer.

No other cities in the occidental world is as dynamic and as fast growing than NYC. Times Square has become a forest of high rise, The west side west of Lincoln center has become a forest of High rise. The city is safer, cleaner and now the 1980 corner stone of the redevelopment of the west side is about to be demolished to give birth to a New Battery park like project. It took time, but at least the job will be done.

The new buildings planned for the Hudson Yards development are not architecturally speaking "perfect" to my point of view, but I can only say bravo to a city which always look forward to build its future.

Bravo NY. :tup:

NYguy Jan 14, 2012 9:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FMIII (Post 5549170)
NYC is changing so quickly it becomes incredible.

The new buildings planned for the Hudson Yards development are not architecturally speaking "perfect" to my point of view, but I can only say bravo to a city which always look forward to build its future.

Bravo NY. :tup:

New York has a lot more competition from cities around the world now for corporate space, and in the past hasn't really kept up with modern office supply. The problem has been talked about for a long time, but here we see plans in motion to make things possible.

There may be yet another massive rezoning for Midtown proper...
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=197082

FMIII Jan 15, 2012 8:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYguy (Post 5550385)
New York has a lot more competition from cities around the world now for corporate space, and in the past hasn't really kept up with modern office supply. The problem has been talked about for a long time, but here we see plans in motion to make things possible.

There may be yet another massive rezoning for Midtown proper...
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=197082

I looked at the thread and was quite outraged. But that's another topic. Regarding the development of NYC, I know that cities (mainly in Asia) are advancing at a much faster pace. NYC may have old buildings but London, Paris, Frankfurt, Milano are way behind in terms of growth and change. I know that London is building a lot of high-rise but they are still way behind you.
So, good job, it must be exciting to see your hometown endlessly changing for the best. It's not like our European cities which have become open air museums...

scalziand Jan 15, 2012 8:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYguy (Post 5542953)
The problem with that plan is it doesn't include much for office develoment. But when the state does develop a master plan for the site, it will of course include space for office development, similar to the BPC plan. The City is trying to create a new office district in that area. Turning over that much space to primarily residential development would be a mistake. There are few places to expand the commercial districts of Manhattan. Even given the time it will take to develop the existing sites zoned for office in the Hudson Yards, eventually those too will dry up. Meanwhile, residential towers and complexes go up all over Manhattan and the rest of the City. Residential's fine there, at least some. But I wouldn't wanna get carried away with it on that site.

That's one of teh things I would like like to see changed about the HKNA plan. The new strip of park and residential buildings facing the park would be nice, but I'd really like to see a row of office towers along 11th ave.

That would add another 10-15 MSF of office space while still keeping a decent amount of room for residential development. It would be good to have the towers step down in size as they head north from the yards, so as to not overwhelm the existing residential along 42nd street.

Something like this:
http://img860.imageshack.us/img860/585/hknaplanmod1.png

http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/3378/hkmod2.jpg

http://img710.imageshack.us/img710/3153/hkmod3.jpg


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