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-   -   Phoenix Development News (3) (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=173764)

exit2lef Jun 12, 2017 2:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by azliam (Post 7831858)

The Business Journal story is pretty vague. I suspect any attempt to tear down the Hula's building would meet with significant opposition from historic preservation advocates. It's a unique, interesting structure. Also, I suspect that any attempt to tear down buildings to create parking would meet with some resistance from the city for being out of sync with Reinvent PHX and other initiatives. If, on the other hand, this is about tearing down Hula's and replacing it with an apartment building, that might happen despite some controversy. It will be interesting to see how much of this story is verified in the months to come.

dtnphx Jun 12, 2017 3:50 PM

I'm confused. Are they tearing down the shopping center that Hula is in, or just the PAD that it's on to put up an apartment. Doesn't seem like enough room, does it?

CrestedSaguaro Jun 12, 2017 4:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exit2lef (Post 7831909)
The Business Journal story is pretty vague. I suspect any attempt to tear down the Hula's building would meet with significant opposition from historic preservation advocates. It's a unique, interesting structure. Also, I suspect that any attempt to tear down buildings to create parking would meet with some resistance from the city for being out of sync with Reinvent PHX and other initiatives. If, on the other hand, this is about tearing down Hula's and replacing it with an apartment building, that might happen despite some controversy. It will be interesting to see how much of this story is verified in the months to come.

I love Hula's! I go there about once a week after work. The location is always busy and the building has charm. I would hate to see it torn down. It would be great if they could integrate Hula's into any development they build. We still have a year, so things can change in that amount of time.

dtnphx Jun 12, 2017 6:15 PM

So, I looked on Maricopa Assessor's page and see that the lot directly behind it is owned by the same Davis Enterprises that owns the shopping center where Hula's is, so it would be a total demolish in my estimation. The back lot has been cleared since this photo was taken.

http://pdf.leeazmail.com/pdfs/Hula.jpg

pbenjamin Jun 12, 2017 9:35 PM

Never been to the restaurant, but I worked in that building in 1989 when it was the headquarters for the Valtrans campaign.

mdpx Jun 12, 2017 10:17 PM

From the City of Phoenix Public Meeting Results page. Seems Central & Camelback parcel on SW corner will be condos or apartments and a hotel. Should be very dense. Only problem is that they received a delay until 2021. It doesn't mean they can't start sooner, but I hate when developers are given that much leeway. The little parcel that changed hands last week between the LRT and the rest of the corner pushed this project forward apparently.



Application #: ZA-206-17-4
w/ stips Existing Zoning: C-2 (Approved C-2 H-R)
Location: Southwest corner of Camelback Road
and Central Avenue

Quarter Section: 18-27(H8)
Proposal: 1) Time extension for ZA-407-11, a
request to modify stipulations of approval
for a variance to reduce the minimum lot
area for each dwelling unit to 125 square
feet and 50 square feet for each hotel
guestroom. Not less than 450 square
feet for each dwelling unit and 200
square feet for each guestroom required.

2) Time extension for ZA-407-11, a
request to modify stipulations of approval
for a variance to increase the lot
coverage to 80%. Maximum 50 percent
allowed. 3) Time extension for ZA-407-
11, a request to modify stipulations of
approval for a variance to allow up to a
20-foot build-to line along Central
Avenue and Camelback Road. Maximum
6-foot build-to required. Approved
subject to general conformance to site
plan and elevations. 4) Time extension
for ZA-407-11, a request to modify
stipulations of approval for a variance to
reduce the required shading method
ratios: 25% structured shading along
entire length of building proposed, 50%
required; and 25% other methods of
shading along entire length of proposed
building, 50% required. Approved subject
to conditions and general conformance
to site plan and elevations. 5) Time
extension for ZA-407-11, a request to
modify stipulations of approval for a
variance to allow a maximum of 150% of
the City required parking spaces.
Maximum 125% allowed. Approved
subject to general conformance to site
plan and elevations. 6) Time extension
for ZA-407-11, a request to modify
stipulations of approval for a variance to
reduce the required number of loading
berths to 5. Minimum 7 loading berths for
up to 490,000 square feet of aggregate
floor area plus 1 additional berth for each
additional 90,000 square feet of
aggregate gross floor area required.
Approved subject to conditions and
general conformance to site plan and
elevations. 7) Time extension for ZA-
407-11, a request to modify stipulations
of approval for a variance to reduce
minimum building frontage to 45% along
Camelback Road and 35% along Central
Avenue. Minimum 75% building frontage
required. Approved subject to general
conformance to site plan and
elevations. 8) Time extension for ZA-
407-11, a request to modify stipulations
of approval for a variance to allow nonclear
windows along the building fa├žade
length fronting onto Camelback Road
and Central Avenue. Minimum 50% clear
windows required. Approved subject to
conditions and general conformance to
site plan and elevations. 9) Time
extension for ZA-407-11. a request to
modify stipulations of approval for a
variance to not provide a main building
entry oriented toward transit platform.
Main building entry oriented toward
transit platform and/or primary pedestrian

access way required. Approved subject
to conditions and general conformance
to site plan and elevations.
Ordinance Sections: 631.B.2.a 631.B.2.e 662.H.1.a 662.H.2.c
662.K.1 702.B.2 662.H.2.a
662.H.2.a 662.H.2.b
Applicant: Reid Butler, Cornerstone at Camelback,
LLC
Representative: Reid Butler, Cornerstone at Camelback,
LLC
Owner: Cornerstone at Camelback
Stipulations:
1) Extended until June 8, 2021. 2) Previous stipulations remain in
place: 1) 180 days to apply for building permits. 2) Addition to
match design of principle building. 3) Final location of addition to
be approved by Zoning Adjustment Hearing Officer. 4) For
projection to within 20 feet for up to 1/2 the width of the building.
3) 90 days to present to adjacent Four Corners Neighborhood
Associations with site plan for interim beautification plan. 4) One
year to complete construction of interim beautification.

biggus diggus Jun 12, 2017 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pbenjamin (Post 7832443)
Never been to the restaurant, but I worked in that building in 1989 when it was the headquarters for the Valtrans campaign.

Some of the stuff on their menu is pretty tasty, I especially like the Spicy Shrimp Caesar.

exit2lef Jun 12, 2017 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dtnphx (Post 7832191)
So, I looked on Maricopa Assessor's page and see that the lot directly behind it is owned by the same Davis Enterprises that owns the shopping center where Hula's is, so it would be a total demolish in my estimation. The back lot has been cleared since this photo was taken.

I'm generally in favor of demolishing low-rise shopping centers to make way for more density, but I'd probably make an exception in this case. Part of it is the design of the shopping center, which is architecturally interesting, at least to me. Part of it is the nostalgia for major tenants throughout the years -- not only Hula's but also Movies on Central, Haus, and the original Lola Coffee.

biggus diggus Jun 12, 2017 10:58 PM

Speaking of Lola, we tried Fame last weekend and it was excellent. I highly recommend their brunch if anyone hasn't been and feels like trying something new.

The parking there is atrocious, though.

Obadno Jun 12, 2017 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdpx (Post 7832481)
1) Extended until June 8, 2021. 2) Previous stipulations remain in
place: 1) 180 days to apply for building permits. 2) Addition to
match design of principle building. 3) Final location of addition to
be approved by Zoning Adjustment Hearing Officer. 4) For
projection to within 20 feet for up to 1/2 the width of the building.
3) 90 days to present to adjacent Four Corners Neighborhood
Associations with site plan for interim beautification plan. 4) One
year to complete construction of interim beautification.

I don't think 4 years is wildly long for a large scale project actually.

Marina heights just finished and its been in the works since mid 2011

ASUSunDevil Jun 13, 2017 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exit2lef (Post 7832492)
I'm generally in favor of demolishing low-rise shopping centers to make way for more density, but I'd probably make an exception in this case. Part of it is the design of the shopping center, which is architecturally interesting, at least to me. Part of it is the nostalgia for major tenants throughout the years -- not only Hula's but also Movies on Central, Haus, and the original Lola Coffee.

I agree.

Why wouldn't the developer just incorporate the existing retail into the development? There will be a (justified) uproar if they want to demolish a building as cool as Hula's to build another 'Broadstone' box.

Phxguy Jun 13, 2017 4:01 AM

https://www.facebook.com/DowntownVoices/

Came across an interesting development involving a Gateway Community College/ Maricopa CC makespace being developed at 535 W Van Buren. I attached a link which has an in depth description of what is to come. The building itself is in the vicinity of recent renovations (Welnick Market, the Van Buren, etc.), I hope this means we will see a similar restoration.

Obadno Jun 13, 2017 5:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phxguy (Post 7832812)
https://www.facebook.com/DowntownVoices/

Came across an interesting development involving a Gateway Community College/ Maricopa CC makespace being developed at 535 W Van Buren. I attached a link which has an in depth description of what is to come. The building itself is in the vicinity of recent renovations (Welnick Market, the Van Buren, etc.), I hope this means we will see a similar restoration.

Excellent! The first time one of those old Van Buren Motels gets demolished for a new apartment block or high rise will be a great day

Jjs5056 Jun 13, 2017 9:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Obadno (Post 7832847)
Excellent! The first time one of those old Van Buren Motels gets demolished for a new apartment block or high rise will be a great day

Meh. This is a pretty lame use of that entire stretch of vintage warehouses between 5th and 6th avenues. Rehabbed with several businesses and wrapped by a residential tower would have been great, but anything MCCCD touches will be anything but.

They could easily jumpstart a revitalization of that area by expanding Rio Salado, Phoenix College, or building a new, Central Phoenix CC with a focus on technology, sustainability, and the arts: the old Baptist Church used for live performances / exhibits and 1-2 bar/lounges; the Masonic Temple sitting in the center of a 'quad' space repurposed as a public library, bookstore, and restaurant; filling in multiple lots with dense office/education/retail and family-style housing...

Yet, the one Phoenix College DT and Rio Salado DT designs make this totally impossible. Maybe it will at least lead to further investment as part of the overall changes with the VB, etc.

exit2lef Jun 13, 2017 3:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASUSunDevil (Post 7832601)
I agree.

Why wouldn't the developer just incorporate the existing retail into the development? There will be a (justified) uproar if they want to demolish a building as cool as Hula's to build another 'Broadstone' box.

Agreed, and if an apartment building is constructed behind the shopping center, it could incorporate a garage or underground parking to relieve some of the issues mentioned by biggus. The vacant lot behind the shopping center already functions as overflow restaurant parking at peak times.

Obadno Jun 13, 2017 4:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jjs5056 (Post 7832932)
Meh. This is a pretty lame use of that entire stretch of vintage warehouses between 5th and 6th avenues. Rehabbed with several businesses and wrapped by a residential tower would have been great, but anything MCCCD touches will be anything but.

They could easily jumpstart a revitalization of that area by expanding Rio Salado, Phoenix College, or building a new, Central Phoenix CC with a focus on technology, sustainability, and the arts: the old Baptist Church used for live performances / exhibits and 1-2 bar/lounges; the Masonic Temple sitting in the center of a 'quad' space repurposed as a public library, bookstore, and restaurant; filling in multiple lots with dense office/education/retail and family-style housing...

Yet, the one Phoenix College DT and Rio Salado DT designs make this totally impossible. Maybe it will at least lead to further investment as part of the overall changes with the VB, etc.

You are asking:

"Why don't completely different entities do something completely different with different funding and for different reasons?"

the answer: because that isn't what's happening.

Ballister Jun 13, 2017 4:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by exit2lef (Post 7833155)
Agreed, and if an apartment building is constructed behind the shopping center, it could incorporate a garage or underground parking to relieve some of the issues mentioned by biggus. The vacant lot behind the shopping center already functions as overflow restaurant parking at peak times.

Come on guys, that shopping center is a dog and nothing special about it, except that it has some very cool businesses. The Hula building is not the Guggenheim, OK. To make the project pencil, they would have to completely level it to get enough room for maximum coverage. Underground parking is not really likely on that site.

ASU Diablo Jun 13, 2017 5:21 PM

This can be interesting. I just received a notice about a hearing tonight that will discuss an amendment change to the dirt lot at NWC of Central and Willetta. This is the dirt lot immediately south of The Old Spaghetti Factory. It's calling for an increased height change of 75' to 250'. Does anyone know anything more?? :tup:

Update: I figured it would be an RAA meeting w/ all the NIMBYs. But it will be the developer actually presenting, I will try and make it and get more info.

ASUSunDevil Jun 13, 2017 8:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ballister (Post 7833279)
Come on guys, that shopping center is a dog and nothing special about it, except that it has some very cool businesses. The Hula building is not the Guggenheim, OK. To make the project pencil, they would have to completely level it to get enough room for maximum coverage. Underground parking is not really likely on that site.

I think those cool businesses were drawn to that location because of the cool building. It might not be the Guggenheim, but it's not the old Macayo's. Like I said, I don't know what the apartment plans are, but tearing down a mid-century (1965) building with thriving businesses on Central Ave. is asinine if the plan is stucco rental boxes. Adaptive reuse is the obvious solution.

I couldn't understand the Circles hysteria because the building was unused and there was a smart project in place - this seems to be the opposite.

mdpx Jun 13, 2017 8:50 PM

So that shopping center is worth preserving with a few really good places Fame, Hula's, ? and reuse it and somehow expect a developer to incorporate it? How? How would that pan out as an investment? There's plenty of empty retail up and down Central for any of those businesses to relocate to. The empty property behind the center is too small to do anything without the shopping center frontage.


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