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2. The alignment in that map is general... It's my understanding that the Transitway would use Milwaukee. 3. Clinton can be grade-separated fairly easily... the condo buildings there have been designed with entrances that don't face onto Clinton. Canal would be much more difficult, so it won't be grade-separated. 4. The right-of-way used to go to about Columbus, where the railroad tracks ran along Illinois Street, sharing the same space as cars. Back when it was built, heavy traffic wasn't really a problem in Streeterville... |
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Thanks for the answers, ardecila. The Carroll Avenue transitway is a pretty creative idea. Of course I'm pulling for streetcars rather than buses, because it would just be awesome to have streetcars roaming the streets of Chicago again, but either way it promises to be a popular service.
How about a south loop extension of the transitway? Rather than turning around at Jackson, stay on the Clinton/Canal pair as far as 14th. From there, curve east, and take either the St. Charles Air Line bridge or B&O bridge over the river. Follow the (soon to be abandoned) SCAL through the south loop, to the museums campus, Soldier Field, and McCormick Place. There might be other, better uses for the SCAL, but this is just one possibility. |
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And if so, then over or under? |
^^ Yes, it's pretty necessary. Trains, both Metra and Amtrak, often block the crossing for minutes at a time as they wait for a track in the station, or they wait for clearance to leave. During rush hour, there are hundreds of trains coming out of that station, and crossing the tracks is nearly impossible. Cars can easily turn around and use the overpass at Desplaines, but that's a big inconvenience for pedestrians.
An underpass would make the most sense, so I assume that will be what is built. An overpass would block windows on the adjacent condo buildings and project traffic noise farther, although it would be cheaper. |
In other news, Valerie Jarrett has been tapped by Obama for some unspecific position in the Obama administration. She's also a good contender for his vacant Senate seat.
Either way, Obama will be putting a former director of the CTA into a very influential Washington position. Secretary of Transportation is possible, and so is Secretary of HUD. |
^^ Ok, so assuming that rail, even if it's LRT, requires a shallower incline than buses could tolerate, how close to Fulton must the slope begin, I wonder?
Also, the incline on the north side would presumably have to be a curving trench that returns to grade as it reaches Canal - correct? But maybe the most interesting question is whether the Carroll Bridge is too low to have its down position as the default. Would this prevent tour boat clearance? (BVic has probably thought about this a lot.) If it does, will the answer be to rebuild the bridge slightly higher? |
Can anyone tell me why the CTA uses 3 different colors of paint on the L structures? I’ve seen off-white, manila-yellow, and burgundy. I would certainly understand if they decided to use different colors for different areas, but those are 3 colors just inside the Loop! Is it too much to ask for some uniformity?
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I'm aware that they repainted the Wabash portion of the L structure to match the bridges. Part of the structure on Wabash is white, in particular the beams that support the platforms and the platforms themselves. I’m just curious why they weren’t uniform to begin with. From what I’ve read, the painting of the L was part of the Wabash Avenue Improvement Project and not really the CTA’s choice. |
Yeah, basically. Certain pieces of metal weren't painted because they would have interfered with the operation of the stations above.
CDOT was only allowed to paint portions of the structure that are accessible from the street, and only on the condition that the painting process wouldn't affect the trains or passengers above. @ denizen467 - rail is pretty much out of the question... CTA has already decided to go ahead with a BRT program on 4 different streets, so you can bet they will be using BRT here as well. Using BRT also gives the flexibility to run bus lines to different destinations in Streeterville... one to Navy Pier, one to Northwestern, and one to Water Tower. Since most of this is grade separated, it will approach "true" BRT. The route will probably turn sharply east right after the Clinton underpass, and then run underneath the Metra viaduct alongside the Cassidy Tires warehouse to get to the Kinzie St bridge. |
^ So RIP light rail hopes! :(
If it facilitates an array of destinations throughout Streeterville then it's worth it I guess though. What's known about the clearance under the Carroll St Bridge? |
Carroll Street bridge????
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(Disclaimer: on my third beer now) |
Technically, the bridge is called the Kinzie Street bridge, which is confusing, because Kinzie Street (the actual street, for cars and trucks) has its own bridge about 200 feet to the north.
And FYI, I've also had several beers... |
Ah, now I understand that you mean the railroad bridge over the river. Usually just referred to as "Chicago & North Western Ry. Bridge over the North Branch of the Chicago River near Kinzie Street," though apparently the railroad inventory number was N-1511. Actually, Carroll Street Bridge wouldn't be a bad name—but Carroll Street never crossed the river.
The vertical clearance under the existing span is only 6.5 feet. |
^ & ^^ Ok, that's edifying to finally have info on this mysterious bridge (after many many years of prowling this city's maps and streets). But also, those names aren't super clear or useful. So as soon as non-rail vehicles become able to traverse this bridge, I say "Carroll Street Bridge" is one good option.
On the other hand, 6.5 feet?? Does this mean the bridge must be rebuilt or else this transitway plan will have to be routed across the river at Kinzie Street? |
The most likely scenario, I think, is that the railroad bridge (now a Chicago Landmark) would be reset at a higher level à la the Kinzie Street Bridge.
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^ I agree, although it will be amusing and amazing to see this done.
I wish similar adaptive reuse could be found for the historic Division Street Bascule bridges (for autos), currently slated for demo. |
^^ Excellent. So the Kinzie Street Bridge was re-set from a lower position? How long ago, and do you know whether there are any pics or articles about it?
^ Last week an alumnus donated a record $300 million to the U of C graduate school of business. IMHO, a business school is not exactly an institution where a giant investment will reap tremendous dividends for society in the way of knowledge, research, inventions, culture, etc. ... It's really a staggering amount of money - if only donors like this would, even if in a small way, turn their philanthropic energies to recognizing the importance of historic preservation, we could, for a fraction of that money, save many cultural treasures like these bridges. |
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