Regional differences in urban form/typology

[jonny24]

Never heard it call Brampton or Brantford brick. I always just called it "yellow brick", though I also heard "buff brick" used. Since learning (probably on SSP) that it's an Ontario thing, I call it Ontario Yellow Brick.

If I can ever afford to build my own house, that's what it's going to be clad in. All the nice old farmhouses I grew near have it.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by urbandreamer

Is Johannesburg affordable for a month vacation? My mother, grandmother and great grandmother all lived there off and on between 1902 and 1962.

A month in the Cape would be much nicer, imo.

[savevp]

Originally Posted by Docere

Neither Toronto or Ottawa don't really have a rich side of town and a working class side of town in the way you do in Montreal, Vancouver or Winnipeg - i.e. draw down a certain street or river and all the richest areas lie on one side of it.

(Many other cities seem to follow the working class east/more affluent west pattern: Hamilton, London, Kingston).

I've always found it interesting how the original east/west split in London, England is so oft-reflected in Canadian cities. And in Toronto's case, how demographically similar the 'East' and 'West' parts of each city tend to be. Especially the East's. And to the original post above, I think the Don Valley pretty reliably separates Toronto's working class 'East' (Scarborough) from the affluent centre and relatively more affluent 'West.' Of course there are exceptions on either side.

As an interesting contrast, Australian cities tend to reverse this. The 'Wests' are the working class areas usually. Different hemisphere I guess

American cities tend to divide affluent 'north' and poor (largely Black) 'south.'

[MonkeyRonin]

Originally Posted by savevp

I've always found it interesting how the original east/west split in London, England is so oft-reflected in Canadian cities. And in Toronto's case, how demographically similar the 'East' and 'West' parts of each city tend to be. Especially the East's. And to the original post above, I think the Don Valley pretty reliably separates Toronto's working class 'East' (Scarborough) from the affluent centre and relatively more affluent 'West.' Of course there are exceptions on either side.

That's not really the case in Toronto. The inner city east of the Don is wealthier than the core and the inner west end. Scarborough is indeed pretty working class - much more so than its western antipode of Etobicoke - but then on the other hand, eastern North York is wealthier than its western half, and East York is wealthier than York:




Nor has it been the case historically. The favoured quarter has always (or, at least since the late 1800s) skewed north along the central Yonge corridor:

[MonkeyRonin]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

Traditional rowhomes are essentially non-existent anywhere in BC which is a shame as they wouldn't have been as easy to tear down like all the SFHs have been.

They're certainly not common, but they do exist! Eg:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/xcm957SowwWWv6NN6
https://maps.app.goo.gl/X21B7GrKBCtey1VQ7
https://maps.app.goo.gl/RgPzqWJnUYa4kXGy8
https://maps.app.goo.gl/Vy9ixupETUJXZrqF9

Also somewhat more common here are the "long" rowhouses (not sure if they have a proper name), that extend down the depth of a lot:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/1dBmPDz3xWBGXsVF6
https://maps.app.goo.gl/Y88WsEAGdiE8YFAR8

In any case, it's kind of a moot point as the neighbourhoods were these do exist (like Strathcona & Grandview-Woodland) tend not to have too many teardowns anyway.

[ScreamingViking]

Originally Posted by savevp

As an interesting contrast, Australian cities tend to reverse this. The 'Wests' are the working class areas usually. Different hemisphere I guess

Prevailing winds being opposite in the southern hemisphere, I'd guess. I don't know anything about industrial development in Australia, but in some Canadian cities there were factories right near the centre of town! In Hamilton for sure, so the neighbourhoods to the "east" were subject to poor air quality and air pollution. And this continued when the gigantic steel-based industrial complex grew along the city's eastern bayfront shoreline, though as urban development spread it became less of a pollution source for the communities that went up in the far "east" (really southeast and ESE, given the geography).

Hamilton has some "affluent" historical housing that's not far eastward of the downtown, but it's closer to the Niagara Escarpment and may have avoided the fallout from industries in the core when they existed.

[Acajack]

French Canadians where they lived in metro areas with large numbers of anglophones (who generally dominated the economy and society) were almost always concentrated in the east end of cities. All of the classic historic francophone neighbourhoods in Canada (and even in New England, really) are on the eastern sides. It was said by some that this was to be closer to France or Rome, but it's really because it was the less desirable part of town, working class and more exposed to air pollution and closer to industries.

[Docere]

Originally Posted by MonkeyRonin

That's not really the case in Toronto. The inner city east of the Don is wealthier than the core and the inner west end. Scarborough is indeed pretty working class - much more so than its western antipode of Etobicoke - but then on the other hand, eastern North York is wealthier than its western half, and East York is wealthier than York

Using the Hulchanski et al classifications of low (less than 80% of CMA average, middle (80-120%) and high income census tracts (120%+). I excluded CTs with populations of less than 1,000..

West End (64 CTs)

High income 22
Middle income 35
Low income 7

East End (32 CTs)

High income 18
Middle income 13
Low income 1

East end is higher income than the west end. The west end has more renters and a a younger population. East end also has a smaller population and affluent enclaves like the Beaches and North Riverdale-Playter Estates make up a good share of the population.

[Docere]

York

High income 5
Middle income 9
Low income 19

East York

High income 7
Middle income 12
Low income 7

Won't bother tallying Scarborough and Etobicoke but Etobicoke is obviously more affluent (Etobicoke - with a little more than half of Scarborough's population - has around 15 high income tracts while Scarborough has 2. And Scarborough is dominated by lower income tracts while the southern 2/3 of Etobicoke is middle and higher income).

[hipster duck]

Originally Posted by MonkeyRonin

Nor has it been the case historically. The favoured quarter has always (or, at least since the late 1800s) skewed north along the central Yonge corridor:

1970 is almost ancient history in Toronto. The geography of wealth in the city - at a time when legions of men still rode streetcars to their factory jobs in places like Liberty Village - almost has more in common with 1890 than it does with 2024.

It's hard to imagine streets like this being in one of the poorest parts of the city.

[Docere]

For comparison, Vancouver in 1970:

http://neighbourhoodchange.ca/docume...couver-cma.pdf

[Docere]

Originally Posted by hipster duck

1970 is almost ancient history in Toronto. The geography of wealth in the city - at a time when legions of men still rode streetcars to their factory jobs in places like Liberty Village - almost has more in common with 1890 than it does with 2024.

It's hard to imagine streets like this being in one of the poorest parts of the city.

In 1970, the low income workers were still mostly living in the inner city. The middle income workers were living in places like Downsview, while the middle and professional classes were living in places like Don Mills and Leaside. Gentrification was just starting in the Annex, Yorkville and Cabbagetown.

And there was a much more equal distribution of income then and hence far more middle income tracts. The shift from unionized manufacturing to the low paid precariat and service economy is evident. Working class areas in Toronto are now red on the map.

[flar]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

I've never heard those names before. Growing up in Kitchener, we always referred to it as "buff brick".

That's what I've always heard too

[flar]

Have a look at this thread for some common older housing types in several Ontario cities

https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=170890

[SignalHillHiker]

One built form that's on its way out here as most of these places are on their last generation: car-free outports. These are mostly located on the south coast between Burgeo and Harbour Breton, both of which are connected to the rest of the province by road.

This one (via FB) is Grey River, population 95.



This one is Francois, population 64.



One of the provincial ferry routes:

[MolsonExport]

fabulous photo

[craner]

^Agreed - that is awesome.
I want to visit there.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by flar

Have a look at this thread for some common older housing types in several Ontario cities

https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=170890

Here's a good guide (focus is GTA/SWOntario):

https://www.therealtydeal.com/wp-con...yles-Guide.pdf

[Docere]

Originally Posted by flar

Have a look at this thread for some common older housing types in several Ontario cities

https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=170890

Yes, there's definitely a 19th century Ontario typology.

[Docere]

Just looked through occupational data in the 1961 census and in the east and west ends of the city there was really only one non-working class Census Tract: the Glen Manor Drive area of the Beaches.

The map really has flipped over the half-century.