Quote:
Originally Posted by mr1138
I think perhaps you're missing that the pedestrian bridge has access stairways and elevators from every single train platform. There is no need to exit north to Wewatta in order to access the bridge. I'll give you the fact that it requires climbing up and down staircases, which people do habitually avoid, and that the south exit to the "Underground" is right by the back door to the great hall; but this still doesn't seem like enough to funnel that many people into the building all at once.
Keep in mind that the south exit is not the only exit... there is one equally as large at Wewatta, another at Chestnut (with its own 16th Street Mall shuttle stop) and exits onto every commuter train platform as well. When you're in the underground, you have to make a concerted effort to walk all the way past the many elevators and staircases to the last exit. I would imagine that at least 75% of regular users will figure out how to use these alternate exits and not cut through the great hall. Mall shuttle riders have absolutely no reason to cut through the main hall; they have not one, but two separate exits immediately onto 16th Street directly from the commuter platforms, and a mall shuttle stop right by the Triangle building/Kimpton Hotel exit.
Also remember that commuter train riders will be forced to walk to the end of the platforms before heading toward LoDo (unless they want to go out of their way into the underground, which as you say, they will avoid because it involves going down and then up). Here they will see the enormous exit to the Wewatta plaza by the South Wing building, which will be the shortest path to the street, not through the great hall. During a Rockies game, the bridge will in fact be nearly equally as short a route as going through the hall.
And when crowds get as big as you are describing, people will naturally take the path of least resistance and find their way to the alternate exits. Crowds of that size act on people's behavior and perception of the shortest route. People are repelled by crowds that move like herds of cattle. If the bridge appears to have available personal space, and the doors to the hall become a choke-point, then people will gravitate to the bridge rather than crowding through the doors into the hall. And keep in mind that these crowds naturally thin out as individual people all move at totally different speeds.
Besides, if the great hall really does get as crowded as you fear it will, then they will just remove some of the furniture; no harm no foul. That doesn't make its design a failure.
|
I am not saying that the Union Station design is a failure, as that design served Denver well until the early 1960, when the collapse of private interstate railroad transportation began to seriously affect passenger load. The old building, working with a wide, underground, passenger access way, and, numerous through tracks was a scaled down, and, more city size appropriate passenger terminal. To put usage figures in perspective, per the special Denver's 100th anniversary magazine put out by the Post in 1959, the station in 1959 with an open "Open Space" had 300,000 boardings and deboadings per year. So lets say about 1,000 people used the facility daily with 500 leaving trains, and, 500 waiting to board trains, per day.
Of course, comparing this figure with- out of the hat- 150,000 to 200,000 riders per business day, or 75,000 - 100,000 people using the entire DUS Station Complex twice per day, and, what emerges is a very different new station where far more people wait a shorter time within Union Station and far more walk through it compared to the 1950s and earlier. Take a 2 hour transit rush period (the center two hours of the distribution) and look at the area under the curve and we get exit rates of the Underground, those that walk through the Underground, and those that bypass the Underground and catch the 16th Street Mall shuttle, as high as 50,000 people per hour during rush hour, or (averaging down), about 800 people per minute. This will saturate the Wewatta Street and Union Station exits from the Underground, whose combined capacity, IMO, is around 200 or possibly 250 people per minute in the same direction (net 12,000 to 15,000 per hour). (Add the16th Street Mall shuttle pickup at Denver Light, and drop off rate per hour also- I cannot imagine a rate much higher than 200 pickups or drop offs per minute. I will give the new shuttle a 50 people per minute figure as frequency will increase greatly by then. The net rate of exit would then be ~ 500 people per minute.)
Of course, this is an average rate over two hours. Take in the 45 minutes between 7:00 and 7:45a and 4:45p and 5:30p, rates will be far higher, as number of buses arriving and departing will be highest, the light rail will be running at capacity, and, the commuter lines, too, will be fully scheduled. I would think that during these times that the passenger load would be significantly higher than the 2 hour average. A ball park guess would be 25% higher- say at the rate as high as 60,000 people per hour over these 45 minutes, or approximately 1000 people per minute. This is greater than the capacity of the Wewatta St and the Union Station exit for the Underground, (250 people per minute) plus the Shuttle (200 people per minute) plus the new shuttle (50 people minute) or approximately 500 people per minute exit or entrance capacity.
The net result will be crowding towards the south end of the Underground. As for the poor folk exiting at Wewatta, the south bound Mall shuttles will be close to being packed, pushing crowds south towards Union Station. In addition, the Wewatta exit directly accesses and will continue to access a small portion of the downtown's office space capacity, so the exit puts commuters out in the middle of nowhere (but thank *** it's there).
Use similar figures for Rockies games during a winning season, with the caveat that the hourly rate will be lower for those leaving the game, and, higher as fans travel to the game where the Underground provides the least strenuous route from the light rail, from buses, and, (less so) for commuter users. While passenger usage rates per hour, naturally, would be far lower, a rate per hour exiting the Underground over the busiest 45 minutes as fans arrive, might easily approach 10,000 per hour or 350 per minute. Simply a Rockies game could almost fill all exits at capacity.
Add usage figures for the Great Hall during inclement weather, also, where through pedestrian traffic will bunch up, even as people walk through the Union Station.
Go out and walk the facility alone and imagine the crowd dynamics.
Everything looks good until people use such facilities in high numbers. "Based upon projection X that fits within desired development parameters Y then customer behavior can be defined until passenger loads are >Z." At that point design mistakes start to scream.
By 2025, I firmly believe that even with all benches removed and commercial facilites pushed into the building's wings, that the small size of the Great Hall (take everything out of the great room and there is <20,000 feet squared in the Great Hall) and the Hall still will hit saturation.
NOTE: The pedestrian bridge looks great, but, will not significantly affect net station exit rates per hour. At the max, perhaps 50 people minute could use the bridge per minute in one direction.
NOTE2: Figures become even worse when one realizes that many people from the light rail and commuter lines will want to enter the Underground, before leaving it.
Prev
Linear Mode
