Winnipeg Roads & Infrastructure

[esquire]

Originally Posted by CoryB

First, they would need to accept Route 90 as a non-starter and move to focus to William Clement. South of Portage it could be made free flowing. The bigger issues is between Portage and CentrePort Way.

That was always the plan... Route 90 was never intended to be part of the inner ring. Clement was designed as the western leg of the loop. The city screwed up years ago by failing to protect a right of way from Portage to Saskatchewan Avenue, though.

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by CoryB

Winnipeg would need to face some hard realities though if looking at a proper inner ring road.

First, they would need to accept Route 90 as a non-starter and move to focus to William Clement. South of Portage it could be made free flowing. The bigger issues is between Portage and CentrePort Way.

Second, they need to look at the mess that is CentrePort Way. Who in their right mind approved a bridge over one set of tracks but allowed an at-grade crossing for a second set that were nearby? Further, how did a new "expressway" get built with two at-grade signalled intersections? Finally, the mix of speeds on CentrePort Way needs to be addressed.
.

Drove on Centreport Way for the first time on the weekend and all I can say is wow, what a CRAPPY job all around in terms of design, route, quality of roadway and everything else. Uneven surfaces, needless poorly aligned curves, mix and match asphalt and concrete, barricaded roadways dead-ending onto Centreport everywhere. Ill thought out project at the expense of more important transportation infrastructure throughout the capital region.

Centreport Way + speNDP = Cluterfuck + boondoggle x 10

PS Maybe it's about time contractors outside Manitoba and Canada get to bid on road construction projects in Manitoba if Centreport is any indication of the quality of work from Manitoba companies.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by rrskylar

Drove on Centreport Way for the first time on the weekend and all I can say is wow, what a CRAPPY job all around in terms of design, route, quality of roadway and everything else. Uneven surfaces, needless poorly aligned curves, mix and match asphalt and concrete, barricaded roadways dead-ending onto Centreport everywhere. Ill thought out project at the expense of more important transportation infrastructure throughout the capital region.

Centreport Way + speNDP = Cluterfuck + boondoggle x 10

PS Maybe it's about time contractors outside Manitoba and Canada get to bid on road construction projects in Manitoba if Centreport is any indication of the quality of work from Manitoba companies.

If you're throwing blame around, the feds had a big hand in this project too. But I agree, the whole thing seems like it was drawn up on a cocktail napkin. Driving it is really weird and unlike other new roads I've driven on... it is somehow not what you would expect from a new expressway.

[Cyro]

Originally Posted by esquire

If you're throwing blame around, the feds had a big hand in this project too. But I agree, the whole thing seems like it was drawn up on a cocktail napkin. Driving it is really weird and unlike other new roads I've driven on... it is somehow not what you would expect from a new expressway.

Well, I haven't driven on this new infrastructure project as of yet. I was going to ask how other posters felt about the final product to get a feel for the general consensus from those in the field and working on projects such as this one.

Sounds like a mess. I guess 2/2 is a start. I appreciate the assessment.

[Kinguni]

Originally Posted by Cyro

Well, I haven't driven on this new infrastructure project as of yet. I was going to ask how other posters felt about the final product to get a feel for the general consensus from those in the field and working on projects such as this one.

Sounds like a mess. I guess 2/2 is a start. I appreciate the assessment.

Sure beats the old way of getting from Portage and the Perimeter to Inkster and Route 90.

[biguc]

Originally Posted by rrskylar

Drove on Centreport Way for the first time on the weekend and all I can say is wow, what a CRAPPY job all around in terms of design, route, quality of roadway and everything else. Uneven surfaces, needless poorly aligned curves, mix and match asphalt and concrete, barricaded roadways dead-ending onto Centreport everywhere. Ill thought out project at the expense of more important transportation infrastructure throughout the capital region.

Centreport Way + speNDP = Cluterfuck + boondoggle x 10

PS Maybe it's about time contractors outside Manitoba and Canada get to bid on road construction projects in Manitoba if Centreport is any indication of the quality of work from Manitoba companies.

Too bad nobody got this piece of crap cancelled to fix pot holes. And look whose riding it is.

[bomberjet]

Definitely a better route for trucking.

But yeah the stupid rail crossing at the north foot of the CP rail overpass? What the hell is that?! I know there is or was plans to relocate the old CN Oak Point line to connect with CP main line further west of the crossing. So that solves that issue. But they probably spent a million bucks on the signals alone for that crossing.

It was known since the beginning there would be signalized intersections, with interchanges planned for future.

Touching on Moray between Portage and CCW. there's a wider right of way through there. But yeah, stupid. Expressway is someones front yard.

[jmt18325]

That rail line almost never gets used.

[Reignman]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

It was known since the beginning there would be signalized intersections, with interchanges planned for future.

True...but aren't you tired of hearing this? I know I am! The same bullshit every time a new roadway or link to a roadway is made. "Planned future grade separated interchange". Undeveloped land is left at intersections all over the perimeter highway, and along city routes like Bishop, Lag, Kenaston and CPT for these "future" interchanges. And more and more just keep getting added. Hello CPT/59 and Kenaston/100! But we are told that at least the land is reserved, as if the powers that be are trying to say "look how smart we are, look how well we can plan". If there was any real political will to see these projects through, why haven't the first ones promised way back started already? It's not like interchanges are getting cheaper to build as the years go by! Are the city and province sitting on their hands waiting for the next "buy one, get one free" interchange sale to come along?

Why can't something here (such as the heavily federally funded CCW) just be done the proper way right from the start?

[Kinguni]

Originally Posted by Reignman

Why can't something here (such as the heavily federally funded CCW) just be done the proper way right from the start?

Because it just isn't done in Winnipeg. This one is pretty good though. It's adequate for now. Usually it's outdated by the time it's built.

[yellowghost]

perhaps in the future, there is will exist a new method of bridge construction which will be more affordable. Until then, accept the reality. If you want true freeways, you might have to relocate to Ontario or Alberta. You will pay more and get more.

[The Jabroni]

Originally Posted by Reignman

True...but aren't you tired of hearing this? I know I am! The same bullshit every time a new roadway or link to a roadway is made. "Planned future grade separated interchange". Undeveloped land is left at intersections all over the perimeter highway, and along city routes like Bishop, Lag, Kenaston and CPT for these "future" interchanges. And more and more just keep getting added. Hello CPT/59 and Kenaston/100! But we are told that at least the land is reserved, as if the powers that be are trying to say "look how smart we are, look how well we can plan". If there was any real political will to see these projects through, why haven't the first ones promised way back started already? It's not like interchanges are getting cheaper to build as the years go by! Are the city and province sitting on their hands waiting for the next "buy one, get one free" interchange sale to come along?

Why can't something here (such as the heavily federally funded CCW) just be done the proper way right from the start?

Yeah, that statement's been played out, time and again, and I too am sick of it.

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by esquire

If you're throwing blame around, the feds had a big hand in this project too. But I agree, the whole thing seems like it was drawn up on a cocktail napkin. Driving it is really weird and unlike other new roads I've driven on... it is somehow not what you would expect from a new expressway.

The trucking industry had a big hand in getting this thing (Centrport Way) built they seem to have way too much clout in this province and it's because of inadequate load restrictions here that most of our provincial roadways are a mess.

Why Inkster couldn't have been twinned to the west perimeter with a new intersection and upgrades to the west perimeter itself instead of building a new overpriced roadway that really only serves the trucking industry was just plain wrong!

[bomberguy]

For fuck sakes the massive potholes have reappeared. Awesome patchwork Winnipeg.

[bomberjet]

The Inkster/101 interchange will be closed at some point (likely not for many years) and a new interchange built to the south. And when the PTH 6 extension goes, Inkster will run directly into that.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

The Inkster/101 interchange will be closed at some point (likely not for many years) and a new interchange built to the south. And when the PTH 6 extension goes, Inkster will run directly into that.

The province just did a major overhaul on the old Inkster/101 overpass a few years ago, so it will probably be decades before it faces decommissioning.

It would have been nice if they had taken the time to fix up the geometry on the ramps too... it has some awkward bends that could have been removed.

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by esquire

That was always the plan... Route 90 was never intended to be part of the inner ring.

Actually when Route 90 was originally proposed it was supposed to be free flowing and part of the inner ring road with Lag. Obviously the usual build the road, upgrade it later approach happened giving us the current mess we have. William Clement was not on the books for a long time and actually subject to much debate before it was even built.

Originally Posted by jmt18325

That rail line almost never gets used.

While that rail line may see minimal usage in the short time CentrePort Way has been open a single train crossing crossed such a traffic issue the police were dispatched to help clear up the mess.

Originally Posted by rrskylar

Why Inkster couldn't have been twinned to the west perimeter with a new intersection and upgrades to the west perimeter itself instead of building a new overpriced roadway that really only serves the trucking industry was just plain wrong!

It is more complicated that just upgrading the roadway. The light at Saskatchewan Ave and the nearby railway crossing needed to be addressed as part of the free flowing Perimeter. Further, the plan is for The Downs and Westport Festival developments to tie into CentrePort Way. Also there has long been a high speed Headingly by-pass on the books to address the dangerous stretch of the Trans Canada Highway. Finally, the existing Inkster overpass did not have room for two extra lanes of traffic making its upgrade cost higher than a straight new build. That does not even get into the fact that the industrial park that is CentrePort would still have needed roadways built.

Originally Posted by bomberjet

The Inkster/101 interchange will be closed at some point (likely not for many years) and a new interchange built to the south. And when the PTH 6 extension goes, Inkster will run directly into that.

I thought the plan was to connect PTH 6 with Sturgeon Rd. It is also unlikely that Inkster/101 will ever be completely removed, rather it will change from a major access point to more of a local access to the Perimeter servicing that corner of CentrePort and Rosser.

[Komatiite]

Originally Posted by CoryB

Actually when Route 90 was originally proposed it was supposed to be free flowing and part of the inner ring road with Lag. Obviously the usual build the road, upgrade it later approach happened giving us the current mess we have. William Clement was not on the books for a long time and actually subject to much debate before it was even built.

Locals may disagree, but as an out-of-towner, this makes the best sense to me considering the location of the airport entrance.

[bomberjet]

From what I remember, it was going to be loosely something like this. Just not going through the ball fields and the like.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by CoryB

Actually when Route 90 was originally proposed it was supposed to be free flowing and part of the inner ring road with Lag. Obviously the usual build the road, upgrade it later approach happened giving us the current mess we have. William Clement was not on the books for a long time and actually subject to much debate before it was even built.

Route 90 was never really "originally proposed"... unlike Lagimodiere or Bishop Grandin, it wasn't built from scratch and was originally just a bunch of city streets cobbled together... Oak Point, King Edward, Century, Kenaston.

The plan was always to extend Bishop Grandin west and eventually connect with the William Clement Parkway. Route 90 such as it is has always been a stand-in for that mostly unbuilt route. Clement (aka Charleswood Parkway) has been in the official plans for decades.

Here's a map that shows you the route... you can see it in the lower left hand corner. You can also see how screwed up the whole thing is between Portage and CCW because Moray is essentially a quiet residential street now.