Winnipeg | 300 Main St.- Phase II / 360 Main St. | ~142M | 465 Ft | 42F | U/C

[TRiToNDREyJA]

I guess the fact there's a model of this on the 3d warehouse now counts as news

This sucker really grew on me.

Aside from that, is anyone here familiar with how an apartment project materializes? There aren't any "direct" sales targets to meet so... how does something like this go forward?

[bomberjet]

Basically they start construction once all the funding and design are a go. Funding is different than condos, youre right. No presales.

[TRiToNDREyJA]

ahh. So if Artis is logical about the way they handle this, it'll most likely move forward i presume. That's satisfying to know that an apartment tower is nowhere near as conditional as an office or condo tower.

[robertocarlos]

Construction starts in February.

[TRiToNDREyJA]

Originally Posted by robertocarlos

Construction starts in February.

Do you have a source? Or is this common knowledge already. I haven't been checking up on the details of 300 main much

[Flatland Metropolis]

Originally Posted by TRiToNDREyJA

Do you have a source? Or is this common knowledge already. I haven't been checking up on the details of 300 main much

It was their self-declared date, remains to be seen whether it can be met.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manito...ipeg-1.3524897

[Wolf13]

Originally Posted by TRiToNDREyJA

I guess the fact there's a model of this on the 3d warehouse now counts as news

This sucker really grew on me.

Aside from that, is anyone here familiar with how an apartment project materializes? There aren't any "direct" sales targets to meet so... how does something like this go forward?

It is both easier and harder to launch an apartment project... one one hand, provided you have the money and the permission, you can just build. Obviously that is unwise without strong info and market forces playing in your favour, but getting started (and getting money from the bank) is a more subjective factor. Problem is, without something like a pre-sale target, it might be hard to convince lenders that the project is that viable in a weaker (or misunderstood) market like Winnipeg. In this case, Artis has enough money to bypass the bank if needed.

However, their due dilligence must be accurate and be reflected in leasing once the building is complete. Artis can look like fools if for whatever reason this tanks (I don't believe that to be the case at all).

Condos are more difficult to get going for sure, but if you hit your pre-sale target, that's a HUGE amount of security that an apartment project and associated due dilligence cannot promise you. Not to mention bank money.

This also contributes to why we've heard so much about SkyCity and so little about 300 Main... SkiCity NEEDS the public's awareness to generate pre-sales. Meanwhile, Apt owners WANT to generate public interest without giving too much away... Heritage landing at 300 Assiniboine only recently released their pricing, for example... you don't want to spend 1-2 years telling all your competitors exactly what you're doing and at what price. You want to give the public the info they need, like layouts and amenities, but don't want to hand your formula to other projects that may be quietly waiting to pull the trigger.

Originally Posted by TRiToNDREyJA

Do you have a source? Or is this common knowledge already. I haven't been checking up on the details of 300 main much

Pretty much common knowledge.

February is a good time to start, because it allows crews to setup right before it gets warmer. Ideally you have momentum and productivity on site so that anything that would need heating and hoarding is in full swing right as Spring arrives and you now don't need to pay heating/hoarding costs.

[WhipperSnapper]

Originally Posted by Wolf13

In this case, Artis has enough money to bypass the bank if needed.

What does this mean?

Artis manages a REIT. The money still needs to be raise and, at the same time, convince existing shareholders that diversifying into residential is a good idea.

[CoryB]

I wonder if the 300 Main St project will convert, at least partially, from apartments to condos before initial occupancy even occurs.

[bomberjet]

Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper

What does this mean?

Artis manages a REIT. The money still needs to be raise and, at the same time, convince existing shareholders that diversifying into residential is a good idea.

I think the REIT would've determined investors were interested in a residential tower prior to the announcement. So they would've already had that part of the issues resolved before proceeding with anything else. The study on whether or not residential is profitable would've come during that phase of the project. So I would assume that as of now funding is secured. That makes everything else easy. Basically down to an architecture and engineering process.

[1ajs]

Real estate investment trust condos dont do allot for them apartments are a constant cashflow

[Wolf13]

Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper

What does this mean?

Artis IS a REIT. The money still needs to be raise and, at the same time, convince existing shareholders that diversifying into residential is a good idea.

minor correction bolded...

The REIT declared in the press conference that they have the cash.

In this economy, REIT's are bolstering their balance sheets as uncertainty shakes up the market, in particular resources in the west and manufacturing in the east. In a better economy, Artis may not have simply had the cash sitting around, but also would have had a very easy time raising the money. So no issues.

These days, they've probably been sitting on cash already. Maybe they'll raise more, likely to bolster the void left by the cost of construction, but the cash is probably (as they said themselves) in place to move ahead.

Lastly, this announcement would not have proceeded without board approval. I'm sure investors have had their questions, but in the REIT world, the mid/larger REITS have pretty much all claimed that mixed use hybrids with retail and/or office anchored by a residential tower are the best way to move forward.

Ultimately, this isn't that crazy of a move... it may seem crazy for Winnipeg, but then we factor in the existing foundations, infrastructure, services, parking and business population and it looks quite clever.

[Wolf13]

Originally Posted by CoryB

I wonder if the 300 Main St project will convert, at least partially, from apartments to condos before initial occupancy even occurs.

REIT's can't own condos... furthermore, the dark cloud hovering over Winnipeg's current state of "overbuilding" (somewhat exaggerated) refers to specifically condos rather than apartments. Apartment vacancies in Winnipeg are well below the threshold of concern still.

Basically, Artis would be going out of its own way to do something they're not allowed that also happens to be riskier financially.

[USA]

Cladding was coming off 3rd (?) Floor of 360 Main tonight on my commute home on Fort St. bicycle lane. Hopefully it doesn't take long now!

[bomberjet]

^I noticed yestetday on the bus it was up to the 4th floor ish; on the southwest side of the trimmed, offset square thingy side of the building.

[buzzg]

Originally Posted by USA

Cladding was coming off 3rd (?) Floor of 360 Main tonight on my commute home on Fort St. bicycle lane. Hopefully it doesn't take long now!

I'm pretty sure they said it would take 2 years.

[Biff]

Originally Posted by buzzg

I'm pretty sure they said it would take 2 years.

Yes, the south side will be complete this year and the north side will be done in 2017. The building will look rather strange for a time when it is half black and half beige.

[bomberjet]

Apparently 330 St Mary will only be getting 3 sides completed this year, with the fourth next year. Two buildings with two faces. The many faced god.

[Cyro]

Originally Posted by Biff

Yes, the south side will be complete this year and the north side will be done in 2017. The building will look rather strange for a time when it is half black and half beige.

Yes on that timetable, 300 Main will begin construction as the re-clad is being completed..

[Cyro]

Photo by: Winnipeg Grump