GTA Transit Thread

[Dr Nevergold]

Originally Posted by 333609543

The subway focus should be downtown, not extending northward/eastward/westward.

+1

In terms of Finch LRT, where is the funding? I am not opposed to Finch getting LRT, but again where is the funding? Finch LRT actually is LRT done the right way: a smaller, local transit option to get people to the Spadina and Yonge subway lines and GO commuter rail. This is exactly what LRT is designed for. Its a fantastic project to get people in northwest Toronto to the TTC subway lines and to enhance local transit needs.

However, a DRL subway should become first priority well ahead of Finch LRT.

[Innsertnamehere]

funding is coming from the same pot as the Eglinton LRT, Sheppard LRT, and the provincial portion of the Scarborough subway, and that is debt financing.

[Dr Nevergold]

I'm not sure I've heard of reports that show Finch LRT funding is there after the changes that have occurred in the past few years, so if you have any news I'm open to reading.

[333609543]

I like the LRT plan, but what about on-street traffic? When the St. Clair west streetcar tracks were being replaced, it caused such major delays, and now that it's has reserved lanes in the centre of the street, that was a good idea for the streetcars, but not the cars on the street. I'm afraid what will happen to Finch, Sheppard, and Eglinton, is that with the on-grade portions of the lines, it will cause gridlock similar to the Don Valley Parking Lot. I believe the LRT shouldn't be on the street, it would cost too much, plus it's a huge inconvenience for travelers. But like I said in an earlier post, go downtown or go home.

About the DRL situation...

I really liked the Spadina extension at first, but then I realized how the funding could've been used for a DRL that would've been completed by at most 2016.

[DrNest]

Gridlock is the main concern for me regarding above grade LRT. In my opinion, the only way forward is subway. I confess to not fully being aware to the funding matters, but in terms of transportation practicality, having the lines constructed underground is the way forward.

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by DrNest

Gridlock is the main concern for me regarding above grade LRT. In my opinion, the only way forward is subway. I confess to not fully being aware to the funding matters, but in terms of transportation practicality, having the lines constructed underground is the way forward.

Agree... especially in country with a cold winter like Canada.

[Innsertnamehere]

The LRT was going to have heated stations.. (at least the SRT) it was essentially going to be an aboveground metro line using LRT vehicles. Besides, winter in Toronto isn't as bad as many make it out to be.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by DrNest

Gridlock is the main concern for me regarding above grade LRT. In my opinion, the only way forward is subway. I confess to not fully being aware to the funding matters, but in terms of transportation practicality, having the lines constructed underground is the way forward.

How so? how would they cause it? they would have the exact same setup as the bus lanes that just opened. the street would be widened (as there is space to do so unlike St. Clair) and the LRT would be put down the middle. no car lanes gone, and a huge increase in transit capacity and speed.

Another thing people tend to forget about LRT is that they act as more than a way for getting people around. they also act as helping non-choice riders (read: poor people) get around much faster. Many people serving you lunch in the downtown food courts have hour+ long commutes from the corner of etobicoke or scarborough and to them the LRT could shave off half the trip. (the LRT does ride right through Jane & Finch after all) If you were to transfer that money to subways, you would be getting more choice riders and it would be shaving less time off of these peoples commutes.

In the end you have to build what makes sense. For scarborough, it could go either way. For King street (or whatever street that it chosen for the DRL), it is subway. for Finch, it is LRT.

[Dr Nevergold]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

For scarborough, it could go either way.

Not anymore, now that the Federal government has shown up with such an impressive investment, it is settled. Money controls a great deal of this discussion, and until money shows up its all talk.

[Innsertnamehere]

Yes absolutely, I just mean that the technology doesn't really matter, the line would work just as well with both modes. It just so happens that it will be subway.

[Innsertnamehere]

Scarborough Subway Passes.

[Doady]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

.... sure lets build a metro line that will sit empty. It is possible to run LRTs on the less used portions of the system.. it doesn't have to be subway or nothing. Most cities are building LRT anyways.. (such as Paris)

I never said there should be no LRT for Toronto. LRT for Hurontario makes sense, for example. That's outer suburbia.

LRT for Eglinton, going through inner city Toronto, serving Midtown, and connecting to the Airport and three different subway lines and a grade-separated Mississauga Transitway, along a corridor where the buses currently see a combined average of approximately 78,200 riders per weekday, already higher ridership than most entire LRT systems in North America? That's just insane. Eglinton is not a minor corridor in a minor part of a minor city.

And why bother with on-street rail at all when a grade-separated line can be built cheaply through the Richview corridor and a very large portion of the line has to be underground anyways?

[Ottawa superman]

Originally Posted by Doady

I never said there should be no LRT for Toronto. LRT for Hurontario makes sense, for example. That's outer suburbia.

LRT for Eglinton, going through inner city Toronto, serving Midtown, and connecting to the Airport and three different subway lines and a grade-separated Mississauga Transitway, along a corridor where the buses currently see a combined average of approximately 78,200 riders per weekday, already higher ridership than most entire LRT systems in North America? That's just insane. Eglinton is not a minor corridor in a minor part of a minor city.

And why bother with on-street rail at all when a grade-separated line can be built cheaply through the Richview corridor and a very large portion of the line has to be underground anyways?

Key word: Inner city Toronto.

[Ottawa superman]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

Scarborough Subway Passes.

Well congratulations, Mr. Mayor. The subway you proposed cost more than the Gravy train you stopped. How ironic. Him and Denzil Minnan Wong, good job.

[333609543]

Originally Posted by Ottawa superman

Well congratulations, Mr. Mayor. The subway you proposed cost more than the Gravy train you stopped. How ironic. Him and Denzil Minnan Wong, good job.

I look forward to new subway, anywhere, but I really dislike that they aren't focusing downtown, I had to wait 3 trains to actually get on one. This is unnecessary, at least extend the Sheppard line to Scarborough instead of Bloor-Danforth. That line should go to Rouge Hill GO. Or not be extended at all! Instead of the Heavy rail (SRT) in Scarborough, they should've put a subway there from the start! Transit City cost less than the Scarborough subway? Wow, Ford is really F*cked up.

[miketoronto]

One thing people have to remember in the whole subway debate, is that the old City of Toronto and the political leaders of the time are mostly responsible for us having almost no new subway construction in the inner city.

The TTC had plans for the relief line to open in 2011. The City of Toronto at the time and the NDP did not want a new subway in the downtown area, because they wanted to try and stop downtown growth, and push development to the suburbs.

[Doady]

Originally Posted by Ottawa superman

Key word: Inner city Toronto.

Yes, that was my point... I even bolded it in the post, to point out that it is key word exactly as you have.

But yes thanks for pointing to me that's a key word. That was very helpful to me. You have opened my eyes. I am truly grateful.

[miketoronto]

Why should it only be inner city Toronto? Toronto's transit success has come from us expanding all kinds of transit both in the inner city and suburbs.

Whether you want to admit or not, Toronto's post war ridership success has very little to do with the inner city, and much to do with the fact we built viable transit in the suburbs, and got suburbanites to use transit more than their counterparts in any other North American city.

Expansion is needed everywhere.

[333609543]

Originally Posted by miketoronto

Why should it only be inner city Toronto? Toronto's transit success has come from us expanding all kinds of transit both in the inner city and suburbs.

Whether you want to admit or not, Toronto's post war ridership success has very little to do with the inner city, and much to do with the fact we built viable transit in the suburbs, and got suburbanites to use transit more than their counterparts in any other North American city.
Expansion is needed everywhere.

This is true. Although the focus should be in the core of the city.

[Doady]

Originally Posted by miketoronto

Why should it only be inner city Toronto? Toronto's transit success has come from us expanding all kinds of transit both in the inner city and suburbs.

Whether you want to admit or not, Toronto's post war ridership success has very little to do with the inner city, and much to do with the fact we built viable transit in the suburbs, and got suburbanites to use transit more than their counterparts in any other North American city.

Expansion is needed everywhere.

Who are you responding too? Who said that transit expansion should only be in inner city Toronto?