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  #5541  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2015, 5:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Patrick S View Post
Some good news for the local economy. Tucson's economy is expected to see job increases increase from 0.5% last year, to 0.9% this year, and 1.6% next year (2016). By 2017, Tucson's economy should be growing faster than the national average.

Economists Forecasts Strong Growth
It's about time. These past few years really concerned me. I felt like our city was dying.
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  #5542  
Old Posted Jul 27, 2015, 7:37 AM
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It's about time. These past few years really concerned me. I felt like our city was dying.
Tucson has been dead for decades. It's just crawling itself out from the grave. The good news is that building five floor buildings has become more acceptable by a growing number among that 'keep Tucson shitty' contingency.

I'd declare Tucson alive after it builds several 'Fingers' ( high rises ) , finishes a real crosstown freeway and stop identifying a butt ugly 50 year old rundown house or building 'historic'. Tucson has a long way to go!
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  #5543  
Old Posted Jul 28, 2015, 12:07 AM
InTheBurbs InTheBurbs is offline
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United Airlines announces non-stop Chicago O'Hare service from TIA

According to KGUN9...

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United Airlines has announced it is adding a daily nonstop flight from Tucson International Airport to Chicago O'Hare International Airport from December 17 through April 4, 2016.

SkyWest Airlines will operate the United Express flights using E175 aircraft, which are configured with 12 seats in United First, 16 Economy Plus seats and 48 seats in Economy.
I think Tucson had to be about the biggest city in the country without non-stop United service to Chicago. They used to have 2 or 3 flights a day on 737s or MDs before they cut back. Too bad it's for the winter season only, but maybe if the demand is there they may decide to keep it around.

Last edited by InTheBurbs; Jul 28, 2015 at 4:24 AM.
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  #5544  
Old Posted Jul 30, 2015, 6:08 PM
Azstar Azstar is offline
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I think Tucson had to be about the biggest city in the country without non-stop United service to Chicago. They used to have 2 or 3 flights a day on 737s or MDs before they cut back. Too bad it's for the winter season only, but maybe if the demand is there they may decide to keep it around.

There's a reason for it. United is simply the worst major airline in the U.S. today. When I worked for them at Tucson Airport they had 24 regional jet flights a day. Now they have 7.

There were multiple days back then when every single flight, all 24, were delayed over an hour, or cancelled. Some were delayed as much as six hours. I think almost all the high mileage frequent fliers left for other airlines.

Their reputation is in the toilet at many airports, and particularly in Tucson.
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  #5545  
Old Posted Jul 31, 2015, 11:57 PM
Patrick S Patrick S is offline
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Originally Posted by farmerk View Post
Tucson has been dead for decades. It's just crawling itself out from the grave. The good news is that building five floor buildings has become more acceptable by a growing number among that 'keep Tucson shitty' contingency.

I'd declare Tucson alive after it builds several 'Fingers' ( high rises ) , finishes a real crosstown freeway and stop identifying a butt ugly 50 year old rundown house or building 'historic'. Tucson has a long way to go!
If that's you're measure, Tucson will most likely never be alive. I've only lived here less than 7 years, but I don't see Tucson as dead, or as dying. I see a city that had grown at a high rate for a while and now it finds itself adjusting to the new norm of post-Great Recession life. It hasn't been dying the past few years, it's simply been changing and metamorphosing. Due to this, and of course the streetcar, downtown has been completely rejuvenated. We are starting to see infill in midtown and the east side, and new growth on the edges of the city.
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  #5546  
Old Posted Aug 1, 2015, 8:47 PM
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Tucson may not be dying, but it's not thriving to the extent that it could, or should. Tucson is a regressive place. Development projects that might take a year or two in most places take 10 years here because there is so much opposition to everything. The "keep Tucson shitty" delegation is active and vociferous, and the inept city council members have demonstrated that they care only about their narrow political fiefdoms at the expense of the overall city. There's a reason Tucson is 147 out of 150 cities for future employment potential. The council has sent the message loudly and clearly that business is generally not welcome here. While the city council has given themselves much credit for the "revitalization" of downtown, it's happened in spite of them, not because of them.
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  #5547  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2015, 7:33 PM
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Amen to that, Azstar. Tucson has been in a 'depleted' state for a very long time that any slight growth spurt is considered high growth.

Yes, it doesn't take overnight to re-build Tucson but then again, it's ridiculous to wait every 10 years to see any major project to come to fruition.

Several Fingers downtown and a crosstown freeway should put a stake at the heart of that hateful delusional 'keep Tucson shitty' virus.
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  #5548  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2015, 7:57 PM
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southtucsonboy77 southtucsonboy77 is offline
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On the positive, there was an article in the Star that suggested there wasn't any negative feedback from the "interests" groups, specifically the transit riders group and the neighborhoods. I also reviewed the comments submitted at the presentation meeting and the questions/feedback were pretty logical and productive. Of course there was 1 comment that stated the Peach proposal was "too tall" for no reason.

I know we share a lot of thoughts, ideas, and criticism about Tucson and downtown...so I hope you all submitted your comments on the Ronstadt project.
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  #5549  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2015, 4:26 PM
Azstar Azstar is offline
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I realize Tucson can't compete on the same level as Phoenix, but there is a pretty big discrepancy between the two. Part of the problem, I believe, is the obstructionist city council which does much more to discourage business and job creation than encourage it.

Phoenix economy growing at 2.9%, Tucson lagging at 1.0%
https://realestatedaily-news.com/pho...n-lagging-1-0/
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  #5550  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2015, 8:45 PM
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southtucsonboy77 southtucsonboy77 is offline
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I realize Tucson can't compete on the same level as Phoenix, but there is a pretty big discrepancy between the two. Part of the problem, I believe, is the obstructionist city council which does much more to discourage business and job creation than encourage it.

Phoenix economy growing at 2.9%, Tucson lagging at 1.0%
https://realestatedaily-news.com/pho...n-lagging-1-0/
Phoenix is a mayoral-run city...Tucson is a Council-run city. The Council-system doesn't work and City voters have rejected the mayoral-run system. The Council is just a reflection of the people they represent. We keep saying "the Council this, the Council that...", yet no one votes for a change of the system. You can change the people in Council, but they'll be stuck with the same rules of engagement.
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  #5551  
Old Posted Aug 3, 2015, 9:04 PM
Qwijib0 Qwijib0 is offline
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Originally Posted by farmerk View Post
Amen to that, Azstar. Tucson has been in a 'depleted' state for a very long time that any slight growth spurt is considered high growth.

Yes, it doesn't take overnight to re-build Tucson but then again, it's ridiculous to wait every 10 years to see any major project to come to fruition.

Several Fingers downtown and a crosstown freeway should put a stake at the heart of that hateful delusional 'keep Tucson shitty' virus.
A crosstown freeway is not happening at this point-- the costs financially and socially are not worth it. I'm with you on density though. The results of the Jarett Walker workshop seemed to bring people together on the need for better-optimized transit and future high-capacity corridors. PAG has it on their website : https://www.pagnet.org/documents/tra...-23-Report.pdf

Some sort of frequent transit down Broadway would encourage more density.
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  #5552  
Old Posted Aug 4, 2015, 1:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Qwijib0 View Post
A crosstown freeway is not happening at this point-- the costs financially and socially are not worth it. I'm with you on density though. The results of the Jarett Walker workshop seemed to bring people together on the need for better-optimized transit and future high-capacity corridors. PAG has it on their website : https://www.pagnet.org/documents/tra...-23-Report.pdf

Some sort of frequent transit down Broadway would encourage more density.
Whenever a crosstown freeway is proposed in Tucson ( even in Phoenix back in the day ) , cost always comes up....it's too expensive...always. It's costing more to expand Tucson's main roads. If Tucson had a crosstown freeway way back decades ago, Tucson doesn't have to deal with expanding our main roads. Tucson has crosstown freeways with stop lights. That's were Tucson is headed, ten lane Oracle rd freeway.

Problem with Tucson is the lack of diversity in everything. Does every part of Tucson have to be a suburb? High rises downtown. Mid rises at midtown. Crosstown freeway cut in the middle. Light rail all over Tucson, I'm all for it. More bike lanes than what we have now, super. More buses, excellent. But some people do like to drive, crosstown freeway.

City of Tucson is moving in the right direction but it's still freakin slow. Let's start with getting rid of those local developers downtown who made promises they can't keep...10 years ago...this includes Peach.

Here's a positive : Tucson will finally have a transportation hub.
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  #5553  
Old Posted Aug 4, 2015, 2:54 PM
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You will get your cross town freeway, just not where you want it.

http://www.mccain.senate.gov/public/...2-94e2e4525f6f

My take on the crosstown freeway debate is this: Why should my tax dollars be spent on building a freeway to you? Why not make incentives that encourage more dense development closer to existing infrastructure? Sell your city edge subdivision home and move closer to the city core.

If you bought out on the far East side, nowhere close to I-10 or other high capacity transit then complain about a lack of infrastructure, you are the problem.
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  #5554  
Old Posted Aug 4, 2015, 4:34 PM
Azstar Azstar is offline
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Originally Posted by crzyabe View Post
You will get your cross town freeway, just not where you want it.

http://www.mccain.senate.gov/public/...2-94e2e4525f6f

My take on the crosstown freeway debate is this: Why should my tax dollars be spent on building a freeway to you? Why not make incentives that encourage more dense development closer to existing infrastructure? Sell your city edge subdivision home and move closer to the city core.

If you bought out on the far East side, nowhere close to I-10 or other high capacity transit then complain about a lack of infrastructure, you are the problem.
I agree. Every economic indicator suggests denser urban core and less urban sprawl, yet inner city properties languish and development outward just continues to spread. So, if you live in Vail or the fringes of Marana, don't complain about lack of transportation options. 1/3 of the City of Tucson is vacant land. Most of the vacant lots downtown are owned by the City, or County, and they sit idle and empty generating no revenue, either in sales taxes or actual sales yet they have not been marketed to anyone for development. In my view, City and County politicians just don't get it.
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  #5555  
Old Posted Aug 4, 2015, 5:30 PM
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Tucson could be a magical place but cars really fuck it up. The easier you make it to drive the more embedded the suburban, drive-everywhere paradigm becomes. At some point, the modest gains you see downtown are just a bit of lipstick on the sprawl pig. There's no need for vertical in a city as relentlessly horizontal as this car town.

Phoenix may as well be Lubbock on steroids with its postage-stamp downtown and endless sprawl. Tucson can do better. Foster real urban values, not more suburban dreariness. The most compelling aspects of Tucson are its high-Sonoran desert, the mountains, the university, the historic buildings, and the few hippies/artisans who find ways to make the city interesting. Suburbanites do not make anything interesting. Why would you want Tucson to become South Mesa? It would be complete shit.
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  #5556  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2015, 3:31 AM
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Road deal paves way for long-stalled Rocking K housing development

Groundbreaking is a little closer for a master-planned development on the far southeast side that has been decades in the making.

The Tucson City Council in June agreed to de-annex a portion of East Valencia Road east of South Houghton Road to allow developers of the Rocking K project, Diamond Ventures, to construct a more than 2 ½-mile section of the road to Old Spanish Trail in agreement for credits on impact fees.

The road now lies within the city and county. By placing it under county jurisdiction, Diamond Ventures could receive reimbursement for constructing the road from the impact fees the development would generate. Construction of the roadway is estimated at $13.6 million.

“The county cannot use its impact fees on streets and highways that are not the responsibility of the county,” Pima County Administrator Chuck Huckelberry said.

The Rocking K plan has undergone changes since first conceived in the 1980s. The most recent amendments to the plan in 2011 scaled back the development to 3,000 houses and a golf course on 5,600 acres. Earlier plans called for 10,000 houses and four golf courses in the community that borders Saguaro National Park.

Commercial development is also planned for part of the property.

The amended plan also included the impact fee reimbursement agreement.

“They are the ones at risk here,” Huckelberry said, adding the company would not be reimbursed if they don’t build enough houses that generate the impact fees.

Impact fees for single-family residential properties cost about $6,000 per unit, Huckelberry said.

The de-annexation was necessary because the city has already allocated its collected impact fees for the southeast region to Houghton Road improvements, he said.

Impact fees must be used within a jurisdiction in the region they are collected.

By placing the entire roadway project in the county’s jurisdiction, the developer can offset the costs through future impact fee credits.

It should take the county about two months for its process to accept the de-annexed areas.

Huckelberry said he did not know when construction is to begin. Diamond Ventures did not return calls for comment.

The possible start of construction comes at a time when county officials anticipate the far southeast side is primed for intense growth and development.

Rocking K stands just a few miles from the University of Arizona Tech Park and a proposed new connection between the interstates.

National and regional government officials have pushed for federal funding for a connection between interstates 10 and 19 south of Tucson International Airport.

In June, members of Arizona’s congressional delegation sponsored a bill that would include the proposed highway, the Sonoran Corridor, on federal planning documents. The move would make the corridor eligible for federal funding.

The county also has committed to use $30 million toward construction of the Sonoran Corridor from a future bond package. Voters will decide the fate of that and six other bond questions in November.

The proposed Sonoran Corridor sits near a convergence of surface, rail and air transportation systems. It also would connect employment centers like Raytheon and other airport area businesses with the University of Arizona Tech Park near I-10 and Rita Road.

Regional leaders see the proposed highway as a way to facilitate the growth of defense, aerospace and logistics businesses such as HomeGoods, which recently announced plans to build a regional distribution center near the airport.

“The Sonoran Corridor is really a jobs corridor but you really have to have housing in proximity,” Huckelberry said.

The proposed highway also runs past another planned Diamond Ventures’ development, Swan Southlands, that sits on 3,100 acres southeast of the airport.

The Sonoran Corridor would run near the northern and western edges of the development.

The move to jump-start the Rocking K development could signify a rebound in the housing economy.

“I definitely think that the south and southeast are going to be the future growth areas,” said David Godlewski, president of the Southern Arizona Home Builders Association.

As of the end of June, the county has seen about 370 permits for new single-family residential homes, a pace that would reach about 740 by year’s end.

That’s considerably less than the recent boom years. In 2005, the county issued nearly 5,000 new housing permits.

By 2011, new home construction had nearly ceased, with fewer than 500 permits issued.

Godlewski said the economy has begun to recover for the home construction industry, albeit slowly.

The recent sale of 195 lots in the master planned community La Estancia in the city near I-10 and Wilmot was another indication the local economy has started to rebound, Godlewski said.

La Estancia is a 565-acre, 2,500-home master planned proposal.

“When you look at quality homes adjacent to the job corridor,” Huckelberry said, “it’s pretty attractive.”
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  #5557  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2015, 2:55 PM
azliam azliam is online now
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Originally Posted by soleri View Post
Tucson could be a magical place but cars really fuck it up. The easier you make it to drive the more embedded the suburban, drive-everywhere paradigm becomes. At some point, the modest gains you see downtown are just a bit of lipstick on the sprawl pig. There's no need for vertical in a city as relentlessly horizontal as this car town.

Phoenix may as well be Lubbock on steroids with its postage-stamp downtown and endless sprawl. Tucson can do better. Foster real urban values, not more suburban dreariness. The most compelling aspects of Tucson are its high-Sonoran desert, the mountains, the university, the historic buildings, and the few hippies/artisans who find ways to make the city interesting. Suburbanites do not make anything interesting. Why would you want Tucson to become South Mesa? It would be complete shit.
Cars haven't fucked up Tucson, the city council and NIMBYs (historically) have. Furthermore, most cities/metros the size of Tucson have more freeway miles than Tucson. In addition, every metro sprawls and has cars and there are quite a few worse offenders than Phoenix. The problem with Tucson is that it tries too hard to "not be" Phoenix rather than creating an identity of its own. Sure, we want instant, walkable, dense cores, but be happy that both of these cities have/are making efforts to improve their downtown areas and have recognized the importance of this.
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  #5558  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2015, 2:57 PM
Azstar Azstar is offline
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Rocking K Housing Development Road Deal


This is exactly the problem both Phoenix and Tucson face, but it's more apparent in Tucson. The city & county have made absolutely no effort accommodating any potential development on land within the city limits, but they kowtow to development interests that encourage and promote urban sprawl.

Last edited by Azstar; Aug 5, 2015 at 3:09 PM.
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  #5559  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2015, 3:41 PM
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This talk about cars ruining Tucson...yeah, I tend to think that's a straw man argument. There isn't a shred of evidence that Tucson exceeds any averages in # of cars per capita (or similar metric) and I would definitely bet the farm that Tucson is at or near dead last in freeway miles per capita. I'm not suggesting freeways are the answer at all but I still am not persuaded that a long-term transportation plan that is largely dependent upon in-fill projects and getting people closer to the urban core *does not* require a cross-town unobstructed arterial. The cost-benefit analysis...well, I don't think anyone knows what that outcome might be. But provided it's not prohibitively expensive, it makes sense to me to bridge downtown/UofA area to the east side as the east side is naturally bounded by mountains and can't keep expanding. It's a quality of life and smog-reduction solution that WOULD encourage in-fill along the (many) open areas within a 2-3 mile north/south vicinity of such a road. Does anyone want Tucson to become like Phoenix? No. Is it even remotely possible WITH a cross-town freeway? No. It's, again, a straw man element to the rhetoric that needs to be dropped. Tucson's goal should be to become the "Portland Small" or "Austin Small" of the nation. Long-term equilibrium population for the metro will likely be 1.3-1.5 million by 2050 and it's a question of quality of life and prosperity and I just don't see how a comprehensive transportation plan doesn't include some element of unimpeded movement east and west.
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  #5560  
Old Posted Aug 5, 2015, 4:18 PM
Ted Lyons Ted Lyons is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soleri View Post
Tucson could be a magical place but cars really fuck it up. The easier you make it to drive the more embedded the suburban, drive-everywhere paradigm becomes. At some point, the modest gains you see downtown are just a bit of lipstick on the sprawl pig. There's no need for vertical in a city as relentlessly horizontal as this car town.

Phoenix may as well be Lubbock on steroids with its postage-stamp downtown and endless sprawl. Tucson can do better. Foster real urban values, not more suburban dreariness. The most compelling aspects of Tucson are its high-Sonoran desert, the mountains, the university, the historic buildings, and the few hippies/artisans who find ways to make the city interesting. Suburbanites do not make anything interesting. Why would you want Tucson to become South Mesa? It would be complete shit.
And here come the Defenders of Phoenix®.
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