Old Cathedral High School Building (1840 Grant St.) Photos - Historic or Not?

[bunt_q]

Did a flyby this weekend of the old Cathedral High School building that Sagebrush Capital is proposing to demolish and replace with a condo building, as reported here: http://www.denverpost.com/griego/ci_19225279.

Not going to win any photography awards, but enough to discuss the buildings for those not familiar with it. Overkill, I know, but I had a lot of pictures, so why not.



Starting in the alley:









Around the 19th Avenue side:























Shame these guys don't pay rent:



Across the street, same developer, presumably similar to what they would like to put here post-demolition.



The whole thing (bad light):



Now left-to-right:











End of Grant St. - I do love these:



Across the street view:



Reflection:



So, historic or not, that is the question...?

[BG918]

Definitely historic and a unique architectural style that must be preserved. There are literally multiple parking lots around this building where they could build their midrise, including one directly behind to the east and at the opposite corner of 19th & Grant.

[wong21fr]

^Both owned by other development companies with their own plans for the properties.

[bunt_q]

Powerball is looking pretty good - it'd make one heck of a private residence (read: palace).

[Cirrus]

How many other similar structures remain in Denver today?

[Pizzuti]

I vote yes, this is historic, and it's not even a tough call.

Based on the conversations I was seeing I was expecting to see something that looked more like the gymnasium.

[Paulopolis]

I have always admired this building. I hope it is preserved. If the purpose is to redevelop it, why not refurbish the building, adding multiple for-rent condos? Maybe the numbers don't add up, but I sure hope the historic preservation organizations are successful in saving this one.

[PLANSIT]

Yes. Can't believe the developer even thought this was a good idea.

[CPVLIVE]

I replied in the Denver forum so I'll post here as well. Easy call really. The developer thought it was worth a gamble. They hoped no one would notice and because of the church's fire sale they would make a killing - that's all. They can back out of the contract just like the previous developer did when their financing didn't come through (their plan had intended to restore the building).

Originally Posted by wong21fr

I've got faith that the institutions will ultimately work and will look at all the information to determine whether or not this structure is historic. Personally, I think it will end up going the way of the old Duffy's; old, but not special enough that the cost-benefit of razing it is forever tilted towards preservation.

I don't know wong - I think the structure meets the criterion for preservation under the Landmark Ordinance.

1 - History - The site is associated with the Cathedral of the Immaculate Conception as the churchs original rectory was located there as well as the schools. Therefore it has an association with the historical development of Catholicism in Denver. The building is associated with many influential persons - Oscar and Edith Malo, John K. Mullen, Helen Bonfils, Mrs. J.J. (Molly) Brown.

2 - Architecture - It is a significant example of Spanish Renaissance Revival architecture and according to historian Thomas J. Noel it was prize-winning. So somehow, somewhere it was recognized for its design. It was designed in 1921 by Harry J. Manning - a celebrated Denver architect with buildings on the National Historic Register as well as locally. Manning was responsible for many schools in the area - Byers, Fairmont, the Margery Reed Hall and Mary Reed Library at DU. He did the Moffat Mansion, the Capitol Life Building, the Reed Mansion (the city's finest example of Tudor Revival), St. Thomas Episcopal Church, Montview Presbyterian Church, Grant Ave. Methodist, and was involved with the City and County Building.

Some examples of his work -


















3 - Geography - It is a prominent, orienting, visual feature - It has distinctive physical characteristics and is rare - And definitely contributes to what little character is left in that neighborhood.

[bunt_q]

I think this is a close one. I'm sure it's not clear cut. Copying my post from the other thread:

From the Landmark Ordinance:

A structure or district may be designated for preservation, if it meets at least one (1) criterion in two (2) or more of the following three (3) categories:

(1) History. To have historical significance, the structure or district shall be thirty (30) or more years old or have extraordinary importance to the historical development of Denver, and shall:
a. Have direct association with the historical development of the city, state, or nation;
b. Be the site of a significant historic event; or
c. Have direct and substantial association with a person or group of persons who had
influence on society.

(2) Architecture. To have architectural significance, the structure or district shall have design quality and integrity, and shall:
a. Embody distinguishing characteristics of an architectural style or type;
b. Be a significant example of the work of a recognized architect or master builder;
c. Contain elements of architectural design, engineering, materials, craftsmanship, or
artistic merit which represent a significant or influential innovation; or
d. Portray the environment of a group of people or physical development of an area in
an era of history characterized by a distinctive architectural style.

(3) Geography. To have geographical significance, the structure or district shall:
a. Have a prominent location or be an established, familiar, and orienting visual feature
of the contemporary city;
b. Promote understanding and appreciation of the urban environment by means of
distinctive physical characteristics or rarity; or
c. Make a special contribution to Denver’s distinctive character.

I thing an argument can be made for (1)(c) based on its history with the Catholic Church. But that seems like a stretch. Anything else under (1) seems unlikely (although I confess, I really just don't know).

I'm not much more knowledgable on the architecture. It seems an argument can be made for both (2)(a) and (2)(b). It's certainly of a style not common in Denver, but whether it has distinguishing characteristics of a real recognized style, I'd have to do more homework. Same for the architect (although that post above seemed to indicate he was a fellow of some importance).

(3)(b) (and/or) (3)(c) seem like the easiest criteria to meet.

I'd like to get my hands on the actual filings from CPI/Historic Denver/whoever else, see what they're saying.

[bunt_q]

CPV's posted at the same time as me and makes a great case. Not sure it's easy, though.

Tom Noel's comments on the building - were those in the Denver Post article? I'd like to see them. I'd give great weight to his opinion on the history part.

[CPVLIVE]

Tom Noel mentions it in his book, Colorado Catholicism - The Archdiocese of Denver 1857-1989.

There are excerpts that can be found online - just google the school site or catholicism in Denver.

2) b - Is absolutely met - no doubt.

1) c - Have direct and substantial association with a person or group of persons who had influence on society.

Like I previously wrote - The building was associated with some absolute heavyweights in terms of influence in Denver - they financed it. John K. Mullen, Oscar and Edith Malo, Helen Bonfils, and JJ and Molly Brown, Dennis Sheady, the Reeds. These folks wrote chapter after chapter of Denver history - a virtual who's who of early Denver society. They also happened to be some of Denver's wealthiest citizens in real terms - ever.

[roundgrandma]

I am a 1966 CHS alumnus and remember taking my first piano lessons, in the convent, at the bay window, at 6 years old. I have many wonderful and funny memories of classes, teachers, interactions between students and teachers. This is such a beautiful structure and I pray it will not be demolished. It served as an arts school, I believe, decades ago, after closing. There was an old apartment building, across E 18th Ave, and I can still 'hear' a resident playing "Lady of Spain", daily, after lunch, while we sat in the biology lab (stair-step classroom). Once, a student wrote "requests?" on a sheet of paper and held it up to the window. The resident closed their window and pulled down the shade. I'm guessing the message wasn't appreciated. You can't go home, again, but this one shouldn't be destroyed.

[CherryCreek]

Originally Posted by roundgrandma

I am a 1966 CHS alumnus and remember taking my first piano lessons, in the convent, at the bay window, at 6 years old. I have many wonderful and funny memories of classes, teachers, interactions between students and teachers. This is such a beautiful structure and I pray it will not be demolished. It served as an arts school, I believe, decades ago, after closing. There was an old apartment building, across E 18th Ave, and I can still 'hear' a resident playing "Lady of Spain", daily, after lunch, while we sat in the biology lab (stair-step classroom). Once, a student wrote "requests?" on a sheet of paper and held it up to the window. The resident closed their window and pulled down the shade. I'm guessing the message wasn't appreciated. You can't go home, again, but this one shouldn't be destroyed.

Great story. Sounds like it might get turned into a botique hotel! Nice re-use, if thats what happens.

[Liberty Wellsian]

In Salt Lake the developer would have burnt it to the ground.

[transistor]

Originally Posted by Liberty Wellsian

In Salt Lake the developer would have burnt it to the ground.

The Mormons have grown more and more brash as of late.

[TakeFive]

Wish I had the knowledge of CPVLIVE... make that half the knowledge. In any case I'm always for preservation.

I assumed that Sagebrush had a contingent contract. What's concerning is that there hasn't been anyone with a sense of civic pride that has stepped forward with a more interesting proposal.

roundgrandma... Yes, that's a fun and fascinating story.

[CastleScott]

Save at all costs as we don't see that kind of stuff in Denver much anymore.