Calgary Construction XXVI

[SteveP]

Originally Posted by Corndogger

It's a type of construction and many of us enjoy the photos. And why does it matter if it's single family housing? The majority of Calgarians live in such housing. Also, no one is complaining about condo tower construction. Let people post everything and self-filter what you don't want to look at.

Exactly.

[Stephen Ave]

Originally Posted by Corndogger

No, it's proof that some of the worst posters who claimed to have left this place have been lurking all along. They got pissed off at what happened yesterday and now are lashing out. It's like the old days except now they're even more immature.

It’s true I do come and look on the site from time to time. Solely for the entertainment. It’s kind of like the Jerry Springer show, you don’t really want to watch it but it is really entertaining.

Anyhow I won’t take up any more of your time. Today’s posts are my final posts here, I just wanted to have a bit of fun and go out with a bang.

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by Stephen Ave

It’s true I do come and look on the site from time to time. Solely for the entertainment. It’s kind of like the Jerry Springer show, you don’t really want to watch it but it is really entertaining.

Anyhow I won’t take up any more of your time. Today’s posts are my final posts here, I just wanted to have a bit of fun and go out with a bang.

How many farewell posts are you going to make?

[Northern]

Originally Posted by Stephen Ave

It’s true I do come and look on the site from time to time. Solely for the entertainment. It’s kind of like the Jerry Springer show, you don’t really want to watch it but it is really entertaining.

Anyhow I won’t take up any more of your time. Today’s posts are my final posts here, I just wanted to have a bit of fun and go out with a bang.

Don’t let the door hit you on the way out.

[thegoodlife]

Originally Posted by Corndogger

It's a type of construction and many of us enjoy the photos. And why does it matter if it's single family housing? The majority of Calgarians live in such housing. Also, no one is complaining about condo tower construction. Let people post everything and self-filter what you don't want to look at.

I agree Corndogger. One thing I can’t stand is people complaining about other people’s pics that they post. It’s construction. I like what’s happening around the airport and fringes of the city, more than pics of downtown apartment towers but I don’t complain. I like Daemons pics, but even if I didn’t I still wouldn’t complain.

[Rollerstud98]

Has the new Canadian Blood Services building been brought up in here? It is beinnbuilt just north of country hills Blvd and Barlow intersection. quite an impressive build. I guess a lot of that is from my perspective on the hvac but the amount of redundancy built in to everything is amazing.

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by Rollerstud98

Has the new Canadian Blood Services building been brought up in here? It is beinnbuilt just north of country hills Blvd and Barlow intersection. quite an impressive build. I guess a lot of that is from my perspective on the hvac but the amount of redundancy built in to everything is amazing.

I don't believe it has been mentioned.

[topdog]

Originally Posted by Corndogger

How many farewell posts are you going to make?

He said it was his final post, so unless he comes back probably one farewell post.

[topdog]

Originally Posted by Corndogger

It's a type of construction and many of us enjoy the photos. And why does it matter if it's single family housing? The majority of Calgarians live in such housing. Also, no one is complaining about condo tower construction. Let people post everything and self-filter what you don't want to look at.

My thoughts as well. If someone posts something you don’t like ignore it and engage podtdcthet appeal to you.

[DizzyEdge]

Originally Posted by jc_yyc_ca

It’s too bad things went off the rails. Personally, the discussion around condo fees is a valid one. Everyone has their personal reasons for living where they want to live, but condo fees are something that need to be taken into consideration. Condo fees, reserve funds etc are an important part of real estate. I don’t know why people took such offence to the topic?

I'm curious if there are stats out there as far as typical maintenance costs for SFH over a decade, perhaps 0-10 years, 10-20 years, etc. That would give an interesting stat to compare to condo fees. One thing that I do like about owning land is at some point it's fully paid off (in 5 years for me), but of course ongoing maintenance is not free, particularly when you own a 107 yr old house.

[BlaineN]

I just finished deleting a bunch of posts discussing what should be allowed to be discussed.
Everyone's had their say about what they think should be posted and what shouldn't. It's time to move on post only things construction related. SFH construction is okay, but let's put spoiler tags on them.

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by DizzyEdge

I'm curious if there are stats out there as far as typical maintenance costs for SFH over a decade, perhaps 0-10 years, 10-20 years, etc. That would give an interesting stat to compare to condo fees. One thing that I do like about owning land is at some point it's fully paid off (in 5 years for me), but of course ongoing maintenance is not free, particularly when you own a 107 yr old house.

Unless the condo board and/or management company breaks down how the fees are spent it's hard to do a comparison. Where I live we break everything down and the majority of the fees are used to pay for utilities, recycling, etc. Costs that any household would occur. It's the amount that goes into the reserve fund that is the best comparison to household maintenance along with operating costs for maintenance. Insurance costs would also be something worth comparing.

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by Corndogger

Unless the condo board and/or management company breaks down how the fees are spent it's hard to do a comparison. Where I live we break everything down and the majority of the fees are used to pay for utilities, recycling, etc. Costs that any household would occur. It's the amount that goes into the reserve fund that is the best comparison to household maintenance along with operating costs for maintenance. Insurance costs would also be something worth comparing.

If all was going directly to required maintenance, there should be modest difference between different buildings, but the issue with condo fees include but are not limited to the following:
- there are additional layers, IE you have to pay the management company
- often times issues of a particular unit are ignored or deferred till it is a broader issue, increasing the overall per unit cost
- many times what is required is deferred to a consultant that was recommended by the management company. There is often a good amount of conflict of interest w.r.t. what happens, when, and for what price
- as the board is volunteers, they sometimes get worn out while still wanting to maintain power and perceived status
- sometimes board members have specific angles that are hard to get around. I shared years ago that a building my folks were in had no furniture in the lobby because the many-term president's unit was directly above the lobby on the second floor, and she didn't want noise / people sitting there to talk
- when it comes to going after a builder / developer, it takes a lot of effort and cost, and often times condo boards strike too modest a deal with the builder on envelop issues
- when things happen involving specific units, the condo board often does not want to approach insurance as it will potentially increase rates for all of them, and so the want of the many over rule the rights of the few
- you lose control over when and how many renos happen IE special assessments that you have to pay within 30 days
- a change of circumstance might be against condo by-laws, like having a kid, getting a dog, or having a dog grow beyond a by-law weight limit, the need to have guests, etc.

So yeah - you can compare electricity bill to electricity bill and regular roofing to regular roofing, but it will not reveal the subtleties.

As Suburgatory has stated, there is risk in everything, and for some (many) the risks I've identified above relating to condo fees / boards are acceptable.

[Daemon]

Originally Posted by thegoodlife

I agree Corndogger. One thing I can’t stand is people complaining about other people’s pics that they post. It’s construction. I like what’s happening around the airport and fringes of the city, more than pics of downtown apartment towers but I don’t complain. I like Daemons pics, but even if I didn’t I still wouldn’t complain.

Update coming up later

[jc_yyc_ca]

Very well put. Condo fees are diverse and vary from building to building, but there are constants that never change. At best even with good management in a good condo board, you’re still paying for ‘additional layers’ (a good term, I’ll have to remember that one) that never go away and which you have no control over.
I don’t think anyone’s trying to say that condo living is bad, only that people need to recognize what condo fees are and the downside to them.

Originally Posted by suburbia

If all was going directly to required maintenance, there should be modest difference between different buildings, but the issue with condo fees include but are not limited to the following:
- there are additional layers, IE you have to pay the management company
- often times issues of a particular unit are ignored or deferred till it is a broader issue, increasing the overall per unit cost
- many times what is required is deferred to a consultant that was recommended by the management company. There is often a good amount of conflict of interest w.r.t. what happens, when, and for what price
- as the board is volunteers, they sometimes get worn out while still wanting to maintain power and perceived status
- sometimes board members have specific angles that are hard to get around. I shared years ago that a building my folks were in had no furniture in the lobby because the many-term president's unit was directly above the lobby on the second floor, and she didn't want noise / people sitting there to talk
- when it comes to going after a builder / developer, it takes a lot of effort and cost, and often times condo boards strike too modest a deal with the builder on envelop issues
- when things happen involving specific units, the condo board often does not want to approach insurance as it will potentially increase rates for all of them, and so the want of the many over rule the rights of the few
- you lose control over when and how many renos happen IE special assessments that you have to pay within 30 days
- a change of circumstance might be against condo by-laws, like having a kid, getting a dog, or having a dog grow beyond a by-law weight limit, the need to have guests, etc.

So yeah - you can compare electricity bill to electricity bill and regular roofing to regular roofing, but it will not reveal the subtleties.

As Suburgatory has stated, there is risk in everything, and for some (many) the risks I've identified above relating to condo fees / boards are acceptable.

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by suburbia

If all was going directly to required maintenance, there should be modest difference between different buildings, but the issue with condo fees include but are not limited to the following:
- there are additional layers, IE you have to pay the management company
- often times issues of a particular unit are ignored or deferred till it is a broader issue, increasing the overall per unit cost
- many times what is required is deferred to a consultant that was recommended by the management company. There is often a good amount of conflict of interest w.r.t. what happens, when, and for what price
- as the board is volunteers, they sometimes get worn out while still wanting to maintain power and perceived status
- sometimes board members have specific angles that are hard to get around. I shared years ago that a building my folks were in had no furniture in the lobby because the many-term president's unit was directly above the lobby on the second floor, and she didn't want noise / people sitting there to talk
- when it comes to going after a builder / developer, it takes a lot of effort and cost, and often times condo boards strike too modest a deal with the builder on envelop issues
- when things happen involving specific units, the condo board often does not want to approach insurance as it will potentially increase rates for all of them, and so the want of the many over rule the rights of the few
- you lose control over when and how many renos happen IE special assessments that you have to pay within 30 days
- a change of circumstance might be against condo by-laws, like having a kid, getting a dog, or having a dog grow beyond a by-law weight limit, the need to have guests, etc.

So yeah - you can compare electricity bill to electricity bill and regular roofing to regular roofing, but it will not reveal the subtleties.

As Suburgatory has stated, there is risk in everything, and for some (many) the risks I've identified above relating to condo fees / boards are acceptable.

You're ignoring most of what I said and are making a lot of assumptions that are not true. The majority of your condo fees cover expenses such as utilities that any homeowner would have to pay. That's why you need to break down what the fees pay for in order to do any kind of meaningful comparisons to SFHs.

If you're being blindsided by major expenditures then that's the fault of unit owners. Keep on top of the board and get them to let everyone know what's going on before any action is taken. With a self-managed complex the people on the board have skin in the game and will take the time to stay on top of things. If they don't either vote them out or force them out. All of the issues you brought up are easily dealt with unless they are something out of the ordinary. For example, where I live someone got a puppy that grew over the limit. Someone complained but a number of others said it was crazy to not allow this person to have a pet and that there was no issue because she kept the dog under control. The board agreed and she got to keep the dog. Years later there's been no issues with the dog. As long as people are reasonable problems are solvable.

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by jc_yyc_ca

Very well put. Condo fees are diverse and vary from building to building, but there are constants that never change. At best even with good management in a good condo board, you’re still paying for ‘additional layers’ (a good term, I’ll have to remember that one) that never go away and which you have no control over.
I don’t think anyone’s trying to say that condo living is bad, only that people need to recognize what condo fees are and the downside to them.

You don't have to have a management company and I think it's best not to have one unless absolutely necessary.

What extra layer of costs are there that you don't have with a house? Other than elevator costs, snow cleaning (you could do this yourself if people wanted to volunteer), an honorarium for the board and auditing costs as far as I can tell the rest of the costs are all things anyone would have to incur. If you lived in a complex that consists of many buildings you might not even have elevator costs. It really breaks down to lifestyle choices and if you're willing to give up some control over what you can do. Luck probably plays a role as well. If you live in a complex where people get along for the most part things aren't bad. But living in a SFH doesn't guarantee you can do whatever you want. You can also have asshole neighbors that make your life miserable.

[Northern]

It depends on the type of building or a complex that you live in. Even if you Live in a townhouse complex, and you don’t have elevators or security, you still have window/door replacement painting, costs like that. My mother lives in the complex like that, and I keep making everyone pay for changes, changes that I could do myself. Also replacing all the windows and doors even though they don’t need replacing, but they want them all to match.

Here’s another story for you. My buddy lives in a condo complex of townhouses, and a landscaping company wasn’t fullfilling the duty of watering the trees and bushes of a small central area. The newly planted trees were dying, and my buddy who was on the condo board, offered to use his own water to water the shrubs and trees as long as the condo board paid for the extra water on his bill. He Even volunteered to do the work for free, but the condo board didn’t want to go for it. Some of the people on the board felt trees and shrubs weren’t necessary, and they kiboshed the idea. and By the end of the summer the trees were half dead. The point being that you are at the mercy of a condo board, which means you’re often at the mercy of a group of idiots.

Originally Posted by Corndogger

You don't have to have a management company and I think it's best not to have one unless absolutely necessary.

What extra layer of costs are there that you don't have with a house? Other than elevator costs, snow cleaning (you could do this yourself if people wanted to volunteer), an honorarium for the board and auditing costs as far as I can tell the rest of the costs are all things anyone would have to incur. If you lived in a complex that consists of many buildings you might not even have elevator costs. It really breaks down to lifestyle choices and if you're willing to give up some control over what you can do. Luck probably plays a role as well. If you live in a complex where people get along for the most part things aren't bad. But living in a SFH doesn't guarantee you can do whatever you want. You can also have asshole neighbors that make your life miserable.

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by Northern

It depends on the type of building or a complex that you live in. Even if you Live in a townhouse complex, and you don’t have elevators or security, you still have window/door replacement painting, costs like that. My mother lives in the complex like that, and I keep making everyone pay for changes, changes that I could do myself. Also replacing all the windows and doors even though they don’t need replacing, but they want them all to match.

Here’s another story for you. My buddy lives in a condo complex of townhouses, and a landscaping company wasn’t fullfilling the duty of watering the trees and bushes of a small central area. The newly planted trees were dying, and my buddy who was on the condo board, offered to use his own water to water the shrubs and trees as long as the condo board paid for the extra water on his bill. He Even volunteered to do the work for free, but the condo board didn’t want to go for it. Some of the people on the board felt trees and shrubs weren’t necessary, and they kiboshed the idea. and By the end of the summer the trees were half dead. The point being that you are at the mercy of a condo board, which means you’re often at the mercy of a group of idiots.

I'm not saying all experiences are positive. You need to stay on top of things and make sure people on the board are reasonable.

As for stuff like replacing windows that's dictated by provincial law. The reserve fund study that maps out when things need to be done and what it should cost is what guides all of this stuff. As far as I know there's no rule saying you can't do some of this stuff yourself as long as you meet the standards. Maybe I'm lucky in my situation to have a board that keeps us informed and doesn't make any decisions without first asking for input. We have had issues with some board members but have been good at either forcing them or getting them to resign when they realize people are not going to tolerate what they want to do.

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by Northern

It depends on the type of building or a complex that you live in. Even if you Live in a townhouse complex, and you don’t have elevators or security, you still have window/door replacement painting, costs like that. My mother lives in the complex like that, and I keep making everyone pay for changes, changes that I could do myself. Also replacing all the windows and doors even though they don’t need replacing, but they want them all to match.

Here’s another story for you. My buddy lives in a condo complex of townhouses, and a landscaping company wasn’t fullfilling the duty of watering the trees and bushes of a small central area. The newly planted trees were dying, and my buddy who was on the condo board, offered to use his own water to water the shrubs and trees as long as the condo board paid for the extra water on his bill. He Even volunteered to do the work for free, but the condo board didn’t want to go for it. Some of the people on the board felt trees and shrubs weren’t necessary, and they kiboshed the idea. and By the end of the summer the trees were half dead. The point being that you are at the mercy of a condo board, which means you’re often at the mercy of a group of idiots.

The above is pretty standard. People don't talk about it because it isn't something they want to share, but it happens a lot. Not unlike miscarriages.

I recall in my folks' old place the tar was going to be redone. I asked why, and the board said because the schedule says that it needs to be done. So I said it is fine that the schedule estimated life of the tar to be X number of years, but it looks excellent. If there are any specific issues, have it patched. They scoffed at this and said that engineers have made the schedule and we should trust experts. So it was a ridiculous situation. Good parking surface was dug up and replaced so it looked exactly like it used to, and money was spent. In a home, firstly I'd not have to deal with tar because I wouldn't have tar on my property, but I'd only do things when they needed to be done.

The trees dying because people were negligent is pretty standard. And the bureaucracy is so slow that the decision of the bureaucracy doesn't even matter at the end of the day.

Oh - and if you are in a tall building, you have to watch out for singletons throwing chairs off the balconies too.

Good points earlier about houses not needing elevators (and that exercise does the body good). Elevators are a massive cost, the monthly charges plus when things go south. Horrible horrible. And yeah, you have to pay for cleaning, heating and lighting all those hallways that aren't actually yours. Overhead in management and services, and overhead in building spaces.

Originally Posted by Corndogger

You need to stay on top of things and make sure people on the board are reasonable.

There is no reasonable mechanism that is quick so as to respond to an issue, and that is not adversarial. Plus, people live in condos so they don't have to worry about things. Now they have to worry and "stay on top of things" so that they people managing the extra money you are paying are doing things well so that you don't have stress. Whaaat?