Phoenix Development News (3) - Page 826

CrestedSaguaro · #**16501** Posted **Feb 13, 2020, 10:25 PM**

Here ya go ASU Diablo!!

Here are the RFP's for the regency parking garage. Both are fairly impressive with good height! The Hines RFP is more streamlined and very tall at 475'! It is something you would see built in LA or Atlanta and I think it's very impressive we are finally getting out-of-the-box proposals like this. This would really be a skyline game-changer for Phoenix.

The Berger design has decent height at 376' with a really nice looking facade. My problem with it however, it's another square box and the garage is WAY too open and pronounced for me. This is not a clamoring for the tallest proposal thing. To me, it just screams "drive your car!" and is the wrong image that Phoenix should be working towards for Downtown IMHO. If they revise it and integrate the garage better, it would be a much better design and I may like it better.

Hines Proposal:

Berger Proposal:

The RFP docs can be found on my Google Drive:

Hines RFP: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1XY...4afIgB9GmmCDyl

Berger RFP: https://drive.google.com/open?id=17d...CD7WSv9PHHydvB

ASU Diablo · #**16502** Posted **Feb 13, 2020, 10:32 PM**

Damn that was fast!!! Thanks buddy.

At first glance, had a sneaky suspicion Hines proposal would be better and at 100' feet taller, disappointed the city didn't go with Hines. Going to reserve further judgement until I read the RFPs in detail.

And as always, expect AZ Central or PBJ article to post later today or tomorrow AM about this same exact topic haha

CrestedSaguaro · #**16503** Posted **Feb 13, 2020, 10:36 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASU Diablo

Damn that was fast!!! Thanks buddy.

At first glance, had a sneaky suspicion Hines proposal would be better and at 100' feet taller, disappointed the city didn't go with Hines. Going to reserve further judgement until I read the RFPs in detail.

And as always, expect AZ Central or PBJ article to post later today or tomorrow AM about this same exact topic haha

Oh! I didn't realize the proposal was already chosen. I sure hope that the garage of the Berger proposal is cleaned up better. Why on Earth would anyone want to see all those cars like that??

biggus diggus · #**16504** Posted **Feb 13, 2020, 10:38 PM**

The first rendering you posted has somehow turned the existing rectangle into a curved building. I assume that means the existing garage would be replaced. That's interesting to me because I understood this was all contingent on the garage staying put.

azliam · #**16505** Posted **Feb 13, 2020, 10:39 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

Oh! I didn't realize the proposal was already chosen. I sure hope that the garage of the Berger proposal is cleaned up better. Why on Earth would anyone want to see all those cars like that??

Thanks for posting Ronnie!

Really though, WTH???

At first, I didn't even notice those cars and thought the area was just open area for retail, restaurants, etc.

It looks like those cars are just gonna roll right off.

ASU Diablo · #**16506** Posted **Feb 13, 2020, 10:39 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

Oh! I didn't realize the proposal was already chosen. I sure hope that the garage of the Berger proposal is cleaned up better. Why on Earth would anyone want to see all those cars like that??

Yeah, my bad. Should've clarified that the bolded text meant Berger was the chosen winner! LOL

Horrible, I hate that look. Plus, no shade structure proposed like the Hines project. Also, how does stairs up along Adams promote connectivity and pedestrian activity? This looks like an epic fail so far.

ASU Diablo · #**16507** Posted **Feb 13, 2020, 10:40 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by biggus diggus

The first rendering you posted has somehow turned the existing rectangle into a curved building. I assume that means the existing garage would be replaced. That's interesting to me because I understood this was all contingent on the garage staying put.

Nope. It was either keep/retrofit or rebuild it.

bchris02 · #**16508** Posted **Feb 13, 2020, 10:46 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASU Diablo

Yeah, my bad. Should've clarified that the bolded text meant Berger was the chosen winner! LOL

Horrible, I hate that look. Plus, no shade structure proposed like the Hines project. Also, how does stairs up along Adams promote connectivity and pedestrian activity? This looks like an epic fail so far.

I don't know. I like the Berger proposal better at street level but much prefer the impact the Hines proposal would have had on the skyline.

CrestedSaguaro · #**16509** Posted **Feb 13, 2020, 11:19 PM**

The parking garage and the stairway need revisited. This is taking a step backwards in promoting Downtown Phoenix as walkable and less a car-dependant area. I understand the garage is part of the RFP and will stay there, but it doesn't need to be so open and gaudy. I like the upper floors and I think the cladding is pretty nice and the height, although not nearly as tall as the Hines proposal, is still good and will be almost as tall as Cityscape. I hope Phoenix asks Berger to work on the garage portion.

Edit: I also just noticed that there is a pedestrian bridge over what appears to be be a paseo. Is the plan to still close off Adams to cars? And if so, why would a stairway and a pedestrian bridge be needed??

biggus diggus · #**16510** Posted **Feb 13, 2020, 11:42 PM**

We know you don't want more parking but the reality is that it's a necessary evil. You'll have to accept it.

I'm sure the garage in the rendering is shown in a way to make it obvious that's a garage. I've never seen one open like that.

ASU Diablo · #**16511** Posted **Feb 13, 2020, 11:58 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

The parking garage and the stairway need revisited. This is taking a step backwards in promoting Downtown Phoenix as walkable and less a car-dependant area. I understand the garage is part of the RFP and will stay there, but it doesn't need to be so open and gaudy. I like the upper floors and I think the cladding is pretty nice and the height, although not nearly as tall as the Hines proposal, is still good and will be almost as tall as Cityscape. I hope Phoenix asks Berger to work on the garage portion.

Edit: I also just noticed that there is a pedestrian bridge over what appears to be be a paseo. Is the plan to still close off Adams to cars? And if so, why would a stairway and a pedestrian bridge be needed??

My understanding regarding Adams is it won't be a true pedestrian mall (thankfully) but was re-designed in such a way it can easily be closed off for special events, etc.

Edifice · #**16512** Posted **Feb 14, 2020, 12:03 AM**

Check out Page 14 of the Berger RFP at the link provided by Ronnie. It has more information on the parking garage. It looks like it will be open, as the rendering shows. Maybe clear plexiglass barriers instead of concrete walls/barriers. Also, it looks like it has design/art incorporated into the garage ceilings. Says it could be used for events as flex space.

Of course, some of this may not make it to the final design, but it's pretty unique. Could bring some out of the box design to downtown.

PHXFlyer11 · #**16513** Posted **Feb 14, 2020, 12:50 AM**

Well I’m certainly not holding my breath. Not one of these RFP’d tower projects has ever broken ground in Phoenix. Not sure what the hell is going on, but someone at the city needs to be fired for their constant failure to properly evaluate the proposals and create binding terms in reasonable development time periods. Seriously, I won’t even get excited about any RFP until I see one actually break ground. I’d prefer to just not see them anymore.

ASU Diablo · #**16514** Posted **Feb 14, 2020, 1:02 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by PHXFlyer11

Well I’m certainly not holding my breath. Not one of these RFP’d tower projects has ever broken ground in Phoenix. Not sure what the hell is going on, but someone at the city needs to be fired for their constant failure to properly evaluate the proposals and create binding terms in reasonable development time periods. Seriously, I won’t even get excited about any RFP until I see one actually break ground. I’d prefer to just not see them anymore.

Not a tower but a rather big development, The Fillmore, did ultimately break ground. I’m feeling good about Central Station too and that’s scheduled to break ground in the summer.

Obadno · #**16515** Posted **Feb 14, 2020, 2:56 AM**

Damn that first proposal is fantastic. Office or condos?

dtphxguy · #**16516** Posted **Feb 14, 2020, 4:09 AM**

Damn, the city has been begging for companies to come build new office space downtown. Then an international developer offers to build 250,000 sq ft of class AA office, and the city turns them down

Obadno · #**16517** Posted **Feb 14, 2020, 4:16 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by dtphxguy

Damn, the city has been begging for companies to come build new office space downtown. Then an international developer offers to build 250,000 sq ft of class AA office, and the city turns them down

What?

dtphxguy · #**16518** Posted **Feb 14, 2020, 4:25 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Obadno

What?

Hines proposal was 250,000 sq ft of office, 350 hotel rooms, parking and retail.

And the proposal said they had a tenant for half the office space.

Makes no sense why the city would pass that up.

TJPHXskyscraperfan · #**16519** Posted **Feb 14, 2020, 5:01 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by biggus diggus

We know you don't want more parking but the reality is that it's a necessary evil. You'll have to accept it.

I'm sure the garage in the rendering is shown in a way to make it obvious that's a garage. I've never seen one open like that.

I seen a garage opened like that in Miami Beach, I thought at the time it was pretty cool looking.

xymox · #**16520** Posted **Feb 14, 2020, 5:11 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASU Diablo

Damn that was fast!!! Thanks buddy.

At first glance, had a sneaky suspicion Hines proposal would be better and at 100' feet taller, disappointed the city didn't go with Hines. Going to reserve further judgement until I read the RFPs in detail.

And as always, expect AZ Central or PBJ article to post later today or tomorrow AM about this same exact topic haha

Looking at the two proposals - I'd have to guess the city chose the second mostly because of the public space that is part of the 2nd. The 'city plaza' that they talk about in the document on the Google Drive. Could see this being important for future Super Bowl or NFL Draft events (i.e. Nashville's draft this past year was in a giant plaza like this). Also - it more directly uses the garage. The first one seems to build the tower next to the garage - so I wonder if there were issues with property ownership related to that.

Now if any of these RFP towers will break ground, then we can get excited...