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View Poll Results: Is Atlanta the most important city in the South?
Yes 59 57.84%
No 43 42.16%
Voters: 102. You may not vote on this poll

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  #21  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 5:00 AM
liat91 liat91 is offline
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Equally shared between Atlanta, Dallas, Houston and Miami on a global level, but within the US only, I would omit Miami.

Looking into the future, I see Dallas taking the mantle in Texas and it would then come down to Dallas and Atlanta. Sorry so say, but Miami wouldn’t be a third of what it is without Latin American wealth parked there for safety and security reasons.
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  #22  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 3:41 PM
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If Texas is the South then it's DFW and it's not even close. If not, then it's Atlanta and also not even close.
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  #23  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 3:56 PM
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
If Texas is the South then it's DFW and it's not even close. If not, then it's Atlanta and also not even close.
DFW is pretty much on par with Houston and Atlanta. Dallas just thinks they are special of the Cowgirls and JR Ewing.
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  #24  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 3:57 PM
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You know what city we’ve all forgotten? Washington, D.C.

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  #25  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 4:01 PM
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It's the primary city for the Southeast. (I don't include Miami in the SE. Fla. is it's own world.)

For the South generally, Dallas and Houston are more significant cities.

P.S.: I hate to use the word "important." The only important US cities are NY, DC, and LA.
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  #26  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 4:02 PM
iheartthed iheartthed is offline
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Originally Posted by JManc View Post
DFW is pretty much on par with Houston and Atlanta. Dallas just thinks they are special of the Cowgirls and JR Ewing.
It may look that way on paper, but DFW has a more diverse economy and is bigger than both Atlanta and Houston.
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  #27  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 4:02 PM
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You know what city we’ve all forgotten? Washington, D.C.

i'd say DC has been more or less fully assimilated into bos-wash now. resistance is futile.

anecdotal, but of the handful of people i've known who were born and raised in the DC area, none of them held even a shred of any kind of "southern" identity.

but they are all generic white people, perhaps the cultural identity of the city's large african american population is different?
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  #28  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 4:11 PM
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Originally Posted by wwmiv View Post
You know what city we’ve all forgotten? Washington, D.C.

Yeah, and Cincinnati too!
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  #29  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 4:13 PM
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
It may look that way on paper, but DFW has a more diverse economy and is bigger than both Atlanta and Houston.
More diverse economy for sure, we are feeling the effects of depressed oil prices here right now but the size difference between Houston and DFW is relatively small; less than a half million and DFW is an amalgamation of two major cities with two distinct cultures. If it were just Dallas, I think it would be a no brainer.
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  #30  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 4:14 PM
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Again, money and size talk. DFW and Houston have higher gdps, ppps, and populations than Atlanta.

Bigger, wealthier, greater economic might nationally and globally... more "important".
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  #31  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 4:27 PM
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Originally Posted by JManc View Post
More diverse economy for sure, we are feeling the effects of depressed oil prices here right now but the size difference between Houston and DFW is relatively small; less than a half million and DFW is an amalgamation of two major cities with two distinct cultures. If it were just Dallas, I think it would be a no brainer.
Yeah, to me that's the differentiator between Dallas and Houston. Houston is an industry town, while Dallas has become an economic hub. They may be close now, but it's hard for me to imagine that Dallas doesn't pull away in the future.

Atlanta's economy looks a little more like Dallas's, but it's not growing fast enough to catch Dallas.
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  #32  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 4:43 PM
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
Yeah, to me that's the differentiator between Dallas and Houston. Houston is an industry town, while Dallas has become an economic hub. They may be close now, but it's hard for me to imagine that Dallas doesn't pull away in the future.

Atlanta's economy looks a little more like Dallas's, but it's not growing fast enough to catch Dallas.
I personally think Dallas will eventually pull away but Houston has been pretty proactive about lessening its dependence on oil and gas (a sunsetting industry) and diversifying and spending resources on becoming an innovation hub. There are two innovation 'districts' currently in development and the relocation of HPE was a major boost.

How successful this will be in the long run remains to be seen.
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  #33  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 5:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
i'd say DC has been more or less fully assimilated into bos-wash now. resistance is futile.

anecdotal, but of the handful of people i've known who were born and raised in the DC area, none of them held even a shred of any kind of "southern" identity.

but they are all generic white people, perhaps the cultural identity of the city's large african american population is different?
DC's (and Baltimore's for that matter) native Black population don't identify as Southern but they are very much aware of their Southern roots and cultural influences. Many are just a generation or two removed from the South.
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  #34  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 5:46 PM
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Out of the Bos-Was corridor, DC still feels southern. From the swamp ass in the summers to the food. It's just no longer traditional south given its status as nation's capital.
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  #35  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 5:54 PM
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Originally Posted by JManc View Post
Out of the Bos-Was corridor, DC still feels southern. From the swamp ass in the summers to the food. It's just no longer traditional south given its status as nation's capital.
Hell, even the New York area feel slightly southern in the summer. I was absolutely shocked how humid it was when I first started living here. The humidity was absolutely hellish and subtropical. It was totally unexpected.
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  #36  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 5:54 PM
iheartthed iheartthed is offline
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Originally Posted by KB0679 View Post
DC's (and Baltimore's for that matter) native Black population don't identify as Southern but they are very much aware of their Southern roots and cultural influences. Many are just a generation or two removed from the South.
Yeah, D.C. is very much like any other major industrial hub city in that regard. The city attracted black migrants from the Deep South in the first half of the 20th century primarily through opportunities for work, and secondarily by the absence of Jim Crow laws. Since D.C. itself is so transitory, the only thing remotely "southern" about it are the black residents who trace their lineage to the South. But that doesn't make D.C. anymore southern than Chicago or L.A.
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  #37  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 6:04 PM
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Originally Posted by KB0679 View Post
DC's (and Baltimore's for that matter) native Black population don't identify as Southern but they are very much aware of their Southern roots and cultural influences. Many are just a generation or two removed from the South.
Yes, and that's pretty much the same situation in any northern industrial city (many being a generation or two removed from the South).

Though Baltimore and DC have had significant black populations for much longer than a few generations. Both were around 1/4 black as far back as the early 1800s.

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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
Yeah, D.C. is very much like any other major industrial hub city in that regard. The city attracted black migrants from the Deep South in the first half of the 20th century primarily through opportunities for work, and secondarily by the absence of Jim Crow laws. Since D.C. itself is so transitory, the only thing remotely "southern" about it are the black residents who trace their lineage to the South. But that doesn't make D.C. anymore southern than Chicago or L.A.
I disagree. See above and note that Chicago or LA or wherever has nothing like PG County, with its majority black population and prominent southern black culture. Outside the beltway in southern PG County... it's not the North.
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  #38  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 6:09 PM
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Originally Posted by wwmiv View Post
Is Atlanta still even Southern? Asking for a related thread.

On the real, though: Houston, Dallas, and Miami have tantamount import to the importance of Atlanta. We can go all week long debating their relative merits, but there’s no clear stand out. It isn’t the northeast with New York, it isn’t the Midwest with Chicago, and it isn’t the west coast with Los Angeles.

That being said... if you want more fine grained regions not based upon just states, Dallas is the alpha city of the Great Plains, Houston of the Gulf Coast, Atlanta of the Deep South, and Miami of the Caribbean. But they’re all also “southern” in their own unique ways, whatever that means to you or any other poster.

I would ALSO think it would not be controversial to say that of those four, Atlanta is the most clearly “southern.”
I agree with this. Miami, Houston and Dallas are probably all more important nationally but Atlanta is probably the most important city to the south. Given that those other cities aren't necessarily strictly southern cities.

Culturally, Miami isn't really southern, it's more like New York's 6th borough. Houston and Dallas are Texan. I would also Sub classify Houston as a Gulf city, different from Atlanta but still southern...just not as southern as New Orleans.
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  #39  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 6:24 PM
iheartthed iheartthed is offline
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Originally Posted by pj3000 View Post
I disagree. See above and note that Chicago or LA or wherever has nothing like PG County, with its majority black population and prominent southern black culture. Outside the beltway in southern PG County... it's not the North.
I don't know enough about southern PG County to opine on that. But the core of PG County is (culturally) no different than any other middle class black neighborhood or suburb in a major metro (Hyde Park, Ladera Heights, CA, Southfield, MI, etc.).
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  #40  
Old Posted Jan 4, 2021, 6:56 PM
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
I don't know enough about southern PG County to opine on that. But the core of PG County is (culturally) no different than any other middle class black neighborhood or suburb in a major metro (Hyde Park, Ladera Heights, CA, Southfield, MI, etc.).
I would again disagree, in that there are certainly cultural nuances in PG County that skew much more Southern.

And the main structural and scope difference in the comparison you make is that Prince George's County is not a neighborhood or suburb... but the largest and one of the few black majority counties in the nation -- and the only one in the northern US (Baltimore City is also, but not really a county). Much of PG County is rural in character. Rural and black is a major outlier in the northern US, and thus it is very different from a black neighborhood or suburb elsewhere outside of the South in the US.

Much of the area was dominated by slave labor tobacco plantations. There is long-standing culture in the area tied back to that... just like in the South.
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