Trans Canada Highway Twinning: Segments U/C

[1overcosc]

Arnprior-Petawawa, North Bay-Sault Ste. Marie, and Thunder Bay-Shabaqua would likely be twinnable with the funding given. Shabaqua-Kenora, Nipigon-Sault, and North Bay-Petawawa are geographically challenging with relatively low AADT so they'd be lower on the list.

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by eternallyme

How high into the Ottawa Valley? I would assume it would be a freeway as far as Petawawa at least, since the studies have been done and interchange locations set.

We'd probably have a full 400-series freeway, grade separated and all, to Petawawa (or maybe Deep River) and a four-lane road with level crossings at most places and interchanges where warranted (like Highway 11) beyond that.

[freeweed]

Kenora to MB is actually happening? Like, actual, real construction going on?

I figured this was still 10 years away from completion even with the best estimates.

[sonysnob]

Originally Posted by freeweed

Kenora to MB is actually happening? Like, actual, real construction going on?

I figured this was still 10 years away from completion even with the best estimates.

They've announced it a few times, but no, no actual construction is starting. Construction on the first phase could conceivably being this year, but I don't know if any other phases are at all shovel ready.

[freeweed]

Thanks though. Someone mentioned it above and I got excited... for the 20th time in 40 years.

[jmt18325]

The construction was delayed because of negotiations with a reserve, as far as I know.

[Dwils01]

Originally Posted by jmt18325

The construction was delayed because of negotiations with a reserve, as far as I know.

That's what's happening in Sault Ste. Marie. The highway was supposed to be twinned to Second Line not only to the east end of the city. We gave money to Garden River Reserve and the Rankin Reserve to build it. They built it through Garden River but the Rankin Reserve refuses even though they have already spent the money we have given them on a bingo hall, medical centre and a new subdivision.

[jmt18325]

And iirc, the reserve in question is very difficult to deal with.

[srperrycgy]

I drove down to Vancouver in my new car on the 12th and came back to Calgary yesterday. Conditions were abysmal from Calgary to Lake Louise on the way down, but all was well coming back. I filmed a couple of sections which have had improvements completed on the way back:

Three Valley Gap to Revelstoke:

• Video Link

Donald Bridge (W of Golden):

• Video Link

Kicking Horse Canyon:

• Video Link



Apologies for the bumpiness. Part of it was the frost heaves and potholes on the roadway, he other part was that my camera is a bit too heavy for the suction cup holder on the windshield and moved a bit.

[lubicon]

Originally Posted by jmt18325

The construction was delayed because of negotiations with a reserve, as far as I know.

Originally Posted by jmt18325

And iirc, the reserve in question is very difficult to deal with.

How large is the reserve and is it feasible to route the highway around it? That's what Alberta did several years ago when twinning #43 west of Valleyview. One of the reserves was holding things up so the Province just said fine, we'll bypass the reserve entirely. That got the reserve's attention and they worked something out after that.

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by lubicon

How large is the reserve and is it feasible to route the highway around it? That's what Alberta did several years ago when twinning #43 west of Valleyview. One of the reserves was holding things up so the Province just said fine, we'll bypass the reserve entirely. That got the reserve's attention and they worked something out after that.

Bypassing the reserve turns it north, and that would bypass Sault Ste. Marie entirely. It would actually be feasible, but would require a connector highway looping the reserve to access SSM.

[Dwils01]

The problem with going north around Sault Ste. Marie is the terrain. It would be very expensive to do similar to twinning 17 along Lake Superior.

But I think they were talking about the reserve by Kenora but the situations are similar.

[eternallyme]

How difficult would Nipissing First Nation be to deal with?

Since that section west of North Bay is one of the busiest parts, with no reasonable bypass opportunity and the lake and terrain pretty much forces any twinning to be done in the existing alignment. In addition, due to the fact that staging is nearly impossible (due to the railway, cliffs and treaties), it would likely have to be done as a freeway immediately.

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by Dwils01

The problem with going north around Sault Ste. Marie is the terrain. It would be very expensive to do similar to twinning 17 along Lake Superior.

From the Soo to Wawa is some of the most spectacular terrain on the continent. It's too bad so few people drive along it.

[swimmer_spe]

Driving across Canada a few times, Here are my views:

1) Once ON 69 twinning is completed, twinning between North Bay and Sudbury needs to happen.

2) Sudbury to the Soo need to be twinned.

3) Twin Highway 11 From North Bay to Thunder Bay. The terrain north/west of New Liskeard is relatively flat. That is why more truckers take it.

[freeweed]

Originally Posted by isaidso

From the Soo to Wawa is some of the most spectacular terrain on the continent. It's too bad so few people drive along it.

Agreed. And I live next door to the frigging Rockies. Lake Superior Park is absolutely GORGEOUS.

[MalcolmTucker]

North of the lakes, the triple lane sections seemed to be more than enough capacity on my trips in 2009 & 2011.

[vid]

Highway 17, along Lake Superior itself, has very little truck traffic. It mostly serves as a scenic route for travellers. Transports primarily take Highway 11 through the north because it is flat. All the hills and turns make Highway 17 too difficult for most transports.

It is an amazing drive though. From Duluth to Sault Ste Marie. The absolute best views are right around Nipigon (where they're building the cable stay bridge), at a place called Kama.


http://www.panoramio.com/photo/95666169


http://www.panoramio.com/photo/36323219

That's what your Rockies will look like in 1.2 billion years.

If they could make the entirety of Highway 17 3-lanes (alternating, like they currently do) with a barrier, that would probably be enough for that route. Highway 11 has a lot more space except for the stretch between Nipigon and Beardmore which runs through valleys, so it could easily be twinned. It's just a matter of cost. I'd rather see more freight shipped by rail, but the safety standards seem to be lagging more in that industry than in trucking. Within 20 years, the entirety of Highway 11/17 through the Lakehead should be twinned, if all the projects the Liberals have started actually get completed. For all their pro-car rhetoric, the PCs actually have a stronger track record of cancelling our highways as opposed to building them.

[ghYHZ]

Originally Posted by lubicon

How large is the reserve and is it feasible to route the highway around it? That's what Alberta did several years ago when twinning #43 west of Valleyview. One of the reserves was holding things up so the Province just said fine, we'll bypass the reserve entirely. That got the reserve's attention and they worked something out after that.

Here in the Maritimes, the First Nation communities seem to embrace and take full advantage of a highway passing through or adjacent to their reserves.

The Millbrook First Nation at Truro straddles NS102 the main highway link between the Trans Canada and Halifax with a captive audience of about 22,000 vehicles per day. First an interchange was built and then the development of the “Truro Power Centre” began: Gas, Restaurants, Super 8 Hotel (and a new Hampton Inn under construction) Stores and a Mi’kmaq Cultural Centre.

http://www.truropowercentre.ca/

Just today in the Halifax Herald, there is an article on further development at the Membertou First Nation in Sydney where an interchange has been built at NS125. There will be an Arena and Sports Complex……they already have a Hampton Inn and Convention and Gaming Centre along with a “Big Box” shopping centre.

……and the Paqtnkek First Nation in Antigonish County is also planning a new interchange on TCH104 to begin a similar development of their lands.

[freeweed]

Originally Posted by vid

That's what your Rockies will look like in 1.2 billion years.

Closer to 120 million years. The Canadian Rockies are known as the "Rotten Rockies" for a reason - easily-eroded limestone and shales. Not like either of us will be around by then, regardless...

Yes, I kinda miss the granite of the Shield.