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  #1  
Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 1:11 AM
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What It's Like to Live Near a Micro-Unit Building

What It’s Like to Live Near a Micro-Apartment Building
http://www.lifeedited.com/what-its-l...ment-building/



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Much of the controversy surrounding the addition of micro-apartments in Seattle involved what might happen should the micro-apartment dwellers move into neighborhoods that had theretofore been the habitat of dwellers of single-family and other more conventional housing types. While we’ve heard one account of what it’s like to live in a micro-apartment, we have not heard as much about what it’s like to live near one of the buildings. Were the protesters right?

After a couple years of living next to a micro-apartment building in Seattle’s popular Capitol Hill area, one of those more conventional house-dwellers, Jason Weill, decided to report whether the fears had any basis in truth. His account is something of a mixed bag. In many ways, he confirmed many of the concerns, but in other ways, he seemed untroubled about their impact–at least weighed against the benefits the building brings...
I'm excited about the micro unit buildings going up across the country. Do any SSPers live in one or near one?
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  #2  
Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 2:14 AM
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What's a "micro-unit"?

Is it just newspeak for studio apartment?
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 2:26 AM
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I think it is generally defined as less than 350 Sq ft tho I've seen some articles claim up to 375 or even less than 400 Sq ft
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 3:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eightball View Post
I think it is generally defined as less than 350 Sq ft tho I've seen some articles claim up to 375 or even less than 400 Sq ft
Ah, so like a small studio apartment, but still larger than an SRO, and I would imagine with their own attached bathroom and kitchenette.

I lived in a studio for many years in marina city, but it was a touch larger at 500 SF. I loved it, and it totally worked for me when I was a bachelor, but I wouldn't have wanted to live there forever. I still own it , but now I rent it out to my cousin.
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 4:13 AM
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Seattle micros are frequently below 200 sf, and sometimes even below 120 sf. The former (say 200-300 sf) would be like a very small studio, and the latter (commonly around 120-200 sf) would be more like a bedroom/bathroom with access to a shared kitchen. My numbers are approximations.

Seattle has changed the rules substantially. But until recently, you could permit a project as six "units" where each unit was maybe eight bedrooms. At six units you could avoid design review (a huge savings in process/time/cost). In neighborhoods that require parking, you could also base your ratio on the unit count rather than the bedroom count, maybe doing three spaces along the alley instead of 24 for the 48 bedrooms (also a massive cost saver, and making it possible to go way denser on small sites).

I've argued strenuously to keep allowing these. Micros aren't for everybody, but they are popular. They're the only way to provide affordable housing in core Seattle districts without subsidy. They're basically dorm rooms or hotel rooms, which most of us have lived in at least for short periods, and many have lived in for long periods. You trade square footage for financial health, a short or zero commute, and possibly having retail outside your door.

Rents tend to be in the $3/sf range. That's pretty normal for Seattle. It's still not cheap, but they'll do like any building...get slowly cheaper over time.

Opponents seem to be a mix of "let's keep the poor folks out" (or replace that with subtle or non-subtle racism), and "but they'll take my free parking space on the public street".

We're still getting new proposals and starts, but they units are averaging more square feet and they're in districts that don't require parking.
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 4:30 AM
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I live in the Wallingford neighborhood of Seattle (about 4 miles north of Downtown and directly west of the University District). There are a bunch of the micro unit developments in the U District and they really seem to fit right in among the other rental housing that's marketed primarily to students. There's one in the center of my neighborhood and so far there haven't been any issues that folks have reported on the neighborhood blog (in Seattle any problems in the neighborhood wind up on the neighborhood blog).

I think the initial exploitation of the zoning loophole to essentially create rooming houses has created a significant backlash against the micro units in the neighborhoods. The new regs should calm down a lot of that down while incorporating micros into the range of housing types available.
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 6:06 AM
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Things will settle down, but we won't have anything remotely as cheap as the super-micros again.
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 2:06 PM
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I was expecting to read about something like the capsule hotels in Tokyo.
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 2:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhays View Post
Seattle micros are frequently below 200 sf, and sometimes even below 120 sf. The former (say 200-300 sf) would be like a very small studio, and the latter (commonly around 120-200 sf) would be more like a bedroom/bathroom with access to a shared kitchen. My numbers are approximations.
oh, <200 SF is definitely way smaller than a typical studio. and at 120 SF, you're in SRO territory. i'm surprised they can fit individual bathrooms into that small of a unit. ADA requirements would have to be thrown out the window. i'm not aware of any market rate units that small in chicago, though we do still build SROs to help get homeless people off the street, though they are always very controversial because of the social implications that come with that particular demographic.
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Last edited by Steely Dan; Jan 8, 2015 at 3:40 PM.
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 5:29 PM
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These are essentially SROs that are up to modern codes and are typically managed at a "market rate" level. SROs got a bad rap in part because back in the day, living by yourself wasn't as normal and reputable as it is today, particularly for women. So they tended to be mostly men, and mostly ones on the fringe of society. And they tended to be poorly managed. Seattle lost 5,000(?) units basically overnight in the early 70s when fire codes shut down a bunch of buildings after one burned down.

Strangely the local nonprofits are still focusing on more normal-sized units, even when the target is single people. They're not making good enough use of the $16,000,000 per year (levy within Seattle) we give them to build/manage low-income housing.
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  #11  
Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 5:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhays View Post
These are essentially SROs that are up to modern codes and are typically managed at a "market rate" level.
Which seem like part of the answer for the affordable housing crisis. Though I believe I read renovated units of that size in Chicago are $1050/mo - cheaper than a studio, but still not that cheap. Although I think you get a private bath and small kitchenette at that price and the finishes are fairly high quality.

The question really is how do you get the NIMBYs to recognize all the positive aspects?
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 5:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seaskyfan View Post
I live in the Wallingford neighborhood of Seattle (about 4 miles north of Downtown and directly west of the University District). There are a bunch of the micro unit developments in the U District and they really seem to fit right in among the other rental housing that's marketed primarily to students. There's one in the center of my neighborhood and so far there haven't been any issues that folks have reported on the neighborhood blog (in Seattle any problems in the neighborhood wind up on the neighborhood blog).
Interesting. Have you been in any of the units?

Steely Dan how long did you live in that studio?
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 5:53 PM
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Steely Dan how long did you live in that studio?
5 years. it helped that i was on the 33rd floor with a GIANT balcony (nearly 200 SF) and a great view west down the river canyon and in perhaps the most centralized location in the entire city of chicago (state st. & the river). i could also go kayaking whenever i wanted right from the basement of my building, which was actually a small marina right on the river (hence the name "marina city"). i really miss being able to take the elevator down to the basement and throwing my little boat in the water whenever i wanted to go for a paddle. good times.
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Last edited by Steely Dan; Jan 8, 2015 at 6:07 PM.
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 6:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
5 years. it helped that i was on the 33rd floor with a GIANT balcony (nearly 200 SF) and a great view west down the river canyon and in perhaps the most centralized location in the entire city of chicago (state st. & the river). i could also go kayaking whenever i wanted right from the basement of my building, which was actually a small marina right on the river (hence the name "marina city"). i really miss being able to take the elevator down to the basement and throwing my little boat in the water whenever i wanted to go for a paddle. good times.
Your balcony was its own outdoor micro-unit. Watch out for homeless setting up camp out there.
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  #15  
Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 6:37 PM
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Your balcony was its own outdoor micro-unit. Watch out for homeless setting up camp out there.
any homeless person crafty enough to scale the necessary 33 floors to set-up camp out there would have earned the right to do so

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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 8:35 PM
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Nice story and photo, Steely Dan. Kind of accentuates the point made by many micro-unit boosters that the location is more important than the amount of sq ft one occupies. 4.5 years in one apartment is quite stable, as well. You said you are renting it out? Is it a couple or an individual in there?

Thinking about my own experiences, the smallest I ever lived (other than three persons in a small dorm room for a few months due to overcrowding) was about 500 sq ft. As a single person that was pretty spacious imo. Although my wife, son and I are currently living in about 1200 sq ft comfortably. 2nd bathroom is clutch
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 9:14 PM
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You said you are renting it out? Is it a couple or an individual in there?
yeah, it was a studio condo that i purchased in 2007 right before the real estate collapse, so i was kinda locked into owning it for a while. when i moved out about 2.5 years ago, i rented it out to my cousin and her fiance (they've since gotten married). i know they're cramped in there with two people, but they say they love it because the location can't be beat. my cousin recently got a new job where she is making considerably more money than she used to, so i expect them to be moving out in the not too terribly distant future. she told me they want to trade up to a one-bedroom in marina city because, again, they both just love the central location so much.

when they do eventually move out, i haven't decided if i'm gonna try to sell it or find a new tenant. it would probably make some financial sense to keep it and rent it out for the time being. i'm no longer underwater on it, but i still think there's room to grow in the downtown chicago condo market that is ever so slowly starting to come back to life, so it'd be kind of dumb to sell it right now while prices are still depressed from the real estate collapse.
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 9:54 PM
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mhays, how much does a sub 200 Sq ft unit cost per month?
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  #19  
Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 10:27 PM
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No idea, but I vagely recall examples around $3/sf, plus a little extra for the common kitchen. Sometimes it's more like $4/sf, because you're still paying for the same bathroom plumbing/fixtures, cable hookup, and other things that cost more than blank space.
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Old Posted Jan 8, 2015, 11:01 PM
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What an odd perspective to write an article from, as though the burden lies on the neighbours for having to live near those people.
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