HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForumSkyscraper Posters
     
Welcome to the SkyscraperPage Forum.

Since 1999, SkyscraperPage.com's forum has been one of the most active skyscraper enthusiast communities on the web.  The global membership discusses development news and construction activity on projects from around the world, alongside discussions on urban design, architecture, transportation and many other topics.  SkyscraperPage.com also features unique skyscraper diagrams, a database of construction activity, and publishes popular skyscraper posters.

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Global Projects & Construction > General Development

Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #23541  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 2:37 AM
Skyguy_7's Avatar
Skyguy_7 Skyguy_7 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 353
With the laughable suburban vacancy rates, this development makes no sense to me. To think; Zurich could have gotten 130 N Franklin off the ground.. Not to mention their employees could have perhaps sparked the Spire. Wishful thinking I know, but get it together Rahm!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23542  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 3:02 AM
Tom Servo's Avatar
Tom Servo Tom Servo is offline
oops.
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Chicago
Posts: 2,895
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jibba View Post
This is a heinous monstrosity. Way, way too massive for that stretch of Broadway. And every elevation is too monolithic at that. 280 cars driving in and out of there? No way. This is terrible.
Agreed. Way too big and overbearing. AND it's ugly, generic crap.

Such a shame too; the previous design was solid. :/

Total let down.
__________________
There's a very subtle perfection in everything I do.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23543  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 3:59 AM
ardecila's Avatar
ardecila ardecila is offline
vertical
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: unconventionally bicoastal
Posts: 9,978
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyguy_7 View Post
With the laughable suburban vacancy rates, this development makes no sense to me. To think; Zurich could have gotten 130 N Franklin off the ground.. Not to mention their employees could have perhaps sparked the Spire. Wishful thinking I know, but get it together Rahm!
Not every company wants to be in the city, and not every company can be persuaded. Rahm has done far more than his predecessor in luring businesses to the city, but he has a huge advantage - technology companies crave young workers, and young educated people want to live/work in the city.

In other industries, like insurance (Zurich, Allstate, etc) they're not depending on a constant stream of fresh young faces, so they locate where the executives have an easy commute. They also value experience more than fresh thinking, so they prefer a suburban market where they have access to lots of older people in their 30s/40s who live in the suburbs to raise a family. Pharma also prefers the suburbs, because they can put offices, labs, and even manufacturing together in a unified campus. You definitely can't do that in the Loop.
__________________
la forme d'une ville change plus vite, hélas! que le coeur d'un mortel...
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23544  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 12:17 PM
Skyguy_7's Avatar
Skyguy_7 Skyguy_7 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 353
^I wasn't Rahm-bashing. Sarcasm is difficult to convey in text. You bring up some valid points that I've never considered. Several industries just wouldn't function in the city and it makes absolute sense. Thank you for the enlightenment.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23545  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 2:35 PM
joeg1985 joeg1985 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 119
That Zurich proposal would be a million times better if all that parking were underneath the new structure. I bet even their suburban employees would appreciate that.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23546  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 3:03 PM
XIII XIII is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 59
Wicker Park TJ's shaping up to be divisive:
http://www.dnainfo.com/chicago/20140...ort-opposition

It pains me to say it, but I sort of have to side with the "anti" crowd here. The neighborhood is definitely right for a TJ's, but Honore isn't a great street to host a supermarket worth of traffic. This would be fantastic on Ashland or Western (especially by the division blue line stop with a few floors of residential above it).

My worry is that TJ's comes in and Division snarls up like North has. The streets were just not designed to be major car-focused high-traffic streets.
__________________
"Chicago would do big things. Any fool could see that." - Ernest Hemingway
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23547  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 3:10 PM
emathias's Avatar
emathias emathias is offline
Adoptive Chicagoan
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: River North, Chicago, Illinois
Posts: 2,959
Quote:
Originally Posted by XIII View Post
Wicker Park TJ's shaping up to be divisive:
http://www.dnainfo.com/chicago/20140...ort-opposition

It pains me to say it, but I sort of have to side with the "anti" crowd here. The neighborhood is definitely right for a TJ's, but Honore isn't a great street to host a supermarket worth of traffic. This would be fantastic on Ashland or Western (especially by the division blue line stop with a few floors of residential above it).

My worry is that TJ's comes in and Division snarls up like North has. The streets were just not designed to be major car-focused high-traffic streets.
So your idea of urbanity is driving to get groceries and then also forcing everyone else to drive because you wouldn't allow grocery stores to locate in a walkable location? Right. That's just super.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23548  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 3:27 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 913
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyguy_7 View Post
With the laughable suburban vacancy rates, this development makes no sense to me. To think; Zurich could have gotten 130 N Franklin off the ground.. Not to mention their employees could have perhaps sparked the Spire. Wishful thinking I know, but get it together Rahm!
See that's what a lot of people don't seem to realize. A lot of companies in the suburbs just look at their buildings like temporary husks to occupy for 10 years and then turn over to the class B market after that. Just look at the Navistar move about 7 or 8 years ago where they left a nearly brand new office building that they had a long term lease on (one that is STILL going) and took space in another big ass, brand new office building. They've been paying double rent all these years as a result. Sounds like a lot of money to us, but to a multinational corporation it's really chump change off their bottom line.

I don't think the market is right yet to start seeing the industries like insurance or pharma moving into downtown, but I can tell you that it could happen in the future: see below.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyguy_7 View Post
Several industries just wouldn't function in the city and it makes absolute sense.
It's less of an issue of "wouldn't function in the city" and more of an issue of "wouldn't function in the loop". The key thing to keep in mind is that the city may wind up more appealing to such uses in the future as we see things happening like the plans for IMD being reworked and the technology scene continuing to boom. The problem we have right now is that we have no good sites to offer a company like Abbott or Takeda or Baxter. We could very well accommodate their huge campuses in the IMD if the city were to get serious about building up the available infrastructure there. Of course the biggest factor with these companies is that the talent pool necessary to operate is all in the north suburbs now. All the engineers, researchers, etc. are mainly baby boomers and mainly living in the northern burbs. This makes it very difficult for one big pharma to just pull up stakes and head for the city.

That's where the tech boom and tech institutes planned for the core come into play. As the population of baby boomers in the workforce begins to fall, there will be a lot more pressure to relocate to the city IF we can generate and retain engineering and scientific talent downtown. Rahm should really push to try to get a major medical research institute located in the IMD. If we can just reinforce that area with a few more talent generators, then we might have a chance at luring some of these suburbs industries into their own technology park downtown. As we all know, the skyline is already trying very hard to grow through the West Loop towards the IMD, so maybe we could see a 50 story Takeda Tower or something in 20 years at Ashland and Roosevelt if we play our cards right.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23549  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 3:53 PM
XIII XIII is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 59
Quote:
Originally Posted by emathias View Post
So your idea of urbanity is driving to get groceries and then also forcing everyone else to drive because you wouldn't allow grocery stores to locate in a walkable location? Right. That's just super.
How did you get that idea from my comment? I'll try to clarify here in case it was unclear before:
Any building with nearly 100 planned parking spaces is planning to serve a moderate level of auto traffic; more than any other business on the Division Wicker Park stretch.

I think that Division and Honore should remain as pedestrian as possible and that a building which is obviously car-focused be placed on a car-focused street so that it doesn't take away from what is now a pretty decent pedestrian stretch. I like the idea of having a TJ in WP, but not at the expense of the pedestrian experience. Ideally, it would be placed very near the Division blue line stop on Ashland so that it could optimally serve people who take transit as well as taking advantage of what is already a car focused street. Even more ideally, it would take advantage of proximity to transit and include an apartment stack above the grocery / parking.
__________________
"Chicago would do big things. Any fool could see that." - Ernest Hemingway
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23550  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 3:57 PM
joeg1985 joeg1985 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by emathias View Post
So your idea of urbanity is driving to get groceries and then also forcing everyone else to drive because you wouldn't allow grocery stores to locate in a walkable location? Right. That's just super.
I think that is the complete opposite of what XIII is saying. Walkability is an ideal we all share but the reality is putting this TJ's on Division will make for a less walkable Division Street. If, however, Trader Joe's decided to go for the fold and put zero parking spaces in at this location, then it would be totally welcome and increasing the walkability of the neighborhood.

I totally agree that a grocery store with parking should not go in at that location. How about put it on the Wendy's location next to the Tower of Pizza Hut.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23551  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 4:20 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 913
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeg1985 View Post
I totally agree that a grocery store with parking should not go in at that location. How about put it on the Wendy's location next to the Tower of Pizza Hut.
That was my thought as well. Better yet, put it where the Wendy's is with 5 floors of apartments on top!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23552  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 4:29 PM
Chi-Sky21 Chi-Sky21 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Chicago
Posts: 143
Aren't there some vacant lots just west of Ashland on division on the north side of the st? There is a huge parking lot behind there already. They can have Studio Gang design it since their offices are right there i believe. 8)

Last edited by Chi-Sky21; Apr 16, 2014 at 7:45 PM.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23553  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 5:14 PM
SamInTheLoop SamInTheLoop is offline
you know where I'll be
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,598
^^ ^^^ Can Wendy's still have a spot on the ground floor of the new development? Please? (I know, I have a problem!)
__________________
Smokin' NIMBYs Out of the Woodwork for Breakfast
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23554  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 5:20 PM
Hayward's Avatar
Hayward Hayward is offline
High above the Gold Coast
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Chicago
Posts: 6,185
Wasn't the original use of the site a lumber yard? That seems more invasive in terms of traffic with trucks and loading. I would believe TJ's would have higher efficiency in/out driveway traffic. I can't recall ever seeing the Diversey location causing traffic snarls.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23555  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 5:38 PM
Busy Bee's Avatar
Busy Bee Busy Bee is offline
Exhale solutions.
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 2,889
Quote:
Originally Posted by SamInTheLoop View Post
^^ ^^^ Can Wendy's still have a spot on the ground floor of the new development? Please? (I know, I have a problem!)
I'm right there with ya. Assssiiiiiaaaaaggggggoooooo
__________________
Nothing useless can be truly beautiful. -W.Morris | Nothing Need be Ugly
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23556  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 5:48 PM
joeg1985 joeg1985 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hayward View Post
Wasn't the original use of the site a lumber yard? That seems more invasive in terms of traffic with trucks and loading. I would believe TJ's would have higher efficiency in/out driveway traffic. I can't recall ever seeing the Diversey location causing traffic snarls.
How could a lumber yard possibly be more obtrusive to the street than a grocery store. I would think that hundreds of cars going in an out every hour would be way more intrusive than say 50 lumber trucks. But maybe there are a significantly larger amount of lumber trucks going in and out?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23557  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 7:21 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 913
Just drove by the Zurich site in Schaumburg. They are sure wasting no time getting going on it. The site is crawling with workers and looks like they are fast at work leveling the previous landscaping, moving utilities, etc.. There is an old two story 70s looking building on site, are they knocking that down?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23558  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 7:29 PM
the urban politician the urban politician is offline
The City
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Libertyville, IL
Posts: 10,106
^ I believe they are demo'ing the building on the site.

I know I am going against the grain here, but count me in as somebody who is excited about this project. I love the design, and unlike some I don't yearn for the suburbs to implode, I'd rather see us renovate and reuse what we have. This is the 1st new suburban office campus in 13 years, so clearly we don't get to see projects like this very often. Plus, a design like this could never get built downtown..
__________________
If God is your imaginary friend, so be it. But don't try to make him mine.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23559  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 7:30 PM
Link N. Parker Link N. Parker is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by XIII View Post
How did you get that idea from my comment? I'll try to clarify here in case it was unclear before:
Any building with nearly 100 planned parking spaces is planning to serve a moderate level of auto traffic; more than any other business on the Division Wicker Park stretch.

I think that Division and Honore should remain as pedestrian as possible and that a building which is obviously car-focused be placed on a car-focused street so that it doesn't take away from what is now a pretty decent pedestrian stretch. I like the idea of having a TJ in WP, but not at the expense of the pedestrian experience. Ideally, it would be placed very near the Division blue line stop on Ashland so that it could optimally serve people who take transit as well as taking advantage of what is already a car focused street. Even more ideally, it would take advantage of proximity to transit and include an apartment stack above the grocery / parking.
This has been my thought for the past couple of weeks as well...there is already an empty lot (currently being used by the WPAC) that is PERFECT for a grocery store, located accross the street from the Wendys....there is even already a curb cut in place that would work well for the traffic to go in and out of, thru the little alley way/parking area for the MB Bank....and, trucks delivering the groceries to the store can access the grocery building thru the alley way to the back of the property that is over at paulina and Milwaukee (you have to see it on a map to know what I am referring to). I think there was once a factory back here and the alley off of Paulina was the entrance for the factory workers.

Also, they can put 5 stories of apartments (and/or condos) on top of the new TJ's in this location across from the wendys...man I hope there are talks going on to make this happen....
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #23560  
Old Posted Apr 16, 2014, 7:30 PM
ChickeNES ChickeNES is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 10
New Townhouse Development Coming to The South Loop

April 16, 2014 - AJ LaTrace - Curbed Chicago

Quote:
The South Loop will soon be getting some new spacious residential units in the form of a townhome development planned for 1900 South Calumet Avenue. The current zoning for the lot allows for upwards of 31 units, however the developer Harbor Side LLC plans to only build seven units in the form of two buildings.
http://chicago.curbed.com/archives/2...south-loop.php

Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Global Projects & Construction > General Development
Forum Jump


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 4:33 AM.

     

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.