MEMPHIS | Development News

[Huntsvillenative]

Originally Posted by arkitekte

Memphis isn't in the top 15 cities as far as population in the U.S. City population doesn't equate a dense, tall skyline either; metro size sometimes does, but not in all cases. Nashville's skyline is becoming impressive, especially with Paramount and the proposed Marriott, but it looks nothing at all like Atlanta's.

It was top 15 at once, has now dropped to #20 as of 2013. http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0763098.html

[Wayward Memphian]

Originally Posted by Huntsvillenative

Memphis' skyline looks more like Little Rock's. Small with not much density at all for a city among the top15 largest cities in size. There needs to be at least one 40-50 story tower and a few more the size of the proposed 30-story One Beale tower to even start to be in comparison to Nashville's growing downtown skyline that is starting to resemble Atlanta's.

Actually Little Rock has the tallest amongst the two, but Memphis has way more mid sized buildings overall.

And I'm for Memphis' skyline being Memphis' skyline and letting Nashville be Nashville. Nashville will never have this

[arkitekte]

Originally Posted by Huntsvillenative

It was top 15 at once, has now dropped to #20 as of 2013. http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0763098.html

Yes, in the 1980's. 18th in 2000 and 20th in 2010. https://www.census.gov/dataviz/visualizations/007/

[nashvol85]

Originally Posted by arkitekte

Their Ananda IPA is legit. Tiny Bomb is pretty good as well.

Originally Posted by DoomJ

Tiny Bomb is my favorite. Any IPA they do is really good. Not a fan of the saison, but I don't really like those in general. Their Coffee Stout is decent, probably the 2nd best I've had (the Schlafly Coffee Stout is my favorite of that type), and next fall their octoberfest brew will spoil you- easily tops every other I've had.

Haven't had a chance yet to try much of the newer stuff. I know I had an Eternal General that was ok.

Thanks guys. I'll make it a point to try some next time I see them on the menu.

I'm definitely an IPA and Stout kind of guy. Sounds like a good fit!

[MEMFLY]

Hopefully we will hear news soon on One Beale, does anyone know how recently those renderings were put on the website?

[VSRJ]

Originally Posted by BnaBreaker

Huh? Not much density? The skyline of Memphis is all density. The height thing I'll give you, but density? Also, I've got to say that stuff like this irks me. We're all skyscraper geeks here obviously, or else we wouldn't be here. But stuff like you just said is truly, something only a skyscraper geek would say. No city "needs" a skyline of a certain height or size or density or level of modernity etc. etc...the skyline is all aesthetics and has nothing to do with how great a city is. You being from Huntsville of all places, should know this.

I agree with this 100%. For example, even though I'm admittedly envious of the height Nashville's skyline has, I'll take our gritty, historic density any day of the week.



From some angles, Nashville's skyline just looks odd. It's as if all of their skyscrapers were stretched horizontally. And the 750-footer they've got in the pipeline looks out of place. But that's just my opinion.

I think if our skyline had one or two modern 30- or 40-story towers, we'd be in great shape.

[MEMFLY]

Originally Posted by Huntsvillenative

Why was my post about Memphians having to pay for the new Graceland Hotel deleted? Why is everyone ignoring this?

Yes, if private investors won't take the risk of the Fairgrounds or Graceland, how would the government stand a chance.
Here's a pretty good article explaining it
http://taylorberger.com/dividing-by-zero/ .

[Wayward Memphian]

Originally Posted by MEMFLY

Yes, if private investors won't take the risk of the Fairgrounds or Graceland, how would the government stand a chance.
Here's a pretty good article explaining it
http://taylorberger.com/dividing-by-zero/ .

I'd like to see the overall future plan for Graceland again. It sure seems there's a much larger vision, and I think I read about some of the non hotel stuff. I know there was some positioning between the plane owners and Graceland. From what I remember, I thought it needed more pop.

As for the fairgrounds, there is a market for these little baseball tourney facilities. But what concerns me is that, is that there's no hook to it to set it apart. I saw this place while down in Texas over the summer that uses historical parks to create unique faux playing fields and is operated by a firm called Big League Dream, and this is only one location with a more further west.




Interestingly enough, there's a development like this aimed at Branson, which is basically in my back yard up here in NWA. The background is that Branson once had three outlet malls but time and the recession has pretty much condensed it to one, one is half vacant and used by a community college and one was completely closed down and turned over to city. It's called the Red Roof Mall. This one goes farther than other parks like this as they plan on using the existing mall buildings as dorms for teams, batting cage facilities store fronts for equipment makers and food vendors


The reason I bring that all up, why doesn't Memphis include a nod to the Negro League and do that type of treatment to the Fairground fields with their old ballparks with sculptures of Negro League Greats in the plaza areas between the fields and even a little museum.

[arkitekte]

Overall the redevelopment of the fairgrounds is a waste of space, particularly the ball fields. That's something that belongs in the suburbs, not in one of the city's most urban areas. The proposal to develop commercial space there is decent, but I think it needs to be theoretically driven by the private side and then somewhat facilitated and financed by the City. I don't have much faith in the City developing projects that they are marketing toward the private sector, but it is what it is. If the support was actually there for this project then I wouldn't necessarily have a problem, but the ball parks there are ridiculous and a waste of space. Is the space currently being used? No. Will it be used 5 years after the ball parks are completed? Probably not.

As far the City financing the stuff down at Graceland, I don't really have a problem with that. I wish they would put more emphasis on EP BLVD and cleaning it up, but overall the hotel and improvements and upgrades to the existing property should in theory bring in more sales tax money to Memphis overall. I still think it's all tacky (the ball parks and stuff at Graceland), but one of the two should have some success. They can't miss on both.

[Wayward Memphian]

Originally Posted by arkitekte

Overall the redevelopment of the fairgrounds is a waste of space, particularly the ball fields. That's something that belongs in the suburbs, not in one of the city's most urban areas. The proposal to develop commercial space there is decent, but I think it needs to be theoretically driven by the private side and then somewhat facilitated and financed by the City. I don't have much faith in the City developing projects that they are marketing toward the private sector, but it is what it is. If the support was actually there for this project then I wouldn't necessarily have a problem, but the ball parks there are ridiculous and a waste of space. Is the space currently being used? No. Will it be used 5 years after the ball parks are completed? Probably not.

As far the City financing the stuff down at Graceland, I don't really have a problem with that. I wish they would put more emphasis on EP BLVD and cleaning it up, but overall the hotel and improvements and upgrades to the existing property should in theory bring in more sales tax money to Memphis overall. I still think it's all tacky (the ball parks and stuff at Graceland), but one of the two should have some success. They can't miss on both.

I think they see the ballfields (and don't forget the basketball courts) as sweetener for hotel development, which in turn , helps out the Liberty Bowl. I understand your feelings and you know what I think about the stadium issue.

It's interesting, I was studying up on where Arkansas is playing and the Reliant Stadium in Houston holds 71,000 with a retractable dome would be around 430 million in today's dollars. I suppose we have lost track of what a stadium can cost with the extravagance of Jerry World and Atlanta's billion dollar dome. I wonder what a 55,000 to 60,000 seat dome without all the fancy roof systems and multiple giant video boards( one is enough) would actually cost as part of a larger project like a convention center with parking structures and infrastructure costs being shared.

[arkitekte]

Originally Posted by Wayward Memphian

I think they see the ballfields (and don't forget the basketball courts) as sweetener for hotel development, which in turn , helps out the Liberty Bowl. I understand your feelings and you know what I think about the stadium issue.

It's interesting, I was studying up on where Arkansas is playing and the Reliant Stadium in Houston holds 71,000 with a retractable dome would be around 430 million in today's dollars. I suppose we have lost track of what a stadium can cost with the extravagance of Jerry World and Atlanta's billion dollar dome. I wonder what a 55,000 to 60,000 seat dome without all the fancy roof systems and multiple giant video boards( one is enough) would actually cost as part of a larger project like a convention center with parking structures and infrastructure costs being shared.

I don't necessarily dislike the idea of the hotel at the fairgrounds. I think it would be fairly successful I just hope it doesn't look like the typical Howard Johnson junk that's off of every interstate exit (which is probably will). I just don't travel tournaments will work there. I don't think there's a need for the fields and there's certainly not support other than from individuals on the development side that will make money (If I were in Memphis still working in the private sector of the built environment I'd for sure as hell be pushing for this).

The stadium price tag isn't the issue. Funding it is. This isn't even a "Memphis" issue. Along with naming rights, which are sometimes a drop in the bucket, sometimes much more, there's going to have to be major funding through the purchasing of corporate suites. I don't know of many corporate corporations that would buy suites to an NFL scale stadium without NFL games.

Combining a 55,000 seat stadium with convention space large enough that's actually worth building, parking structures, infrastructure to handle that amount of people at one time, etc. would be pretty expensive. Upgrading the infrastructure downtown to handle that would be mind boggling. The economic impact from the conventions would cover that cost easily, but the stadium funding has the hole.

Funding one with tax payer money will never get easier as long as their building t ball fields.

[kingchef]

the renderings of this building have had more changes than a leopard has spots. however, the wording has changed slightly in the 7 year absence. one beale hinged on two words, they were iconic and tallest. if ark's 350-400ft is to be believed, well, we have been shorted. memphis already has buildings---yes (s) that exceed 400 ft. two are down town, and the tallest building in the city happens to be clark tower, on the poplar corridor.

mr. carlisle stated specifically in this last rendering, which in my opinion, looks something like the side of one of the st. francis towers, that the building would be iconic and it would show both the past memphis (where we have been) and where we are going. no mention of impressive, finest, tallest, skyline-altering, etc. consequently, if it is not significantly taller...well, i'll just say you can't say mine is bigger than yours. as for the other adjectives, it could still be very impressive, beautiful, significantly different from what memphians have seen---but, one could see a man he has known for a good part of his life, but when he meets up with the old friend years later, he finds out that his bud's leg has been taken from the hip down. renderings started with two towers, now there is only one. i guess one tower is significantly different in this case, so he has technically kept his word. we probably won't be able to see it everywhere in the city, but at least we will see it---i hope---and good things will come from the building of it. he is pouring quite a bit of money in both this project and his part of the chisca project.

[arkitekte]

Originally Posted by kingchef

he is pouring quite a bit of money for both this project and his part of the chisca project.

Indeed he is. While we're not going to get much height with One Beale, but the activation at the street level and the increase in pedestrian traffic will benefit the block and surrounding blocks in an amazing way. The same for the Chisca. That's previously been one of the major holes along South Main. Once the added pedestrian traffic makes an impact there will for sure be new restaurants and bars to follow.

[PillowTalk4]

Originally Posted by VSRJ

I agree with this 100%. For example, even though I'm admittedly envious of the height Nashville's skyline has, I'll take our gritty, historic density any day of the week.



From some angles, Nashville's skyline just looks odd. It's as if all of their skyscrapers were stretched horizontally. And the 750-footer they've got in the pipeline looks out of place. But that's just my opinion.

I think if our skyline had one or two modern 30- or 40-story towers, we'd be in great shape.

I think the best view of Nashville's skyline is along the east side. The view I hate the most and for some reason HGTV seems to be in love with is the one with the river view. The Cumberland just isn't significant enough to try and make it part of the Nashville skyline. It's not the Mississippi or Tennessee river. As the SoBro area continues to grow it will shift the Nashville skyline more southward. Can't wait to see the completion of the Bridgestone headquarters (30 stories), The SoBro Tower (32 stories) and the Turnberry Towers Complex (JW Marriott 35 stories, ofc tower 25 stories). Nashville's density is getting stronger as there's a lot more infill taking place along with the larger scale projects. If things continue to progress in mid-town it will truly have its own skyline.

Nashville's skyline is far off from Atlanta's. I don't see Nashville or any other southern city growing to the magnitude. It would be nice to see Memphis get a few new towers. I think it would really make the skyline more attractive driving across the river.

[kingchef]

i really don't look for many people from outside of memphs to like any structures or buildings, regardless of the size. first memphis doesn't need nashville's approval, nor do i think many memphians care what they think. i talked to a good friend of mine, who lives in nashville. he brought up haslam and how hoakey he seems to be, but more than that, his apparent need to regularly tell a lie or two. i think pilot has already been slapped around three or four times over issues of price gouging on over the road issues, violations concerning tracking, etc. the
big thing about his administration and their about face re:
taxation and pilot programs supported by the state for movies, commercials, and other media. of course it wasn't something Tn could afford to get into---even though he had to know that dallas II and the other one that was pretty much the same thing, but nashville has a pretty good history of "borrowing" the work of others, city or individuals.

i haven't seen the show, but my friend is so mad about it he talked for about 20 minutes on the presentation of the city. rednecks, cowboy boots, country twang, middle tn, trailer trash, big wigs, and, according to him, just hix being made fun of, and the folks in the picture too carried away w/ themselves to care. however, we both knew about the state financing of the test pilot and the 32 mil sunk into it. the second season got at least 15 million dollars, but the proposed 3rd season got a no, after some of the numbers were seen, and a typical "corrupt government" stealing and funneling the money underhandedly qualifies at least one angel wing to a broken state. things like this are not unusual in nashville, after all the eye and the money goes through there first. i think nashville ought to ask the producers from whatever state they happen to hail, to do another hee haw.

[PillowTalk4]

Why is there such much hate between Memphis and Nashville in the first place? I'm not sure who said that Memphis needs Nashville's approval, I certainly didn't and in no way implied it. I want to see all of Tennessee prosper. And, regardless of what anyone thinks of my opinion it is just that, my opinion. I don't speak for anyone else. I'm originally from Nashville and I love the city in which I was born and raised. But I don't like or dislike another city because of some comparison to Nashville. I've been blessed to have been able to travel to practically every major metropolitan and most mid-major metropolitan area in this country. I see things that I wish Nashville had all the time. When I travel home to Nashville there I things I love, and I mostly love that it is a growing region and seeing the city transform. But, I also see things that I dislike and hope that those things will be improved upon.

[nashvol85]

Originally Posted by PillowTalk4

Why is there such much hate between Memphis and Nashville in the first place? I'm not sure who said that Memphis needs Nashville's approval, I certainly didn't and in no way implied it. I want to see all of Tennessee prosper. And, regardless of what anyone thinks of my opinion it is just that, my opinion. I don't speak for anyone else. I'm originally from Nashville and I love the city in which I was born and raised. But I don't like or dislike another city because of some comparison to Nashville. I've been blessed to have been able to travel to practically every major metropolitan and most mid-major metropolitan area in this country. I see things that I wish Nashville had all the time. When I travel home to Nashville there I things I love, and I mostly love that it is a growing region and seeing the city transform. But, I also see things that I dislike and hope that those things will be improved upon.

Don't worry about it. Just another one of kingchef's drunk, nonsensical rants.

[Dale]

Sorry to hijack the thread, but will the 100 North Main renovation touch on the exterior ?

[Chris Warren]

Not really since it applied for historic funding.

[VSRJ]

Originally Posted by Dale

Sorry to hijack the thread, but will the 100 North Main renovation touch on the exterior ?

I wish it would. For being our tallest building, it sure is a bland one. But at least maybe we'll see a neon light/sign at the top again. That would help a little.