Booze in Canada: Laws and Culture

[rapid_business]

Renaming this thread 'Canadian Booze Thread'....

[davidivivid]

Originally Posted by rbt

Probably. If you're in Toronto anytime soon, check out the Summerhill LCBO. I've not run into very many stores in North America that can match their selection.

I'll sure do. That being said, I think I'll never be fully satisfied with wine stores in either Ontario and Quebec. I've lived in Bordeaux for about 8 months a few years ago and I was drinking great red wines every day for the equivalent of pocket change...

Originally Posted by rbt

As an Ontarian who travels frequently and probably drinks far too much wine

Tell me about it!!!

For lunch:
http://www.saq.com/webapp/wcs/stores...&top_category=

[Gerrard]

Apologies for continuing to keep this thread off-track but I've never seen a liquor store in Canada match the quality and selection and prices of *Total Wine* in the southern U.S.

Imagine a Home Depot size store devoted to Beer, Wine & Liquor.

Imagine heaven.

[The Gibbroni]

[QUOTE=MonkeyRonin;5719120]

Here are the major differences in alcohol laws between Quebec and Ontario:

a. bars can serve until 3 am in Quebec; in Ontario its 2 am, or 4 am during special events.
b. corner stores in Quebec can sell beer & wine; in Ontario they cannot.
c. stores have to stop the sale of alcohol at 11 pm in Quebec; 10 pm in Ontario.
d. drinking age in Quebec is 18; drinking age in Ontario is 19
e. in some situations you can sorta-legally drink in public in Quebec (such as in a public park with a meal); there are no such situations in Ontario.

(wow! Its practically like comparing Berlin to Saudi Arabia, isn't it!)

I see. If those are the only differences then I'll assume that in Toronto you:

a. can go to a concert/festival at Dundas Square, NPS, Pecaut, Harbourfront etc. and buy a drink while you take in the show (and not in a beer tent/garden)
b. buy a drink on Yonge, Queen etc. during Scotiabank Nuit Blanche or any other festival
c. have a neighbourhood street party where alcohol is allowed/sold
d. organize a BYOB music festival in a public park
e. hold an event in a church parking lot where alcohol is allowed/sold
f. have a drink at a parade without having to disguise the fact
g. show up at a festival in a park where bottles and cans are banned but they give you a cup to transfer your drink into
h. bring a cooler of food and drinks to Toronto Indy
g. go to an event at Rogers Centre or ACC with 5 friends and buy a round for everyone in your group without having to bring 2 others with you
h. have a patio that serves alcohol that isn't surrounded by a fence of some sort
i. buy a drink from roaming beer and shot vendors at outdoor concerts and festivals
j. hang out in front of your corner beer store and have a beer while you shoot the breeze with your neighbours and the guy who works there
k. bring a few drinks to an underpass party that the police won't immediately shut down
l. attend fireworks on a bridge where bottles and cans are banned but the cop tells you "It doesn't start for 15 minutes" and motions you next to his cruiser where groups of people- who also brought bottles and cans- are finishing them off before heading onto the bridge
m. play baseball or soccer in a park with a cooler of beer on the sidelines (that you don't have to hide)
n. wander the entire waterfront with the hot coffee and brandy that you bought off a vendor

Gee, Toronto is just like Montréal!

Nice comment (you drunk right now?), but completely missed the point.

This is the typical Ontario reaction to anyone who wants to be treated like an adult: "Guy must be a raging alcoholic who drinks 24hrs a day and wants to double-fist king cans while walking down the street menacing children and puking on upstanding business people!" When in actual fact, they would like to enjoy an occasional drink without having to go a. home or b. to a bar

The Beer Store counts on this mentality to retain their iron grip (think of the children!)

Don't play dumb. But I'm not about to go sifting through your old habfanman posts looking for the comments in question.

You've never been too lazy to sift through my posts before, why now? If you're going to accuse me of making some heinous remark then I would suggest you find it and post it rather than continually alluding to it. You wouldn't want people to doubt its existence, would you?

[MonkeyRonin]

Originally Posted by The Gibbroni

This is the typical Ontario reaction to anyone who wants to be treated like an adult: "Guy must be a raging alcoholic who drinks 24hrs a day and wants to double-fist king cans while walking down the street menacing children and puking on upstanding business people!"

I ask if you're drunk because your posts and arguments are incoherent (as you've made once again), not because you care so deeply about drinking (you've certainly got the "raging" part down right though - but I know thats just your repulsive personality, not alcohol ).

As for the rest of that stuff you wrote, read over the last page. The "beer garden" laws are gone, festival licensing is more or less the same now. And as I and other people who actually live in Toronto (here in the year 2012, not 1980) have repeatedly verified, I/we have never had a problem openly drinking in public parks, at parades & festivals, at unregulated outdoor parties, even while walking around Kensington or whatever. We all know Quebec's liquor laws are freer (but still very outdated), but that they somehow result in the exact opposite experience of Ontario is a figment of your imagination.

As for the "third world people" stuff, I'm sure I'm not the only one who remembers those borderline racist remarks.

[The Gibbroni]

, [QUOTE=MonkeyRonin;5720245]

I/we have never had a problem openly drinking in public parks, at parades & festivals, at unregulated outdoor parties, even while walking around Kensington or whatever.

There's a bit of a difference between sneaking around like a high school kid tasting the forbidden fruit (we've all done that) and having actual, progressive policies. You can't compare hiding in a park with one eye open for "Cops man! Hide it!" or waking around Kensington "hee hee! I've got rye in my coke bottle hee hee!" and having 200,000 people attend a downtown concert on a site dotted with drink stands and vendors walking around selling drinks. It's night and day.

As for the "third world people" stuff, I'm sure I'm not the only one who remembers those borderline racist remarks.

Look monkeyboy, you either POST THIS ALLEGED REMARK NOW or I'll be asking the moderators to do something about you. I'll not be slimed by some punk saying "We all remember whatever something something you said.. nudge nudge.. wink.. wink.. really bad whatever it was.. nudge nudge.."

[The Gibbroni]

[QUOTE=MonkeyRonin;5720245]

I'm sure I'm not the only one who remembers those borderline racist remarks.

Well, where is it? What was it? I'm waiting...

[MonkeyRonin]

Originally Posted by The Gibbroni

There's a bit of a difference between sneaking around like a high school kid tasting the forbidden fruit (we've all done that) and having actual, progressive policies. You can't compare hiding in a park with one eye open for "Cops man! Hide it!" or waking around Kensington "hee hee! I've got rye in my coke bottle hee hee!" and having 200,000 people attend a downtown concert on a site dotted with drink stands and vendors walking around selling drinks. It's night and day.

Note the "openly drinking" part - that implies that there is no "hiding" involved.

Look monkeyboy, you either POST THIS ALLEGED REMARK NOW or I'll be asking the moderators to do something about you. I'll not be slimed by some punk saying "We all remember whatever something something you said.. nudge nudge.. wink.. wink.. really bad whatever it was.. nudge nudge.."

LOL, SSP's #1 troll threatening to sic the mods on me?

Though, just to jog your memory, here's one: "the 3rd world people"

[rousseau]

It's long been a Stratford tradition to have wine with a picnic lunch along the lake. Nothing furtive about it. But a crew of twenty-something yokels wouldn't slam down a case of Bud in the back of a pickup truck along that same lake because, well, drinking in public's illegal. Or, at least, they'd do it furtively, later at night when it's dark.

It's a class thing.

The other day my wife and I decided we wanted to make jerk chicken. I rode over to the grocery store for provisions, and then to the LCBO for rum, but it had already closed at 6 pm. It was a Sunday. I was pissed off about it. This is stupid! I thought.

So yeah, I wish we had more liberal licensing laws, but I'm not about to run into the streets and protest about it. We made the jerk sauce the next day. It's not life or death. Actually, things will change gradually over time as the weight of logic bears down on the issue. Which is how it should be. Same with marijuana and prostitution. And Super Mario's moustache. When enough people reasonably agree that something should change, it will change.

[The Gibbroni]

Originally Posted by MonkeyRonin

Note the "openly drinking" part - that implies that there is no "hiding" involved.




LOL, SSP's #1 troll threatening to sic the mods on me?

Though, just to jog your memory, here's one: "the 3rd world people"

Oh my! Are we not allowed to point out that we're no longer a major draw for people from other developed nations? Is it wrong to point out that the vast majority of people who come to Canada are fleeing third-world poverty and political chaos and that they would probably go to any developed country?

Good one.

[MonkeyRonin]

Originally Posted by The Gibbroni

Oh my! Are we not allowed to point out that we're no longer a major draw for people from other developed nations? Is it wrong to point out that the vast majority of people who come to Canada are fleeing third-world poverty and political chaos and that they would probably go to any developed country?

Good one.

Try again. Here's what you said:

"Toronto? = Major Embarrassment..But the 3rd world people dig it. They arrive in droves. They must love touring condo construction sites."

Its not outwardly racist, but it does have a contemptuous tone towards the lesser people (thats the implication).

[The Gibbroni]

Originally Posted by MonkeyRonin

Try again. Here's what you said:

"Toronto? = Major Embarrassment..But the 3rd world people dig it. They arrive in droves. They must love touring condo construction sites."

Its not outwardly racist, but it does have a contemptuous tone towards the lesser people (thats the implication).

The implication is that somebody arriving from Lahore or Chengdu will be pretty happy simply to have found an orderly place where people aren't dying on the streets under a cloud of smog or where their internet is being censored and they can be jailed for talking about Tiananmen Square. They're less likely to care about street furniture design or crappy infrastructure and amenities. People from Copenhagen or Berlin, on the other hand, may tend to find such things a bit startling.

[WhipperSnapper]

I don't understand the need to carry beer with you at all times and my background is Bavarian. Anyways, the idea that you must hide it or face arrest is absurd. Police simply don't have the time unless you are underage or drunk. The industry has been giving out thousands of free bottles at intersections throughout downtown. The days where you had to fill out paperwork to purchase booze is long over.

[The Gibbroni]

Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper

I don't understand the need to carry beer with you at all times and my background is Bavarian. Anyways, the idea that you must hide it or face arrest is absurd. Police simply don't have the time unless you are underage or drunk. The industry has been giving out thousands of free bottles at intersections throughout downtown. The days where you had to fill out paperwork to purchase booze is long over.

It's not about "carrying a beer at all times" it's about going to a concert downtown, buying a drink, and wandering around the site like a civilized human being or going to the park with your partner and splitting a bottle of wine on the grass. And don't tell me that if a Metro cop shows up you're not going to hide your drink or that there will be no repercussions. Bullshit. You're not going to go to jail but there will be a pour out or maybe a ticket. They're not going to simply walk by and you're not going to simply sit/stand there.

The irony is that these 'control' laws negatively affect the casual drinker moreso than the hoser. If the nearest beer store is a km away and it closes at 9 (or 10 or 8 or 5 or is it Tuesday or Friday or a holiday or is it the one 2 km's in the other direction that's open late on Saturday or...), a person who just wants a 6 pack may end up buying 24 just to save the hassle of having to go back anytime soon. A festival goer who only wants one drink isn't likely to stand in line for 30 minutes- they'll just forget about it- or end up buying two, seeing as they just invested 30 minutes of their time. The hoser will stand in line for as long as it takes, buy the maximum possible and get right back in line again or spend the entire time in the beer tent/garden, knowing that's the only way they can get the max 'enjoyment'. It's a policy designed to fail because it encourages people to buy more, not less. The more restrictions in place the larger the package sizes.

[niwell]

Originally Posted by The Gibbroni

And don't tell me that if a Metro cop shows up you're not going to hide your drink or that there will be no repercussions. Bullshit. You're not going to go to jail but there will be a pour out or maybe a ticket. They're not going to simply walk by and you're not going to simply sit/stand there.

They absolutely do, at least in certain locations. There is a fairly constant police presence in Trinity Bellwoods park and I have never seen anyone get ticketed except drunk crust punks. People can and do drink out in the open all the time with very little worry. I've never once worried about hiding a beer even with a cop no more than 20 feet away. Maybe this is a new thing over the past few years but that is the way it currently is.

I think you'd find if you wanted a rational discussion about government policy surrounding alcohol most here would agree with you. And many Ontarians in this and other threads have expressed their disappointment with our current laws and the slow rate at which they are changing (and yes they are changing). But you aren't interested in that - everything has to be a jab about how horrible Toronto is. This is a running theme.

For what it's worth the ONLY place I have ever been stopped for open carry was in Montreal. At the corner of Prince Arthur and Durocher - the police made us empty our beers. I don't hold it against the place though and complain on the internet, I was a dumb 19 year old at the time and probably acting like an idiot. They also assumed we were graffiti artists but I digress.

[The Gibbroni]

[QUOTE=niwell;5720420]

everything has to be a jab about how horrible Toronto is.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!

I was a dumb 19 year old at the time

And now you're older.

probably acting like an idiot.

That'll get your drink poured anywhere, even Germany.

[kool maudit]

look, the beer thing? it's better to be able to get it at the dep. of course it is. similarly, l.a. is better than montreal because if you feel like a martini at like 11 p.m. and have nothing in the place, you can run across to the cvs on la cienega and beverly (this, as you probably guessed, actually happened, and it turned out to be a great night for everyone except the sofitel cleaning staff).

that said, it's not the first stick that i'm going to pick up for inter-provincial rivalry-type stuff. it's a detail; important to some, less so to others. it doesn't underscore any vast difference in outlook between montrealers and torontonians. it's slight and peripheral.

[MonkeyRonin]

Originally Posted by The Gibbroni

Metro cop

More proof you have no idea what you talk about: "Metro cops" haven't existed for 14 years.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz!

Hey, you're the guy who's spent the last 4 years dedicated to exposing the world to the evils of Toronto, one internet forum at a time!

[The Gibbroni]

[QUOTE=MonkeyRonin;5720454]

More proof you have no idea what you talk about: "Metro cops" haven't existed for 14 years.

lol! Whatever. The Skydome hasn't existed for 7 years either but if someone still refers to it as Skydome does that mean everything they say about everything else in the world is wrong?

Hey, you're the guy who's spent the last 4 years dedicated to exposing the world to the evils of Toronto, one internet forum at a time!

monkeyboy, I now live in the most criticized city in the most criticized province in the country. Who cares?

Say anything the least bit unfavourable about Toronto and you get jumped on by a million 'We're World Classers'. Grow up.

[Innsertnamehere]

trust me, us torontonians can take a couple hits. heck, we complain about our city alot too. but when almost every post made by a forumer somehow manages to insult toronto, even when it is in response to something that doesn't involve toronto at all, we get a little bit annoyed.