Investors Group Field | Winnipeg

[Danny D Oh]

I wonder at what point the individuals who actually planned the thing are tossed into the fray.

[blueandgoldguy]

Tens of millions to replace the concourse!? Wow. Never thought it would be that much.

A year or two ago I seem to remember our own TrueViking saying that significant extra costs would arise with IGF. Wonder if there will be any other additional flaws that will be have to be corrected in the stadium?

[cllew]

I am just getting ready to go to work tonight and just heard an ad for Stewart Olson Construction on the radio (CJOB) saying how they do good work in Winnipeg and realize that I have heard it a few times this week.

Now with the cross claim coming out I have to wonder on the timing of their ads. Do they think their reputation is tarnished with the stadium and convention center (hotel) projects?

[CoryB]

I would guess that part of the cost for the concourse reconstruction is going to be hauling out the debris by hand. The weight restrictions which this is being done to address likely limit the use of any equipment to haul out the concrete as it is removed. It will also be interesting how they get the new concrete into the concourse.

[cllew]

Originally Posted by CoryB

I would guess that part of the cost for the concourse reconstruction is going to be hauling out the debris by hand. The weight restrictions which this is being done to address likely limit the use of any equipment to haul out the concrete as it is removed. It will also be interesting how they get the new concrete into the concourse.

Would the concrete not be pumped into the concourse?

[North_Regina_Boy]

They will also need to build structural forms to brace the new concrete up whilst they place rebar and pour the new slabs. THIS with the fit-up all done undernearth will require likely taking it all out placing in the forms. Doing the work. Then placing it all back. THIS will be the part that is likely to cost Millions of $$$.

[biguc]

Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy

Tens of millions to replace the concourse!? Wow. Never thought it would be that much.

A year or two ago I seem to remember our own TrueViking saying that significant extra costs would arise with IGF. Wonder if there will be any other additional flaws that will be have to be corrected in the stadium?

That he did. He made a really strong case against Ray Wan as the architect. As he put it, there are a handful of firms qualified to design stadiums. Obviously, a discount strip-mall architect from Winnipeg isn't one of them.

Ray Wan flew too close to the sun and he's going to get burned for it. Hopefully not too badly, though. The B3 folks should have known better when they hired him.

[Danny D Oh]

Originally Posted by cllew

I am just getting ready to go to work tonight and just heard an ad for Stewart Olson Construction on the radio (CJOB) saying how they do good work in Winnipeg and realize that I have heard it a few times this week.

Now with the cross claim coming out I have to wonder on the timing of their ads. Do they think their reputation is tarnished with the stadium and convention center (hotel) projects?

They also won the bid to rebuild the old residence at the U of M, name of which I am blanking on right now, but were consistently far behind on deadlines and eventually the U of M re-tendered it.

They have downsized their operation in Winnipeg in the last couple years. I'm wondering if they'll even be interested in this market once they are done with the Convention Centre. Lost a lot of money here, depending on how the lawsuits settle.

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by biguc

That he did. He made a really strong case against Ray Wan as the architect. As he put it, there are a handful of firms qualified to design stadiums. Obviously, a discount strip-mall architect from Winnipeg isn't one of them.

Ray Wan flew too close to the sun and he's going to get burned for it. Hopefully not too badly, though. The B3 folks should have known better when they hired him.

Was that their decision or had David Asper decided that for them as well! (kind of a good will gesture after getting his cheque for the great design and location he chose)

[North_Regina_Boy]

I am so happy that the New Mosaic Stadium was designed by HKS Architecture firm.

You can't say their resume is bad:

AT&T Stadium
Lucus Oil Stadium
Vikings Stadium

to name a few.

[osmo]

Originally Posted by North_Regina_Boy

I am so happy that the New Mosaic Stadium was designed by HKS Architecture firm.

You can't say their resume is bad:

AT&T Stadium
Lucus Oil Stadium
Vikings Stadium

to name a few.

Basically this. You pay to play. Don't hire some Firm that makes Bulk Barns and Extreme Pitas for a stucco strip mall to build a large sporting complex. There is a reason many firms specialize in this because you need a specific way to approach these projects but it can easily be copied else where once you figure that way out.

You wouldn't hire a firm that builds suburban bungalows to design and build you a skyscraper, why they thought using some random local firm shows the flaws in being to much of a homer for big ticket projects like this. Get the best for the job who offers you the best price, does not matter if they are from Winnipeg or Warsaw, Poland.

IGF numbers didn't make much sense. The roof was a significant cost which left pennies for everything else so it is no surprise to see these issues now.

I moaned years ago that the materials they were using were crap. The project had many red flags from the start but I think people got lost on being upset with the botched timeline versus the components of the structure being put into place.

[blueandgoldguy]

Originally Posted by osmo

Basically this. You pay to play. Don't hire some Firm that makes Bulk Barns and Extreme Pitas for a stucco strip mall to build a large sporting complex. There is a reason many firms specialize in this because you need a specific way to approach these projects but it can easily be copied else where once you figure that way out.

You wouldn't hire a firm that builds suburban bungalows to design and build you a skyscraper, why they thought using some random local firm shows the flaws in being to much of a homer for big ticket projects like this. Get the best for the job who offers you the best price, does not matter if they are from Winnipeg or Warsaw, Poland.

IGF numbers didn't make much sense. The roof was a significant cost which left pennies for everything else so it is no surprise to see these issues now.

I moaned years ago that the materials they were using were crap. The project had many red flags from the start but I think people got lost on being upset with the botched timeline versus the components of the structure being put into place.

What specific materials are crap? Give specific examples otherwise I'm inclined to believe you are making things up.

Maybe it isn't the composition of the concrete on the concourse that is questionable but the conditions under which it was set.

[esquire]

For what it's worth, HOK Sport came up with the general design concept for IGF and Ray Wan drove it home... I didn't think it was as though this project was designed start to finish by Wan.

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by cllew

Would the concrete not be pumped into the concourse?

From the closest you can get a concrete truck to some of those points on the concourse would be a long run. Is that even possible?

[Stormer]

Originally Posted by CoryB

From the closest you can get a concrete truck to some of those points on the concourse would be a long run. Is that even possible?

1000'+ is quite doable. The limits are more on height than linear.

[ba_split]

Its seems the BIGGEST issue is the cracking concrete---Has anyone heard why this has happened? I've heard they have to move Beer Kegs by hand as no equipment is allowed in the concourse.

Is it something as simple as the Conc. too thin?

[blueandgoldguy]

Originally Posted by ba_split

Its seems the BIGGEST issue is the cracking concrete---Has anyone heard why this has happened? I've heard they have to move Beer Kegs by hand as no equipment is allowed in the concourse.

Is it something as simple as the Conc. too thin?

Well according to one poster it's because the materials are crap.

[drew]

Originally Posted by ba_split

Its seems the BIGGEST issue is the cracking concrete---Has anyone heard why this has happened? I've heard they have to move Beer Kegs by hand as no equipment is allowed in the concourse.

Is it something as simple as the Conc. too thin?

There is any number of reasons that concrete can crack, and not all of them are of an immediate structural concern.

The concourses are likely (although I don't know for sure) steel deck with concrete topping. In this case, if the decking is strong enough to span on it's on, the concrete is just the finish, and not important structurally speaking.

The bigger concern is likely the durability of the concrete and long term corrosion of the steel deck. The cracks are in an exterior environment which allows for freeze/thaw action that will eventually make a mess of the surface.

[trueviking]

I don't think the issue in the upper deck is the concrete itself. It's the waterproof membrane underneath. I think that's why they are saying they won't know the extent until it is exposed. They also have to re-pour slopes into the floors and create a drainage system.

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by esquire

For what it's worth, HOK Sport came up with the general design concept for IGF and Ray Wan drove it home... I didn't think it was as though this project was designed start to finish by Wan.

That's not actually true. HOK was let go at a very preliminary stage. Preliminary bowl layout as I understand. They were gone long before a site was even chosen.

They were not even paid for the work they did, which is an indication of the level of their involvement....among other things.