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  #141  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2008, 5:30 PM
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Originally Posted by bigcanuck View Post
Helmets should be viewed like seatbelts in a car. Even though you may claim to be an excellent driver, sometimes things happen that are simply out of your control. Same on the slopes. It's better to be safe...
To me, wearing a helmet whilt going down the runs is overkill, I'm much more concerned about breaking my legs. Using them in tree runs or in the terrain park (as I said before) is a no brainer.
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  #142  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2008, 8:14 PM
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To me, wearing a helmet whilt going down the runs is overkill, I'm much more concerned about breaking my legs. Using them in tree runs or in the terrain park (as I said before) is a no brainer.
I broke down & got a helmet last year. All I will say is that they are a lot more comfortable & less bulky than the ones we used when I used to race back in the late '80's/ early 90's
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  #143  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2008, 10:50 PM
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I always wear a helmet. For snowboarders, like myself.. the last thing I'm worried about are my legs. For me, it's my head and wrists.

I've hit a tree before - and thankfully, only broke my collar bone and shoulder - but I was about 6 inches away from hitting my forehead..

Since then, I use a helmet - and even wear wrist guards under my jacket.

The worst thing ever is being out for a season due to some stupid injury...
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  #144  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2008, 11:19 PM
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Originally Posted by freeweed View Post
You are aware that it's the responsibility of a skier/boarder to watch out for people ahead of them, regardless of what they're doing, right?

I didn't realize that making a turn while going downhill was against the rules.
I'm well aware of the rules of the hill. I, for one usually alerts a person if I'm about to over take them. Especially, if they're making wide sweeping turns or if they're all over the place.

Nothing wrong with making a turn or two.
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  #145  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2008, 11:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Kevin_foster View Post
I always wear a helmet. For snowboarders, like myself.. the last thing I'm worried about are my legs. For me, it's my head and wrists.

I've hit a tree before - and thankfully, only broke my collar bone and shoulder - but I was about 6 inches away from hitting my forehead..

Since then, I use a helmet - and even wear wrist guards under my jacket.

The worst thing ever is being out for a season due to some stupid injury...
If you know how to fall, breaking your wrist shouldn't be a concern, as for legs, if you are in deep powder, it's always possible for the end of your board to dig into the snow causing you to fall awkwardly, that's my concern.
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  #146  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2008, 11:23 PM
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Originally Posted by johnnyc View Post
To me, wearing a helmet whilt going down the runs is overkill, I'm much more concerned about breaking my legs. Using them in tree runs or in the terrain park (as I said before) is a no brainer.
I don't know about that. I knew a lady who fell going down Goat's Eye, started sliding downhill, hit her head on a rock and knocked herself unconscious. Luckily for her, a Ski Patrol was on the same run caught up to her and stopped her descent. She now has a plastic plate in her head.
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  #147  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2008, 12:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Ramsayfarian View Post
I, for one usually alerts a person if I'm about to over take them.
Hence the need to be able to hear clearly.

Don't get me wrong, I don't flail around like an idiot on a black run or anything, but some people, nearly always snowboarders, think it's perfectly acceptable to come within about 12" of another - while going 30kph or more.

I tend to hear their board long before they shout a warning.

Don't even get me started at the lunacy that is the ski-out at Sunshine. I've already learned to stay well to the side, as apparently "slow zone" means "go as fast as you possibly can down this green run with obvious amateurs in front of you - and get as close as you possibly can, because there's just no chance they'll move over a foot or two".

I find that keeping defensive driving attitudes in mind is a MUST when it comes to younger boarders. Certainly not all, or even most. Like everything, the few ruin it for the rest.
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  #148  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2008, 2:54 AM
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Originally Posted by freeweed View Post
Don't even get me started at the lunacy that is the ski-out at Sunshine. I've already learned to stay well to the side, as apparently "slow zone" means "go as fast as you possibly can down this green run with obvious amateurs in front of you - and get as close as you possibly can, because there's just no chance they'll move over a foot or two".
The problem isnt the speeding lunatics, its the idiots who feel the need to do "S" turns on a 20' wide ski out.
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  #149  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2008, 4:26 AM
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Originally Posted by freeweed View Post

Don't even get me started at the lunacy that is the ski-out at Sunshine. I've already learned to stay well to the side, as apparently "slow zone" means "go as fast as you possibly can down this green run with obvious amateurs in front of you - and get as close as you possibly can, because there's just no chance they'll move over a foot or two".

I find that keeping defensive driving attitudes in mind is a MUST when it comes to younger boarders. Certainly not all, or even most. Like everything, the few ruin it for the rest.

One person's amateur is another's pylon. Personally, I avoid the ski out at Sunshine at all costs, that run is an injury waiting to happen. Same thing for Angels' Traverse.

Being aware of ones surroundings is a must regardless of if you're a boarder or skier.

As you've had numerous incidents of boarders passing to close for comfort, I've had more that a few incidents of skiers of all ages passing me on my blindside.
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  #150  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2008, 5:46 AM
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Originally Posted by ExcaliburKid View Post
The problem isnt the speeding lunatics, its the idiots who feel the need to do "S" turns on a 20' wide ski out.
Actually, in a clearly marked slow zone, the problem is by definition the speeders.

You might as well point the blame at the children in a 30km/h playground zone.

I will say that Sunshine seems to have an abundance of areas where black runs suddenly turn into narrow greens and blues (aforementioned traverse, Goat's Eye) - which certainly just makes for trouble. It's like putting a school zone on the Deerfoot. A school zone that runs uphill at such a steep angle that half the cars on the road can't accelerate up it.
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  #151  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2008, 5:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Ramsayfarian View Post
One person's amateur is another's pylon.
Well, there's something to be said about treating a fellow human being as an obstacle, but I do catch your drift.
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  #152  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2008, 6:57 AM
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Originally Posted by ExcaliburKid View Post
The problem isnt the speeding lunatics, its the idiots who feel the need to do "S" turns on a 20' wide ski out.
I agree 100%
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  #153  
Old Posted Jan 31, 2008, 3:49 PM
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Originally Posted by freeweed View Post
Don't even get me started at the lunacy that is the ski-out at Sunshine. I've already learned to stay well to the side, as apparently "slow zone" means "go as fast as you possibly can down this green run with obvious amateurs in front of you - and get as close as you possibly can, because there's just no chance they'll move over a foot or two".
This comment and the others regarding the ski out (both perspectives) is why I refuse to ski out anymore. Either you've got hotshots flying through there or people who just aren't careful enough about where they're going. Too many people of too many skill levels going down too narrow of a run.
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  #154  
Old Posted Feb 4, 2008, 4:39 AM
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Shrediquette: Skiing manners

Came across this tonight:

As bad behavior seems to mount on the slopes, ski areas teach some manners and punish offenders to make sure snow sports stay civil.
By Nancy Lofholm
The Denver Post
Article Last Updated: 02/03/2008 03:51:31 PM MST

(Helen H. Richardson, The Denver Post)

GRAND JUNCTION — Snowboarders plopped across the middle of runs chatting on cellphones. Gondola cars reeking of smoke. Red Bull cans littering the snow under lifts. Shredders turning black runs blue with their "F-bombs."

Powder hounds are decrying conduct more expected in malls and high school hallways than on the snowy slopes where controlled schussing used to be the norm but shredding — today's term for tearing up the slopes — is now customary.

In some cases, boorish behavior is simply annoying. In others, it can snowball into court battles.

That happened recently at Beaver Creek resort when a 7-year-old skied over the backs of a 60-year-old man's skis, purportedly injuring him. The man screamed at the boy and later filed a personal-injury lawsuit.

"That takes rudeness to a whole other level," said Vail skier Jim Farrell, who admits he can get a little testy when someone slams the chairlift safety bar down on his head.

Colorado's 26 ski areas are stepping up with both proactive and punitive measures designed to ensure civility stays as much a part of the snow experience as face plants.

The ski areas don't want to be seen as heavy-handed, "tsk-tsk" disciplinarians because, after all, snow sports are about having fun and pushing the limits of pitch and powder.

But they are nonetheless trying to get their politeness point across with everything from up-front etiquette tips to finger-wagging warnings. Repeat or over-the-top offenders have been slapped with temporary loss of passes, mandatory safety classes or permanently pulled passes.

"Keep it fun, keep it clean," terrain-park and youth marketing manager for Winter Park resort Bob Holme counsels users. "And if you compromise safety, your pass can be pulled."

Winter Park is the first ski area in Colorado to add a tangible incentive for good behavior — an advanced terrain park that only those who toe the line on rules can use.

Shredders and freeriders — skiers who do tricks — must watch a 15-minute video on safety and civility before they earn the privilege of using the top-shelf-cool jumps and rails in the park called Dark Territory. If they don't follow the rules, the special passes for this area are pulled.

"Our message is, 'This is a cool and mellow place. Keep it that way,' " Holme said.

Steamboat Ski and Resort Association is promoting a SlopeWise safety program. Ski-patrol members go to area schools and colleges to stump for education and awareness. Information on proper slope behavior — from not butting into lift lines to the proper way to exit a chairlift — is included in all brochures that go out to guests.

The resort also added 14 "courtesy patrol" positions to help make sure snow riders are minding their p's and q's.

All of that seems to be having some effect.

"I think the whole skier-versus-snowboarder thing has kind of settled down. There's a peace there now," said Par Arnone, a two-decade local at Steamboat. "Back in the day, it used to be common to see skiers hollering at snowboarders, but we really haven't seen much of that anymore."

Maybe it's been reversed.

Amie Johnson said the buzz among her snowboarding friends at the recent X Games in Snowmass was all about how annoying skiers are.

"They were all saying skiers are taking up the whole slope, carving big turns all the way across. They create traffic jams for the 'boarders," Johnson said. "The 'boarders spray them with snow on purpose."

Breckenridge Ski Resort is trying to cut back on that kind of behavior by adding a new department, the Mountain Safety division, to make visitors aware that there are rules. The division gives presentations to church groups, ski clubs and other organizations that book group reservations. Members of the groups get the talk before they ever strap on their boots.

Besides stressing the Skier Responsibility Code that addresses safety issues, Breckenridge officials give the biblical-sounding injunction to "treat others as you would like to be treated."

"Everybody needs to understand that this is a public place, and there are all kinds of people out there with all kinds of morals and ethics," said Ryen Malinchak, Breckenridge ski-safety manager.

When rule violators at Breckenridge have their passes pulled, as has happened about 50 times this season for skiing outside the ropes, they must go through a two-hour safety awareness class before they are allowed back on the lifts.

January was Learn to Ski/Ride Month in Colorado, and some Colorado ski officials think those lessons are key to gold-star behavior on the mountains.

"Lessons are more than just learning the technical movements. They are also an introduction to the sport and the Skier Responsibility Code," said Jennifer Rudolph with Colorado Ski County USA.

Jen DeBerge of Winter Park said that area is offering deals on lessons because of a belief that education is the best way to lessen problems. "We give people the power to learn how to ski appropriately."

Longtime skiers say much of the poor manners lies with newcomers who don't take advantage of that education.

"They can get out there and not have a clue to the courtesies and rules of the mountain," said Kent Foster, who has been skiing since 1959.

Foster and others attribute some of the downhill slide to the fact that decades ago, skiers were usually introduced to the sport by their parents and learned mountain etiquette by example in a family setting. Also, the equipment back then required more skill, which ruled out skiing for those not serious about the sport.

Nowadays, snowboards and shaped skis have made it possible for the sometimes uncouth masses to slide down a mountain in much greater numbers — a record 12 million in Colorado last season. They do it with more ease — and speed.

Avid Powderhorn Resort skier Ben Potter compares problem ski slopes to clogged freeways.

"It's a factor of numbers," he said. "When you get more drivers on the road, there are bound to be more bad drivers."

The slope traffic problem is obviously worse at busy areas closest to metro Denver. But the overall dip in safe and thoughtful snow riders hasn't bypassed the smaller areas. Even the little family-oriented Powderhorn near Grand Junction has pulled a handful of passes this year.

"Traffic is going so much faster," said Bill Bruchak, director of the ski patrol at Powderhorn.

"The advance in equipment makes beginners think they are intermediates and intermediates think they are bulletproof. Anymore, a 4-by-8 orange 'Slow' sign doesn't work. We have to have a person stand there and slow traffic down."

Powderhorn has taken to posting tips of the day such as, "The person downhill has the right of way." The resort also has gone beyond some ski areas with enforcement of violations of common decency.

Loud foul language first merits a warning and if it continues, passes are pulled.

"We call them 'F-bombers,' and if we encounter them, we take their ticket," Bruchak said.

Malinchak said the solution may ultimately lie in licensing or certification for skiers or 'boarders before they ever hit the slopes. It would work much like having to demonstrate some skills and knowledge before driving a car.

"The trend is going to start heading that way. We need to set a standard in the industry so we're not just allowing anybody up there without some sort of instruction," he said. "I think people would embrace that and realize resorts are trying to provide a safe experience."
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  #155  
Old Posted Feb 4, 2008, 5:21 AM
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Interesting read. One thing I definitely can take from that, which doesn't seem to be all that well understood, it the "turning a black into a blue" phenomenom. I'm guilty as hell about this, myself - but I've tried to learn damn quick how to minimize my damage.

Everyone at some stage manages to hit a run they're just not technically ready to do - hell, it's how we learn. I think the trick is to try to stay out of the way, pay attention to people behind you, and don't slowly plow back and forth the entire way down when there are clearly people piled up behind you trying to go. Especially on some of the natural choke points where many runs converge.

Unfortunately many runs due to their design don't seem to really have an "escape route" of any sort, so someone in over their head really has no choice but to take it VERY easy. Sadly too many do it by pretending they're on a green run.

Then again, I've actually seen the ski school people at Sunshine stop a group in a complete blind spot, right where people are going to be going pretty quick. Anyone not paying close attention and those situations could turn ugly fast.

Is Sunshine worse than other hills for having blacks and greens merging together? I've seen some bowls at other hills that look solid black, so you'd think that would prevent at least *some* of the danger of highly differing skill levels.
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  #156  
Old Posted Feb 4, 2008, 4:51 PM
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Is Sunshine worse than other hills for having blacks and greens merging together? I've seen some bowls at other hills that look solid black, so you'd think that would prevent at least *some* of the danger of highly differing skill levels.

I don't think Sunshine is worse or better than other hills. While it all depends on the hill, I think it's almost impossible not to have black runs merge/turn into green runs at some point. as mountains usually become less steeper at the bottom, plus there has to be a way for the skiers to get back to the lifts.
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  #157  
Old Posted Feb 4, 2008, 4:55 PM
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Revelstoke Rush

From Saturday's Globe and Mail


The Globe and Mail

Revelstoke, B.C. —

I am falling. No. I am floating. It is fleeting. And it is beautiful.

High above the Columbia River, on Mount Mackenzie near remote Revelstoke, B.C., I am beyond the boundaries of a new ski resort, blowing down a route dubbed Tastes Great. And it does. Deep snow in mid-December billows up, fat pillows of white stuff weighing down boughs of tight, towering balsam firs and spruce trees, darting and dodging through, floating and falling.

Whistler-Blackcomb was the first place I tasted this kind of alpine ecstasy, an adventure extended for an entire winter years later in Austria. Red Mountain in south-central B.C. is also in the league, though the snowfall there is now irregular and the season shorter. As it is in too many places.

But a long and often arduous drive five hours west of Calgary, winter has barely begun even though it seems like the middle of February. A storm is storming, and the fleeting feeling of ecstasy is recaptured, reconjured — and, unexpectedly, improbably, bettered.

"The tree skiing here is friggin ¡K It's as good as it gets," a smiling Paul Skelton„©, president of the resort, says after a run. Then, the Whistler-Blackcomb transplant (as many new Revy locals are) adds, "This is a steep mountain."

It's a very correct, if coy, assessment of the 1,443-metre mountain. But then Revelstoke Mountain Resort„©, opened Dec. 22, resists instincts against hyperbole. Every run — inbounds and out — vaults the place to the No. 2 rank among Canadian ski areas, just behind the Whistler-Blackcomb duo. And it is a raw, wild mountain. Modest humility is the tack to take.

This place, which for years featured just one small and slow double-chair climbing only a short distance up Mount Mackenzie, is a destination known by powder purists worldwide for its backcountry. It leaves visitors to enjoy its wonders in humble solitude, without the trappings of other resorts. Even on a weekend, it can feel almost empty.

But in the 1990s, a Toronto real-estate developer kick-started what would become Revelstoke Mountain Resort — a $1-billion project to create the biggest and best new ski area in North America in more than a quarter-century.

And while the slopes certainly tend towards the difficult, expansion plans include beginners runs far up the mountain, so novices as well as adventurers can enjoy the expansive, blindingly white views.

It is this snow, about 15 metres a year, that is the reason for the many millions of dollars pouring in. Accessible remoteness is what Revelstoke Mountain sells, underpinned by what is fairly called a climate-change real-estate play with plans for 5,000 housing units at the base.

Think: In 20 years, where will it snow? Here ain't a bad bet.

Whether the thousands of skiers who came to opening day bode badly for the emptiness of these snowy slopes remains to be seen. But as in business, one must look where the smart money — and smart people — moves.

In Europe, there's a sinking feeling in the alps as snow disappears (last year, one resort facing bankruptcy was sold for one Swiss franc). And starting with a trickle, circa 2000, there has been a notable migration from the Canadian pleasures of Whistler to Revy.

Founded in the late 19th century when the Canadian Pacific Railway was hammered through the Rockies, Revelstoke is a quaint and quiet town of Victorian homes with a population of less than 10,000. But by late December, 1,400 season passes had already been sold, drawing buyers from B.C., Alberta and as far away as Hawaii, Sweden and Australia.

"When I first came here, I thought, 'Where have I moved to?' But I absolutely love it," says Karleena Taylor, a bartender at the River City Pub. Originally from Australia, the 34-year-old arrived in 2006 after a long stint in Whistler. "Nice people are coming to town. New shops are opening."

Among those new establishments are Kawakubo„©, a "sushi sake steak" joint that brings a taste of Whistler and downtown Toronto to remote Revy. Just west of town, there's also the Great White North Bar & Grill„© — opened by long-time Whistler locals Jason Worby and his wife, Natasha.

Another memory from Whistler, a moose head in a toque emblazoned with a Canadian flag, has been relocated from the famous Dusty's Bar & Grill„©. But no one wants this town to become that town. A wooden sign and an arrow pointing westwards indicate the direction to those looking for more action: "Whistler: 544 km."

In fact, the arrival of a massive new ski area has left some in the region jarred. Housing prices have surged rapidly. And a local report in December told the tale of an elderly woman evicted from her apartment after the heritage home's new European owner decided he didn't want a tenant.

"It's phenomenal what's going to happen. There's dreams out here. But the town is not prepared at all," Harry Lightfoot, 48, says over a beer after a day of construction on a new house in town.

A saving grace is the location of Revelstoke Mountain, about a 20-minute drive up to the base from the centre of town, which probably means that Revy's charms won't be completely torched even as condos and million-dollar homes, some with private helicopter pads, are built at the ski area.

Helicopters. For years, they were the mode of transport for moneyed visitors, the ones with more cash than those on snowmobiles and less interest in hiking up through forests with skins on skis.

And last year Revelstoke Mountain bought a local heli-ski outfit and a Cat skiing operation to complement the inbounds adventure at the resort.

Plans are also in the works to sell an unusual mountain pass based not on one-day access, but on vertical metres — to be spent at the ski area or beyond, accessing runs by hovering helicopter or crawling Cats.

At present, there are two main lifts, an eight-person gondola and a speedy, four-person chairlift, together rising to the second-highest vertical in Canada. Next year, the gondola will be extended to about 1,800 metres and several superb high-alpine bowls — currently reached only by Cat — will eventually be accessible by lift.

For now, those "stuck" inbounds because of a lack of sufficient funds have a bonanza in North Bowl, a quick skip left from the top quad and a wonder of steep pitches, open slopes and tight trees.

On the opposite side of North Bowl is also a trio of tree-skiing triumphs: Roller Coaster, Hot Sauce and Jalapeno are more than enough for an entire day of thrills on the mountain.

But for all the "extreme" terrain, a true showcase of the beating heart of Revelstoke Mountain has to be Snow Rodeo, a top-to-bottom gem that is easily handled by confident intermediates.

Standing akimbo at the top of the mountain, I briefly assess the wonderfully long run before pointing downhill, letting gravity pull me. Snow Rodeo is arguably the single best piste in all of Canada, an epic that never seems to deviate at all from the natural fall line, rolling and rambling all the way down to the bottom.

It's the kind of run that leaves enthusiasts and experts no other instinct but to go right back to the top and do it again. And again. Until, really, either the legs give out or the sun sets. Ecstasy is an elusive emotion; Revy's got it in buckets.

David Ebner is a member of The Globe and Mail's Calgary bureau.
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  #158  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2008, 10:36 PM
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Just got back from the RMR, didn't take any photos as the viz was nil, but here's a few from the other day.



Vista shot of the Columbia River



Hiking up the Sub-peak



The actual peak. If you look below it and to the right, you'll see my friend who dragged my fat ass up the mountain. She eventually gave up waiting for me and continued on. I talked to her later that evening and she hiked up here 2 more times that afternoon.


Well worth the hike:


To give you all an idea on the amount of snow we get here, here's a shot from our kitchen window. The structure in the foreground is our carport/garage. The flat roof is a pain in the arse, but it saves the view.

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  #159  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2008, 10:44 PM
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Just got back from the RMR, didn't take any photos as the viz was nil
Of course, Revy always is, but it's generally warmer than Golden, and more snow.
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  #160  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2008, 10:54 PM
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Of course, Revy always is, but it's generally warmer than Golden, and more snow.
I'm gladly trading poor viz for more snow. I just use yellow lenses and ride the trees. Plus, I've found that the viz can change pretty quickly here.
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