Mueller Redevelopment Update Thread

[MightyYoda]

Originally Posted by austlar1

The one is SW Austin is in the front of the shopping center where Costco and Whole Foods are located on Wm. Cannon b/w Mopac and Brush Creek right next to the Kerbey Lane. I thought you lived fairly close to this area, Kevin?

I practically live at the new one off 1431. It's actually one of my favorite designed Torchys so far. The restaurant is split by a indoor/outdoor full service bar in the middle that is half inside and half outside under the patio.

[KevinFromTexas]

Originally Posted by austlar1

The one is SW Austin is in the front of the shopping center where Costco and Whole Foods are located on Wm. Cannon b/w Mopac and Brush Creek right next to the Kerbey Lane. I thought you lived fairly close to this area, Kevin?

We're slightly east of Manchaca Road just a thousand feet or so north of Stassney Lane. Our main grocery store is the HEB at William Cannon and Brodie, though, I prefer the one at South First & William Cannon because it's smaller and I can ride my bike to it. So that area near Mopac is a wee further than we usually go for stuff.

I just wish they'd build one along Stassney some place. It would do well there since ACC and Crockett High are just down the street. I wish they'd do something with those awful surface lots in those shopping centers. They have so much potential.

[Syndic]

11/18/13

The AISD Performing Arts Center is making good progress.

[Digatisdi]

There's a lot of work being done east of the tower, and one thing that's pretty interesting is the view on Google Maps of the area showing a whole bunch of the planned streets that really gives a nice feel as to how the area's going to turn out.

[Syndic]

I figured I'd provide everyone with an update on how the AISD Performing Arts Center has developed.

From this evening:



I like how it's set right up by the sidewalk and not pushed back in the lot like you usually see in the suburbs.

[brando]

I wish there was an update on the progress being made on the actual old airport site. It's been acres of dirt for a while with construction vehicles running around doing something. You can't really tell what it is exactly.

[austlar1]

Originally Posted by Syndic

I figured I'd provide everyone with an update on how the AISD Performing Arts Center has developed.

From this evening:



I like how it's set right up by the sidewalk and not pushed back in the lot like you usually see in the suburbs.

This is a nice looking building? Is it going to be used to host AISD events? If so, what kind of events? Presumably it will be available to other users as well. Hard to imagine AISD using the facility all that frequently.

[MichaelB]

Originally Posted by austlar1

This is a nice looking building? Is it going to be used to host AISD events? If so, what kind of events? Presumably it will be available to other users as well. Hard to imagine AISD using the facility all that frequently.

I'm sure it will be difficult to find an empty date.
It will be used by any AISD High school for events:
Concerts, plays, special events, graduations…… UIL events. I'm sure AISD administrative events as well.
Most schools don't have enough
space for all the events on their own campus or space large enough.

[Slappy]

Originally Posted by MichaelB

I'm sure it will be difficult to find an empty date.
It will be used by any AISD High school for events:
Concerts, plays, special events, graduations…… UIL events. I'm sure AISD administrative events as well.
Most schools don't have enough
space for all the events on their own campus or space large enough.

Exactly. Our elementary school (Pease) uses the Delco Center for performances because we have no auditorium space that could hold that many parents & grandparents. This will be a welcome addition and easier to get to as well.

[nixcity]

While not completely disappointed with this project as a whole I sure wish we would have done what Edmonton is doing at their old airport.
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...=188965&page=2

[Syndic]

All of the planned roads are showing up on Google Maps now. You just have to zoom in.

[Digatisdi]

I'm willing to bet significant portions of Vaughan, Sorin, Briones, Teaff, Tilley, McCurdy, and Tom Miler streets will be paved by the end of the month.

I also have a feeling that I'll be more happy with Mueller as the mixed-use buildings are built but as it stands I can't say I'm disappointed.

I'm guessing the Town Center part is still held up by transit studies or whatever?

[Jdawgboy]

The main problem I have is with the master plan. Correct me if im wrong but from my understanding It's a final one time plan that doesn't change with the times. It would make more sense if the plan was evaluated every 3 to 5 years or so. I don't see why it has to be so rigid. It was finalized before the Imagine Austin growth plan and doesn't incorporate new density.

[AusTxDevelopment]

Originally Posted by Jdawgboy

The main problem I have is with the master plan. Correct me if im wrong but from my understanding It's a final one time plan that doesn't change with the times. It would make more sense if the plan was evaluated every 3 to 5 years or so. I don't see why it has to be so rigid. It was finalized before the Imagine Austin growth plan and doesn't incorporate new density.

The reason it's not re-evaluated is because it was set up as a master-planned PUD (Planned Unit Development). In order to get federal subsidies and other financial incentives including $10M from the US Dept of Energy, they planned the entire thing out from the beginning to incorporate a variety of elements, including the residential, commercial, retail, apartments, the Dell Medical site and the future UT Research site. Once the PUD is approved and in place, you can't really change it up without going through the whole process all over again. It takes months and sometimes years to get a PUD approved. It takes almost as long to get one amended. Because its a master plan, a change to one part of it changes the entire thing. Sometimes it just can't be reworked after they're half-way through.

To get around that you can parcel out a large development into phases, and have each phases' site development plan approved separately as you go along, but you lose all the advantages of the PUD by doing it that way. You also run into a lot of extra infrastructure cost for roads, water and sewer lines that can only be partially completed and have to be extended into the next section at a later date. Very expensive way to do it.

One of the advantages of a PUD is that you can build buildings in ways that would be prohibited by city ordinances otherwise. That is how Mueller got the ridiculously dense single-family housing through. I think Mueller is, if not the most dense, definitely in the top 5 most dense single-family residential developments in Austin. There are no front yards and you can almost touch the wall of your neighbor's house through your bedroom window. However, 25% of Mueller's single-family homes are designated as affordable housing, which is great.

While the housing is incredibly dense, the apartments and commercial buildings could definitely have been planned more densely. Also, the tallest planned building for Mueller is 11 stories, which is way too low in my opinion, especially since they don't have height restrictions.*

*I'm pretty sure about that but if someone knows more please correct me.

[M1EK]

The Town Center is held up because they never took it seriously. And their overall density is not that great; and their mixed use and urbanism is basically 1990's vision of 2020 (kind of like how some attractions at Epcot Center aged so poorly because they were never updated to take actual events into account).

I don't believe the current plan has any 11 story buildings in it. Even the Town Center's new rendering still looks like 4-story VMU surrounded by some parking garages.

http://www.aldrichstreet.com/

[AusTxDevelopment]

Originally Posted by M1EK

The Town Center is held up because they never took it seriously. And their overall density is not that great; and their mixed use and urbanism is basically 1990's vision of 2020 (kind of like how some attractions at Epcot Center aged so poorly because they were never updated to take actual events into account).

I don't believe the current plan has any 11 story buildings in it. Even the Town Center's new rendering still looks like 4-story VMU surrounded by some parking garages.

Yeah, I went back and looked at the marketing materials. Currently Oxford Commercial is marketing the office buildings in the Aldrich Street district - which used to be called Town Center on all of Catellus' old marketing materials - and the tallest building they show is 7 stories. Catellus did have some taller buildings proposed, but that was quite a while ago. One of their selling points back in the day was that the tallest buildings would be at the center of the development and they would get shorter as you moved outward so no one's views would be blocked. Looks like they abandoned that idea. If you want to see what was originally planned you can download the Mueller Design Book from 2004 (link below) that shows the master plan that was agreed to by Catellus and the City of Austin. But only if you are REALLY interested. It's 166 pages.

http://www.muelleraustin.com/uploads...0low%20res.pdf

[Jdawgboy]

I can see the pros of a PUD, but it's visibly plain to see the cons. This could have been a dense node not far from DT. Luckily we may be able to still have something like that with ACC's highland development. I think it's possible that we will see some taller buildings planned in the future for that area.

[KevinFromTexas]

There's no reason why Mueller couldn't have some height. I remember reading somewhere that the children's hospital mentioned they could have built a 15-story building, but decided to go the different route.

[Syndic]

Originally Posted by Digatisdi

I'm willing to bet significant portions of Vaughan, Sorin, Briones, Teaff, Tilley, McCurdy, and Tom Miler streets will be paved by the end of the month.

Indeed. I went by there the other day and the curbs were already in. The paving isn't too far off.

Originally Posted by M1EK

The Town Center is held up because they never took it seriously. And their overall density is not that great; and their mixed use and urbanism is basically 1990's vision of 2020 (kind of like how some attractions at Epcot Center aged so poorly because they were never updated to take actual events into account).

I don't believe the current plan has any 11 story buildings in it. Even the Town Center's new rendering still looks like 4-story VMU surrounded by some parking garages.

http://www.aldrichstreet.com/

Whoa. This is the first time I'm seeing this rendering. So many parking garages. It's interesting seeing the actual plans for some of these lots/buildings. That parking garage north of the Thinkery has bare concrete walls right now. But apparently they plan to build some townhouses around the outside of it? Hmm, okay. I like that they're putting a cinema in that location, right next to a children's museum. That will make for a good afternoon with your family. I hope it's a Drafthouse, but I doubt it will be. Even a Flix Brewhouse would be cool, which is basically a cheaper, less pretentious version of the Drafthouse.

Here's a few closer looks:







Unlike many of you, I don't really care about imagining what Mueller could have been. That's a tired, dated conversation. It doesn't interest me. I'm just appreciating it for what it is. It's similar to The Domain. Once you stop expecting it to be something else, you'll be able to accept it and derive some modest enjoyment in seeing it develop.

Say what you will, but it's an important development for Austin. It's adding (some) density and and attractions, not far from the city center. If that stops some suburban sprawl then it will be a net positive.

[SecretAgentMan]

The Mueller PUD allows buildings up to 120' between Aldrich and Mueller Boulevard. They likely won't get built that tall unless rail is at least approved to extend to Mueller by the time they file site plans for them. Without rail, the trip limitations in the Transportation Impact Analysis (TIA) will probably be exceeded unless density is reduced elsewhere.