DENVER | Transportation Thread

[TakeFive]

Originally Posted by seventwenty

Delays Push Back G Line Opening

http://denver.cbslocal.com/2016/10/0...-line-opening/

Sounds like a good plan. They've obviously struggled to get the A Line operating right. Issues with crossings seem to be the most perplexing and needing humans to guard automatic gates is silly and costly. I believe they're hoping to have the crossing issues cleaned up over the next couple of months; we'll see.


It makes a difference... Time

Image courtesy: The Subway Nut

"Miami’s Metrorail at 30: Promises kept, promises broken"
MAY 11, 2014 By Alfonso Chardy - Miami Herald

When it opened at 6 a.m. May 20, 1984, Metrorail’s elevated trains ran only 11 miles, stopping at 10 stations from Overtown to Dadeland South.
Today, average weekday ridership stands at more than 70,000 — a vast improvement over the scant 6,000 average daily trips the system reported shortly after it opened.

Miami's Metrorail has never quite lived up to the hype but that's at least partly due to being way over-hyped to begin with.

At the time, county officials promised a 52- or 54-mile system that would go to Miami International Airport, Miami Beach and other destinations, and carry more than 200,000 riders a day.

After three decades of operation, the system grew to just 25 miles, added only one line — to MIA

The more important takeaway is that while it did take (lots of) time, ultimately Miami's Metrorail has proved indispensable.

While Metrorail did not ride vacant for decades, it was only after its second decade of operation, in 2004, that ridership began increasing steadily. By the end of 1984, average daily ridership had risen to about 16,000. Twenty years later, it stood at almost 52,000. And in 2008, average daily ridership shot up to more than 62,000. The increase has continued. Figures for March 2014 show average daily ridership at 76,500.

Assuming you were alive and alert at the time, think back to what Denver was like in 1984. Now the easy part... visualize Denver today.

While it's clear that RTD/FasTracks lines could benefit from stronger ridership, I would submit that with respect to timing, it should be a lot easier to grow ridership from this point forward than it would have been in 1984 - like in Miami. Still, it could be a decade or longer before more robust ridership occurs.

[The Dirt]

I heard that the software issue is already resolved but they have to continue to man the gates and slow the trains as part continued testing before it's certified as fixed

[TakeFive]

That sounds sooo much better than a wish and a prayer. Let's hope they can accomplish this.... soon.

[Cirrus]

SLC is updating its transit master plan and as part of their public feedback they have a neat "design your own transit system" online tool.

[PLANSIT]

Originally Posted by Cirrus

SLC is updating its transit master plan and as part of their public feedback they have a neat "design your own transit system" online tool.

Denver will have the same tool for Denver Moves: Transit

(NN is the consultant)

[TakeFive]

I did a quick check... bcuz why not and I was curious.

SLC's 1st line was opened in 1999 for about $22 million per mile. I believe that Denver's SW Line came at a comparable cost. In 2011 Utah opened two new lines at a cost of $57.6 million per mile which is very similar to FasTracks costs.

Phoenix's 1st 20-mile line cost about $70 million per mile. Considering it was an urban/street line with nicer rolling stock that's presumably quite good. Their next planned line going through EIS steps, will be a 5 mile line through the "barrios" of So. Phx to their southernmost neighborhood/suburb. It's penciled near $150 million per mile but that cost is likely skewed by the need for grade separation with the Amtrak/freight tracks just south of downtown.

And that's your costs update of the week and month.

[TakeFive]

"It’s a complex system.”

Credit: Penguin Group USA Per iTunes/Apple

With the most at-grade crossings with 17 the G Line ain't opening until the software is fixed.

Pretty good article in today's DBJ about fixing the pain with the trains. The most relevant part:

“Our focus is getting ourselves and the regulators comfortable with new wireless technology, complete the required gate crossing modifications, and lift the waivers. Denver Transit Partners and RTD have added considerable resources to support this effort and ultimately to achieve our shared goals.

RTD and DTO are testing a software update to the crossing gate system during the few hours in the middle of the night when there are no passengers on the trains. They’re hoping that the FRA next week will agree to allow the software to be tested on the G line, RTD spokesman Nate Currey said.

[TakeFive]

Originally Posted by TakeFive

2018 - The Year of Great Infrastructure

Looks like I was off by about six months. I was thinking the spring of 2018 but it's looking like November of 2017. We'll have to see how close my guess of $950 million is and if about half goes to transportation.

"What does Denver need to build a better city? Planning kicks off for 2017 bond measure"
Oct 20, 2016 by Cathy Proctor - Denver Business Journal

Denver officials say they will spend the next year gathering input on what the city needs for new infrastructure, after which they will ask voters next year to approve a new bond request — called the GO Bond — to pay for those needs.

Any hints about priorities?

City officials also will use Denver’s 2015-2020 Six Year Capital Improvement Plan, called Elevate2020, that identified major needs for rehabilitation and new infrastructure with a priority on building, transportation and park needs, including road infrastructure that "supports drivers, bikes, pedestrians, and transit."

[The Dirt]

I went to the Denver Moves meeting a couple of weeks ago. If my input and the input of other participants has any weight, you should see the following:
1) Colfax Streetcar (downtown to Fitz)
2) Downtown transit tunnel (probably down 15th from the capitol to DUS)
- this could extend the Colfax streetcar and/or provide dedicated bus lanes through downtown and into Lower Highland
3) Extension of the Central Corridor Light Rail (funding)
4) BRT/Enhanced buses for Broadway between the I-25 and Broadway station and downtown; Cherry Creek; Federal; Colorado Blvd.
5) W line speed enhancements through western Denver

I'm sure I'm missing a few other suggestions. I would have taken a picture of the map but I forgot my phone that day.

[DUPio]

Can they please remove the Mile High stop when there aren't events? That seems like such an obvious way to reduce transit time.

Also were any other suggestions made a la Colorado Blvd?

[texcolo]

I was walking through Arvada, I live right next to the Arvada Ridge Station, one of the guys they have manning the crossings 24 hours a day, stated that they aren't even running test trains yet.

[Fritzdude]

Originally Posted by DUPio

Can they please remove the Mile High stop when there aren't events? That seems like such an obvious way to reduce transit time.

Agree completely. Make the stop only on days where there is an event at Mile High. Otherwise, that location needs to be skipped.

[Fritzdude]

Originally Posted by The Dirt

I went to the Denver Moves meeting a couple of weeks ago. If my input and the input of other participants has any weight, you should see the following:
1) Colfax Streetcar (downtown to Fitz)
2) Downtown transit tunnel (probably down 15th from the capitol to DUS)
- this could extend the Colfax streetcar and/or provide dedicated bus lanes through downtown and into Lower Highland
3) Extension of the Central Corridor Light Rail (funding)
4) BRT/Enhanced buses for Broadway between the I-25 and Broadway station and downtown; Cherry Creek; Federal; Colorado Blvd.
5) W line speed enhancements through western Denver

I'm sure I'm missing a few other suggestions. I would have taken a picture of the map but I forgot my phone that day.

All good priorities. However, I don't understand the need for a transit tunnel down 15th.

I find it hard to believe that Speer continually gets overlooked. The next 10 years is going to add a bunch of cholesterol to the main artery connecting Cherry Creek to Denver with more dense neighborhoods in Golden Triangle, Cherry Creek going vertical, Auraria campus getting built out, The Highlands getting more dense, and the CBD continually growing.

I like the idea of a light rail down Colfax, but a similar light rail down Speer would be very helpful, too.

[The Dirt]

A transit tunnel is needed to connect the two downtown transit hubs (DUS and Civic Center) and relieve pressure from the 16th street mall shuttle. Regarding Speer, I had it under #4 as a Cherry Creek enhanced bus/BRT line. I'd love to see a street car to CC and into Glendale, but it's not my highest priority.

[wong21fr]

Personally I don't understand the proverbial hard-on that so many have for a Downtown to CC connection via light rail. Sure you get to CC, but what about the rest of the Speer Leetsdale corridor? That's where the majority of the potential ridership is at and would be far better served via enhanced bus service or BRT, not streetcar or light rail.

[ddvmke]

Originally Posted by The Dirt

....
3) Extension of the Central Corridor Light Rail (funding)
....

Is this just the extension from 30/Downing to 38/Blake, or would this potentially include the neighborhoods north of City Park (Cole/Clayton/Skyland?)

Also, surprised not to see any mention of developing better and more expansive frequent bus service. I've always thought if we could improve this even half as much as Houston did as a result of their initiative that it would be a great way to get people off the road and on transit for very little investment. Speaking of buses, any word on when the modernized transit cards/readers system is going into circulation (swear I heard this was ongoing)?

[Agent Orange]

Agree with ddvmike. I'd like to see a much improved bus system with increased headways along with several actual BRT lines on routes like Speer-Leetsdale and Colfax. The rail can come later, but buses we can do now for a lot less money. I was just in Mexico City where their BRT is no joke. Buses one right after the other, level boarding, covered waiting areas, and completely dedicated lanes all day with plastic barriers. So jelly.

I think eventually a tunnel between the Highlands and Union Station toward Civic Center will be needed. Even now, getting from one side of downtown to the other is a pain (case in point, it's almost faster for me to walk from my place in City Park West to Union Station compared to taking the 20. Almost.) US>CC is the key choke point if we ever have actual intracity mass transit, IMO. It'd be nice to have max one station between US and CC, maybe at Arapahoe. Even now we could start by just using it as a bus tunnel (similar to Seattle) early on, and hopefully add rail in the future.

[TakeFive]

On the spookiest day of the year I guess it's only appropriate that Joanne Pierce writing for Greater Greater Washington would report on Metro's very spooky budget proposal.

On Sunday, WMATA released a preview of its budget proposal for next year. The "Reality Check Budget Plan," as general manager Paul Wiedefeld is calling it, includes less frequent service, higher fares, and employee lay-offs.

The plan also reflects Metro's estimate that next year, ridership will be 20 percent below peak ridership levels in 2009.

Meanwhile in Denver there's this:

B Line From Westminster Turning Out To Be A Big Success
October 30, 2016 - DENVER (CBS4)

When it opened authorities estimated about 800 people would use the route between Union Station and Westminster each week. The number is currently nearly double that with roughly 1,500 weekly riders.

RTD says the B Line is running on time 95 percent of the time.

[Scottk]

Originally Posted by TakeFive

On the spookiest day of the year I guess it's only appropriate that Joanne Pierce writing for Greater Greater Washington would report on Metro's very spooky budget proposal.


Meanwhile in Denver there's this:

B Line From Westminster Turning Out To Be A Big Success
October 30, 2016 - DENVER (CBS4)

1500 weekly riders? Is this in both directions or only 1 way?

If my math is correct this means there is roughly an average of 10 riders per train.


Why even bother building this line if it only goes to Westminster?

[bunt_q]

Originally Posted by Scottk

Why even bother building this line if it only goes to Westminster?

It's the RTD train-to-Boulder equivalent of the European Union starting accession negotiations with Turkey. We all know it'll never get there, but there is value in placating a loud and important neighbor for a while longer.