The Manitoba Provincial Politics Discussion

[Cyro]

He actually speaks,(Pallister), a pleasant surprise, and Bokhar is chiming in as well. Both calling for an election and questioning the legality of Selinger remaining in office. A good day for politics in the Keystone Province.

Progressive Conservatives were reviewing the rules to see if the premier can stay in office and still run in a leadership contest.

Liberal leader Rana Bokhari also said Selinger cannot be premier and at the same time run for leadership of the NDP.

http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/loc...urce=d-tiles-1

[VANRIDERFAN]

Selinger keeps the rebels out of caucus meetings.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...ticle21580001/

[Cyro]

Leg session starts at 110 km/h

Talking about pulling out all the stops.................

Throne Speech...

The fall session will see Manitoba become the first province in Western Canada to offer interest-free student loans, a 110 km/h speed limit on the Trans-Canada Highway to Saskatchewan and increasing the planned Lake Manitoba outlet to 7,500 cfs, according to pledges made in Thursday's speech.

~~~~~~~~~


Highlights

eliminate interest on student loans
apprenticeship for more occupations, outside of current trades
launch a new Credit Transfer Portal
strengthen Manitoba’s primary trade corridor with new flood protection for PTH 75 including the construction of a new, higher bridge at Morris
upgrade the Lake St. Martin Channel and build a new outlet to flow 7,500 cubic feet per second from Lake Manitoba
increase municipal road budget
double funding for municipal bridges
establish a special planning area to support rapid expansion at CentrePort including new CentrePort Canada Rail Park
replace contract employees of CFS with better trained staff for emergency placement shelters
create a new unit for young women with complex needs and more clinical assessments
open new QuickCare Clinics staffed by nurse practitioners in northwest Winnipeg, St. Vital and Southdale and finalize west Winnipeg location
hire dozens of primary care professionals, including nurse practitioners in every region of the province
launch a new program at RRC to train advanced care paramedics to start emergency medical interventions before patients arrive at ER
make the pilot Emergency Paramedic in the Community program permanent
emergency room at Grace Hospital
establish a new cancer hub for Winnipeg
Urgent Cancer Care Clinic
work with First Nations to address the proposed elimination of the federal government’s band constable program
1,000 more social and affordable housing units
reduce the office space used by government by over 100,000 sq. ft.
major restructuring of internal services
reduce the size of the civil service by 600 through retirements and attrition
require contractors to provide guaranteed quotes
require veterinarians to provide all-in pricing
help homebuyers ID previous grow-ops
create a new independent energy efficiency agency to expand opportunities for all Manitobans to lower their energy bills

Wow..Continued....

http://www.winnipegsun.com/2014/11/2...this-afternoon

[Simplicity]

Originally Posted by Cyro

Leg session starts at 110 km/h

Talking about pulling out all the stops.................

Throne Speech...

The fall session will see Manitoba become the first province in Western Canada to offer interest-free student loans, a 110 km/h speed limit on the Trans-Canada Highway to Saskatchewan and increasing the planned Lake Manitoba outlet to 7,500 cfs, according to pledges made in Thursday's speech.

~~~~~~~~~


Highlights

eliminate interest on student loans
apprenticeship for more occupations, outside of current trades
launch a new Credit Transfer Portal
strengthen Manitoba’s primary trade corridor with new flood protection for PTH 75 including the construction of a new, higher bridge at Morris
upgrade the Lake St. Martin Channel and build a new outlet to flow 7,500 cubic feet per second from Lake Manitoba
increase municipal road budget
double funding for municipal bridges
establish a special planning area to support rapid expansion at CentrePort including new CentrePort Canada Rail Park
replace contract employees of CFS with better trained staff for emergency placement shelters
create a new unit for young women with complex needs and more clinical assessments
open new QuickCare Clinics staffed by nurse practitioners in northwest Winnipeg, St. Vital and Southdale and finalize west Winnipeg location
hire dozens of primary care professionals, including nurse practitioners in every region of the province
launch a new program at RRC to train advanced care paramedics to start emergency medical interventions before patients arrive at ER
make the pilot Emergency Paramedic in the Community program permanent
emergency room at Grace Hospital
establish a new cancer hub for Winnipeg
Urgent Cancer Care Clinic
work with First Nations to address the proposed elimination of the federal government’s band constable program
1,000 more social and affordable housing units
reduce the office space used by government by over 100,000 sq. ft.
major restructuring of internal services
reduce the size of the civil service by 600 through retirements and attrition
require contractors to provide guaranteed quotes
require veterinarians to provide all-in pricing
help homebuyers ID previous grow-ops
create a new independent energy efficiency agency to expand opportunities for all Manitobans to lower their energy bills

Wow..Continued....

http://www.winnipegsun.com/2014/11/2...this-afternoon

This guaranteed quote shit is hilarious. Are contractors going to be allowed to come into the house and tear open the walls before you begin to negotiate?

Not that anybody exposes their clueless incompetence better than the NDP, but is there even any thought going into the nuance behind their policy development anymore? All government regulation has consequences; most of them unintended. And ultimately, most of them to the detriment of the very people they're trying to protect.

Nobody but the service provider benefits from the gouging that's required of contractors to ensure you're paying for every single conceivable scenario in the event one of them will occur. The same goes for veterinary care.

[Cyro]

Originally Posted by Simplicity

This guaranteed quote shit is hilarious. Are contractors going to be allowed to come into the house and tear open the walls before you begin to negotiate?

Not that anybody exposes their clueless incompetence better than the NDP, but is there even any thought going into the nuance behind their policy development anymore? All government regulation has consequences; most of them unintended. And ultimately, most of them to the detriment of the very people they're trying to protect.

Nobody but the service provider benefits from the gouging that's required of contractors to ensure you're paying for every single conceivable scenario in the event one of them will occur. The same goes for veterinary care.

Guaranteed quotes is a ridiculous pledge similar to those for Veterinarians, both assume all can be known ie: structurally and internally, upon a cursory examination of the building or patient - (animal).

Maybe the policy makers with the NDP should be sent on a few pre-reno estimate calls or sit in front of a TV and watch a few renovation shows on HGTV as well. Send them to a few veterinary examinations and predict the ailment and guarantee the cost?

The numerous contractors I've worked for and the 100's of animals I've dealt with tell me it's next to impossible to predict.

[Simplicity]

Originally Posted by Cyro

Guaranteed quotes is a ridiculous pledge similar to those for Veterinarians, both assume all can be known ie: structurally and internally, upon a cursory examination of the building or patient - (animal).

Maybe the policy makers with the NDP should be sent on a few pre-reno estimate calls or sit in front of a TV and watch a few renovation shows on HGTV as well. Send them to a few veterinary examinations and predict the ailment and guarantee the cost?

The numerous contractors I've worked for and the 100's of animals I've dealt with tell me it's next to impossible to predict.

The ineptitude is really just staggering. And it isn't that these people are dumb, because they're not; they're just clueless while displaying an extraordinary aversion to common sense. And that goes all the way through the ranks - NDP policy advisors, affiliated bureaucrats, and the politicians themselves. Talk to any member of the NDP organization and you get the sense that they're not even quite certain whether there's a world out there of people and professions that aren't immediately related to government; like they're all just institutionalized enough that they can't quite believe there's anything that doesn't require their intervention. At that point, they'll then tell you how it absolutely does.

And this is why our province is where it is; the idea that money doesn't equate value and that spending one doesn't necessarily beget the other is a concept they devote nearly the entirety of their resources trying to disavow.

[biguc]

Woah. That's a rule for all contractors and not just those dealing with the government? That's just stupid.

[Simplicity]

Originally Posted by biguc

Woah. That's a rule for all contractors and not just those dealing with the government? That's just stupid.

It wouldn't really matter if the government wanted a guaranteed fixed bid on their contracts either, there are only so many jobs where those structures are appropriate. If you're doing new work and all the engineering is air-tight, then that's a possibility. But anything that's remedial, restorative, or renovation is mostly not suited to those deals. And all that happens in those scenarios where the contract doesn't explicitly lay out the way in which either a change order or additional work is handled (usually by the contractor, with the prime consultant negotiating a price for the work or everybody agreeing to cost-plus upfront), the work will just cease and it'll hit the courts.

And I'm not sure that's what the province is interested in, so why even legislate other than for meaningless optics? The government already tries to go with stipulated price or GMP where they can, but it's not always possible.

[The Unknown Poster]

I suppose it depends how the rule is enacted. if I take my car to my mechanic, he gives me a quote before performing work. If something else arises during that work, he calls me back to discuss and get approval to continue.

The spirit of the rule is good but personally I do research before hiring someone. If they get good reviews and referrals, great.

[bomberjet]

Originally Posted by The Unknown Poster

I suppose it depends how the rule is enacted. if I take my car to my mechanic, he gives me a quote before performing work. If something else arises during that work, he calls me back to discuss and get approval to continue.

This is what already happens anyways, or at least it should be. I could see this being tough on the housing front, as others have said. It's a guaranteed price, until you open up the wall and realize you now need to give a new guaranteed price. Again, which should be happening already.

[esquire]

I'd expect such a measure to deal with more of the garden-variety sort of home maintenance stuff where scam artists can try to fleece unsuspecting homeowners with various types of bait and switch, not so much the complicated construction jobs.

[Simplicity]

Originally Posted by esquire

I'd expect such a measure to deal with more of the garden-variety sort of home maintenance stuff where scam artists can try to fleece unsuspecting homeowners with various types of bait and switch, not so much the complicated construction jobs.

Sure, but most of this stuff is happening when you have a cheap customer and and a fly-by-night contractor working at a discount on a cash basis. There's no recourse for that.

And if things are above board, the same remedy is going to exist that already does, which is the courts. It doesn't matter if the job is fixed bid or not; if a contractor finds something down the line that cripples his ability to do the job at the quoted cost, he'll just stop the work and let the courts sort it out. He isn't going to just lose thousands upon thousands of dollars because the customer has a price for a different scope in writing.

I get that everybody thinks it's good optics, but it's impossible to enforce and it's a waste of legislative time and effort.

[Danny D Oh]

I've found the new rules governing vehicle repairs to be pretty effective and functional. My assumption (basically all you can do with a throne speech) is they are doing the same thing with home reno/repair type stuff, and I don't see the issue with it.

[Simplicity]

Originally Posted by Danny D Oh

I've found the new rules governing vehicle repairs to be pretty effective and functional. My assumption (basically all you can do with a throne speech) is they are doing the same thing with home reno/repair type stuff, and I don't see the issue with it.

The differences are what matter. The mechanic legislation says that you have to give a written estimate for all work over a $100 and come within 10% for both parts and labour. And there's really nothing difficult about that because an alternator is an alternator. And a battery is a battery and so forth. You're doing a job that requires a fixed amount of time. What isn't free is the estimation of everything and that's, in a lot of cases, where the real money is spent. If you're diagnosing a problem, it could take you many more hours than the fix. Per the legislation, all the mechanic has to disclose is either the set fee or the hourly rate and he's off to the races. If it takes him 2 hours or 10, there's still no protection from this. And that's because it's impossible.

And the same thing will happen with home contractors. There's no limit on how much one has to take apart or how many hours it will take them to do it because it's impossible to know; you only know when you've found the problem. So once it's been identified, they're going to have to give you a price to fix it - which already happens anyway. Except now, when they find something else or something goes awry during the fix, they'll have to stop the work, prepare another contract and so forth. And that's not even a bad thing, but it also changes nothing, because you're gonna have the same argument and the contractor's going to slap the same lien on the joint and you're still gonna go to court to figure out whether it's yours or the contractor's problem whether that new issue was yours or his.

This is really my point. It's just legislating for the sake of legislating. And all that required conformity does nothing to protect consumers and everything to cost them more money because reasonable people already have contracts and cheap people looking for a cash deal never will.

[Cyro]

Tories introduce non-confidence motion

Tory Leader Brian Pallister will introduce a non-confidence motion on Monday afternoon and believes he can get enough support from dissident NDP members to get it passed.

Appearing at a press conference to announce the waiving of provincial interest on student loans, Selinger quickly shot down any discussion about Pallister’s motion.


http://www.winnipegsun.com/2014/11/2...fidence-motion

I'm beggining to enjoy this. Let's see where this goes?

[Cyro]

I realize this is the last thing posters want to here on Christmas Eve. but my god..please make it stop...

Seeking the leadership of the party that brought Manitobans a PST increase, Steve Ashton now says he would bring a referendum to voters on the contentious issue.

Ashton, officially launching his campaign to run for the leadership of the NDP, revealed on Tuesday he supports the PST hike, but disagreed with how it was thrust upon Manitobans.

“So I’m going to talk about the elephant in the room and tell you right now: If I’m elected premier, one of the first moves that I will make is to allow Manitobans to have their voice through a referendum on the PST,” Ashton said.

Source

[esquire]

SELINGER WINS!!!

with 50.9% of the vote!

Love him or hate him, you have to respect the fact that he staved off an internal revolt that would have ended the career of almost any other politician. Of course, re-winning the NDP leadership will be child's play compared to what's in store for him during the next provincial election.

[Danny D Oh]

The worst result possible for the NDP. Selinger wins with basically no margin. He'll lose his most experienced cabinet ministers heading into the next election along with many of the organizers and operatives who did the legwork for the NDP dynasty. Basically no chance for the NDP to win a majority in the next election.

[blueandgoldguy]

I wonder if any of those opposed to Selinger will consider jumping ship to the Liberals. They are obviously the longest of longshots to win any provincial election but they could very well win their ridings on name recognition and past performance (assuming they represented their respective areas well).

This is great news for the Conservatives. The leader of the NDP, regarded by many both inside and outside his own party as incompetent wins the leadership race by the slimmest of margins. View from the undecided in the public will be more of the same old same old with Selinger back in charge. Pallister's election to lose imo.

[Danny D Oh]

Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy

I wonder if any of those opposed to Selinger will consider jumping ship to the Liberals. They are obviously the longest of longshots to win any provincial election but they could very well win their ridings on name recognition and past performance (assuming they represented their respective areas well).

Federal Liberals and NDP already have scooped a lot of the operatives, wouldn't be surprised to see some of the current cabinet run federally. The provincial Liberal party is so far gone and has no money.